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1. I just read in another post Dr H's two year rule for the As. It's gonna be two years in November, but it's 6 months since DDay. Do I really need a long or a short plan B? I am going to do it for me and maybe I like it and keep it forever but what's the plan?
2. The nanny COULD be my IM because she is a BW too and by the things she is telling me she made everything wrong after D Day. She can easily see herself as a warrior for me. I WOULD prefer someone else like a friend but Indie said he should be neutral. How do you find neutral ones?
3. Most people return close to parents after D and I am also trying to, but I don't see that happening. We had difficulties in organizing parenting time due to job schedules when we were together, so with D it seemed almost impossible to do alone. I know, I have to spend money on Nannys to have my peace of mind and not rely on him for emergencies. Have you try gardening a huge garden all alone?
4. Should I be very rigid? If he asks to get her for 3 days instead of 2 to take her to my MIL do I accept? I will not, not because of rigidity but because she has to move her a.. and travel here instead of waiting for my little girl to be taken to her as she has always done. She has to face the new reality here, new house, new sports car etc as she was almost an enabler..
5. Once more: my D papers are coming anyday now and I was going to ask him if he is willing to accept a paragraph about not having OW in front of DD. Do you think it's the lawyers Job? My lawyer didn't want to do it, but I could insist. OR I could accept his word (...) Regarding Item 5, you don't rely on people's verbal assurances; we rely on written agreements. If the OW is not dangerous then there is no reason to keep the child from her. Is she dangerous? Is she a drug addict or alcoholic? Is there a GAL in this case?
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And you are completely, 100% sure that I should quit snooping? Because apart from the upsetting part, It can help me let go... Divorce is WAR. In war you need intelligence on your enemy. Yes, your husband is your enemy during this process. Continue snooping but make sure it's legal. You don't want illegal spying brought up in family court
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Go to the Parallel Parenting thread in Notable Posts.
There is a link to a parallel parenting custody agreement that can be used in your custody case.
I encourage you to print it out and give it to your attorney
Have you done a background check on your husbands girlfriend? If not do so asap
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apart from the upsetting part,. As it is you will be spending months processing what you already know. One day, you will wake up having heard nothing of him for ages and you will feel totally removed and detached. The brain gives up pursuit of a topic when It isn't being fed information. But the same applies to him, right? The main part of Plan B is to protect you. Get you well and healed and prevent you from becoming a burned out wreck. He prob will not protect himself in the same way and will either hear snippets of how you're doing or he will just retain the Plan A memory.. Plus he is making horrible choices so Plan B gives him fair warning of what his choices really mean in practice.
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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Is there a GAL in this case? She's in Greece, HD.
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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You are in Greece?
Are you a member of the Orthodox Church?
Have you spoken to your Bishop about this affair?
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Yes I am orthodox but WH is a declared atheist
Me: BW, 41
WH: 46
Married 7 years, together 12
DD: 5
OW: 39
D-Day: 11 April
Plan B since 10/3/12
Divorced 11/12
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Yes I am orthodox but WH is a declared atheist Were you married in the church? Or civil? Was he always atheist or just recently converted to atheist? Irregardless I hope you are sharing your story with your Priest and going to Church for the Eucharist.
Last edited by HDW; 10/03/12 07:13 AM.
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Yes we did marry in the church, but in another city. I am not in touch with the good priest that married us unfortunately. WH has always been an agnosticist, he never believed. We had a lot of discussions at first that annoyed me with his complete ignorance. Maybe that should have been a flag. Although in this site I have seen so many church people do the same thing.
Me: BW, 41
WH: 46
Married 7 years, together 12
DD: 5
OW: 39
D-Day: 11 April
Plan B since 10/3/12
Divorced 11/12
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Today I had some dangerous thoughts about the plans. Please think about it and tell me what do you think.
I was thinking that they are amazing plans, based on psychology. But I am Meditterenean and we have a somehow different psychological construction . What if the plans, especially plan B applies most to aglosaxons? We are considered more straightforward, more open and more impulsive than the Northern people.
For example I did some things during plan A that even though they are considered AO they had some results. I slapped him in the face on two occasions, one of them very hard! He didn't mind and came closer to me afterwards.
Me: BW, 41
WH: 46
Married 7 years, together 12
DD: 5
OW: 39
D-Day: 11 April
Plan B since 10/3/12
Divorced 11/12
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You are no different than other people. The plans are the plans, they must be worked or they won't work. We have people all over the world on these plans.
One year becomes two, two years becomes five, five becomes ten and before you know it, you've wasted your whole life on a problem you can't solve. That's one way to spend your life. -rwinger
I will not spend my life this way.
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Today I had some dangerous thoughts about the plans. Please think about it and tell me what do you think.
I was thinking that they are amazing plans, based on psychology. But I am Meditterenean and we have a somehow different psychological construction . What if the plans, especially plan B applies most to aglosaxons? We are considered more straightforward, more open and more impulsive than the Northern people.
For example I did some things during plan A that even though they are considered AO they had some results. I slapped him in the face on two occasions, one of them very hard! He didn't mind and came closer to me afterwards. But it was the wayward who came closer to you, not your husband. Your husband is still locked in the wayward mindset. The wayward LOVES anger and is encouraged and grows stronger by it. His waywardness will have felt happy and in control to see you so lost and unhappy and out of control. Many waywards try to purposefully provoke anger On the other hand, if a wayward sees you being calm and firm, that will scare the crap out of him. Because then he knows you will insist on change and that you have to make a choice . It won't make you popular, but that isn't what Plan A is. Temporary periods of him coming close to you should not be counted as successes. Waywards just do this to keep you on the hook, jerk around your hopes and to make you too exhausted to stand firm and think what's right. That's how he got you to propose a threesome! Its better for him to feel frightened of you leaving him and generally unhappy if it achieves NC. Nothing he says or does is a success unless he agress NC. He won't feel love until q a few weeks of withdrawal following NC. People all over the world marry with the intention to be faithful and yet end up having affairs. That's because love is an international language with the same flaws and strengths everywhere.
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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To lighten this thread:
Has anyone seen the movie "Serious moonlight" staring Meg Ryan? What do you think of her method? A shock that can achieve only a FR perhaps?
Me: BW, 41
WH: 46
Married 7 years, together 12
DD: 5
OW: 39
D-Day: 11 April
Plan B since 10/3/12
Divorced 11/12
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I haven't seen the movie.
But I know what you refer to in the difference between Europeans and Mediterranean culture.
I think you made a mistake in marrying an atheist. Did he have to convert and be baptized to be married? I thought the Church would not marry atheists.
I think the psychology is a little different but it has the same effect. It is a basic human need to be loved. In plan B you take love away from him.
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Nowadays Church has loosen its standards. Nobody asked him if he believes . He was all right with pretending when he took his vows because he is so confused. BUT when I said to my DD among other things that he betrayed his oath to God that he gave in church THEN he was furious. He told me " how can I explain to her that I took NO oath?"!
Me: BW, 41
WH: 46
Married 7 years, together 12
DD: 5
OW: 39
D-Day: 11 April
Plan B since 10/3/12
Divorced 11/12
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I think the psychology is a little different but it has the same effect. It is a basic human need to be loved. In plan B you take love away from him. How do you take away love when you send a love letter? I sent it anyway but it sure wasn't my impulse to do it.
Me: BW, 41
WH: 46
Married 7 years, together 12
DD: 5
OW: 39
D-Day: 11 April
Plan B since 10/3/12
Divorced 11/12
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Nowadays Church has loosen its standards. Nobody asked him if he believes . He was all right with pretending when he took his vows because he is so confused. BUT when I said to my DD among other things that he betrayed his oath to God that he gave in church THEN he was furious. He told me " how can I explain to her that I took NO oath?"! I am very surprised that they married an unbeliever. It is a very good thing that you told your daughter. It is important that children know the love of God. When you take your daughter to Church and teach her the Bible stories and show her the icons then she learns of the ever presence of God. My wife left my three children and they have found much support from our Church. About 90% of the Greek population belongs to the Church. Is not your husband shunned by his friends for his adultery?
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I think the psychology is a little different but it has the same effect. It is a basic human need to be loved. In plan B you take love away from him. How do you take away love when you send a love letter? I sent it anyway but it sure wasn't my impulse to do it. You are not taking away Agape love. But you take away Eros, philia, storge. So he has to receive Eros love from his girlfriend. Not from you. No kind words from you, no smile, no joy from you. He can only have the memory of love and sometimes in plan B he says, I miss the memory. I want to go back home.
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I think the psychology is a little different but it has the same effect. It is a basic human need to be loved. In plan B you take love away from him. How do you take away love when you send a love letter? I sent it anyway but it sure wasn't my impulse to do it. So, to avoid an indefinite period of suffering while a wayward spouse vacillates between spouse and lover, and to avoid rewarding the selfish behavior of having needs met by both spouse and lover, if plan A does not work within a reasonable period of time, I recommend plan B.
Plan B is for the betrayed spouse to avoid all contact with the wayward spouse until the affair has completely ended and the wayward spouse has agreed to my plan for recovery. In many cases, once an affair has ended, a betrayed spouse makes the mistake of taking the wayward spouse back before an agreement is made regarding marital recovery. This leads to a return to all the conditions that made the affair possible -- love is not restored, resentment is not overcome, and there is a very great risk for another affair. Without agreement and subsequent implementation of a plan for recovery, the betrayed spouse is better off continuing with plan B.
FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.
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Me: BW, 41
WH: 46
Married 7 years, together 12
DD: 5
OW: 39
D-Day: 11 April
Plan B since 10/3/12
Divorced 11/12
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