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#2660745 09/01/12 12:19 AM
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nesre Offline OP
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Hey all!

Thought it was time to move out of SAA and get caught up with where I am today.

Posted a few days ago on SAA and just did not seem right there. Have been reading here and learning new stuff I had not seen over there. Probably fits better with where I am at now.

I copied my last update which includes a quick summary of D and a recap of some of the highlights of the last year. Sorry the post is so long and goes off on tangents.


Quote
Just an update. Didn�t realize how long it had been since I posted to my own thread.

To recap:
I was married to an alcoholic wayward who kept going back to �Baldo�-the neighbor just down the road.
Stumbled around here for 3 years or so. Totally engulfed in all the ongoing drama of living with an active alcoholic/WW. Also started going to Al-Anon. Finally officially exposed her A in feb2010 with hand written letters to all who I thought could help or influence. The situation went from ugly to worse. DD and I moved out for 5 months. I was in plan B but DD kept contact. DD moved back to the M home because she �missed her friends�. I went back one week later and walked right back into the middle of what I left. WW kept drinking and seeing Baldo. Filed for D in sept 2010. Drug the D out about as long as I could. Tried to give WW a chance to sober up and quit the A. For the last several months lived detached from the WW in the same house. No chance that R was going to happen as long as she was drinking. D final in May 2011.
XWW is still drinking. Got a felony DUI, lost her good paying job and is still seeing Baldo buts its now OK since she is D�d. OK�.

Ds and Dd say they can�t stand to be around her because all she does is b ! tch about me. Still to this day. I have had no contact with her since early nov2011 when I had to transfer a car title over and wanted to make sure it was totally out of my name and paid off.


I took a voluntary lay off from work Jan/feb. Went fishing for 3 weeks straight and no I did not get sick of it because I caught fish every day. It was nice to give fish away to my family and elderly people who really enjoy them. Even got my Dad to the fish house twice since I could park about 5 feet away from the door. He is 80 now and it was nice to have a good time with him.

ADD-->Started going out with Ruby August 1.

Went to Uganda in feb 2012 w/Ruby. The plan was to visit/tour somewhat/orphanage/life and then travel back with Rubys friend who was supposed to be performing business for the orphanage. We stayed with a pastor (orphanages director) at his house for 8 days in one of the largest slums in the country-Natetee which is on the edge of the capital city of Campalla. The country terrain is extremely beautiful with rolling hills and picturesque landscape. Natetee where we stayed was poverty stricken, filthy and ugly. New government in 2006. That is a whole other subject. We took about 900 pictures between the 2 of us.

It did not take either of us long to know the situation in the house there was not right. There was big time friction going on within the house. We did not have the truth of the story while there but the pieces made sense and the truth came out after we were back. We made the best of the trip and our time together. I won�t go into details but certain people could come here and post. We will just leave it at that.

Ruby and I got along very well on the trip. This was the first time we really were with each other pretty much 24/7. At home here we live 65 miles apart so getting together during the week is hard to do.

DD now 19 is still living with XWW. She has taken some wrong turns and got herself into trouble with the law back in Oct 2011. This first time she received a slap on the wrists. Just like her old man she is a hard learner. She got into trouble again in May 2012. This time is bigger and there is no defense. The �fixer� in me wants to try and rescue. I know that is not in my or her best interest. She needs to work through the consequences on her own and learn the lessons first hand. My �NO� and �I am not willing to do that for you� are very strong at this point. If I rob her of her experience and try to alter her story then I have sinned. Consequences and letting her decide her best course are best at this point.

1st year D anniversary came and went. Thought it would be tough but when I sat down and really thought about it I received exactly what the purpose of the MB�s plans try to achieve when followed. Implementing other suggestions from the few posters who followed me helped immensely even when off the MB�s track. Thank you!

Personal recovery. No more head spinning and endless drama that never seems to end because a new day brings a new crisis. Thank you MB's!

What comes to mind now is peaceful thoughts and very little drama. Took a while to get here. The 2 cats don�t give me too much crap- except in the box. Work has been good. Financially for now I am stable. The R with Ruby is good although I feel the need to date some other woman.

On another thread in the dating after D forum one of the posters said they wish the person they were seeing would screw up so they had a reason to break up and date someone else. I feel that way since Ruby is the first person I dated after the D was final. She is a good christian woman with strong morals and very good boundaries. We meet each others needs very well except for SF and we are short on UA time with distance. We are not going further with SF based on our commitment to what the Bible says.

The question I have is am I only staying with her as she is the first I have dated and the first woman who treats me very good?

We both would need to alter our lives drastically to take this relationship further. At our ages and where we are at with our careers neither of us wants to commute. She has a very nice home already and does not appear to want to give it up nor have we seriously discussed it. One of us would have to sacrifice to make this work now.

I feel like I am stuck as a renter right now and willing to give no more. Ruby is not pushing for anything more right now although there is a lot of alone time between seeing each other right now.

I have read about the contrast affect and dating 30 people. I don�t want to loose a good relationship and risk loosing her forever but also I am not sure about turning into a buyer with my very first relationship since D either.

Any thoughts would be welcome. Does what I talked about above make a difference because of our ages and where we are at with work commitments? It is not like either of us can start over and make a fairly sucessful career at this point as our ages are age 53/55. Nor do either of us want to drive 2 1/2 hours every day. Does the contrast affect make a difference with age or do the choices become more limited? Also at our ages good partners appear t be hard to come by. Most of us get very set in our ways.

Maybe this should be posted in the dating after D forum?

nESRE

Last edited by nesre; 09/01/12 12:32 AM.

M 29 yrs
DS 28 DD 18
Me 53 FWH FBS
MTA signed 5/11/2011
D final 5/16/2011

Free.... and going wherever the big guy wants me to go......
nesre #2660746 09/01/12 12:22 AM
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nesre Offline OP
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Originally Posted by HoldHerHand
Contrast effect... hmmm...

Well.


If you were previously married to an alligator with Aids, all the next person has to do to be better than the previous is not try to eat you, and not give you Aids.

That would be contrast.

You haven't been divorced for very long, and you have the integrity to maintain your relationship based on your beliefs... and both of you hold to that.

That's a pretty good sign, IMO.


Is there any rush?


Also, you have yourself in a spot where you can practice a foundational MB principal; Radical Honesty.


Be Radically Honest - tell her your thoughts; I care for you, but I would like to date other people (of course this is simplified).


Truth be told, ending any relationship is never going to be easy. No matter if it's the first person you have dated since divorcing, or the 10th. You are giving something up that has brought you joy.

Maintain your integrity, sir.


M 29 yrs
DS 28 DD 18
Me 53 FWH FBS
MTA signed 5/11/2011
D final 5/16/2011

Free.... and going wherever the big guy wants me to go......
nesre #2660747 09/01/12 12:27 AM
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nesre Offline OP
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HHH

Thanks for the response.

Quote
Quote:If you were previously married to an alligator with Aids, all the next person has to do to be better than the previous is not try to eat you, and not give you Aids.

That would be contrast.



When I really stop and think about dating the first person so soon after the D I realized life was such a mess until we sold the house and I could truely go into Plan B. My guages were soooo off from living with an active alcoholic/WW.

There is way more to this story.


Quote
Quote:You haven't been divorced for very long, and you have the integrity to maintain your relationship based on your beliefs... and both of you hold to that.

That's a pretty good sign, IMO.


Is there any rush?



There is no rush from either of us. I was not sure when our R started out that a good woman like her existed that walks the talk and lives it. I know myself I am a one woman at a time kind of guy and am not sure at this point that this was in my best interest to become exclusive with her especially so soon after the D. (About 3 months after.)

Sha also had not dated since her H died 3 years ago and I am her first.


Quote
Quote:Truth be told, ending any relationship is never going to be easy. No matter if it's the first person you have dated since divorcing, or the 10th. You are giving something up that has brought you joy.



Truth be told by nESRE I went back to try and find the post I was reading and I could not find it. I may have been wrong. I think I read it wrong (was late night) or took the writers words out of context. Also as I said above there is way more to this story but in the last 3 weeks or so I just find I will not proceed further with this R. I need to work this out. Being honest here I would like to take the easy road and should SHE screw up big time then it would be easy for me. I do not see her screwing up big time. RH---> The answer is nESRE owning this.


Quote
Quote:Maintain your integrity, sir.


I totally agree and intend to with RH.


I am going to move over to the ADDRForum and let this die here. The SAA has been good but this would be a better fit with where I am personally at now in my life. Also seems to be more traffic with people in the same situations also trying to work out new relationships/dating after D.

nESRE


M 29 yrs
DS 28 DD 18
Me 53 FWH FBS
MTA signed 5/11/2011
D final 5/16/2011

Free.... and going wherever the big guy wants me to go......
nesre #2673755 10/12/12 11:41 PM
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nesre Offline OP
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Been a while so I need to update.

May be the worst or could be the best decision I have made but I ended the exclusive R with Ruby on 9/30. I was RH with her about my feelings that I could go no further in our R as it was.

I was very gentle with her when we talked.
Plain and simple when I thought about the future all I could hear in my head was you have unfinished business to do. Alone. You have avoided unfinished business for long enough.
When we met I was fully D'd 2 months. I was still settling business from the D. Selling the house and still quite a bit of contact from the XWW.
It was too soon for me to get into an exclusive R. Once we met I was so blown away immediatley by the way she met my needs-and so easily. I was blown away that I also could seem to meet hers with ease. Something I was told often I could not do in M. Listened and believed the WW alky too much.
I need to be totally alone for a bit and explore me. I went from being M'd to exclusive R. I know I am not out of the buyers mindset. Not 100% sure I really went through the stages of grief. Just replaced p poor R with a better one.

Also what really got me to thinking was her 2nd to the youngest grandchild. When I saw him last he called me grandpa several times. Our R was a larger circle than just Ruby and I. I am just not ready.

From knowing Ruby so long I could see she was hurt though she said she understood. I have never experienced a Christ centered R before and we prayed before we parted.

All I want to do is be alone. In nature-out in the woods-or by the river. Have walked miles over the past few weekends. Found a 1lb 5ounce Lake Superior agate. I live 140 miles from Lake Superior. Some people search a whole lifetime and never find one that big.
Been within a few feet of beavers-not knowing there were still any left around the area I live. Scares the crap out of you when they slap there tail on the water a few feet away from you and dive away.
Had a buck deer snort at me across the river last week. Did not know it but got in between him and the doe he was following. Really seemed to upset him. Been walking in places even the deer don't like to go unless they are spooked and have no other choice.

This was the kind of stuff I experienced as a kid and never thought anything of it. We lived in a semi-remote area. This kind of stuff happened all the time. Not had this happen in many years.

I lost me in the M through my co-dependancy a long time ago. Went to the next R. I am still lost. X appears to be totally out of the picture. Now is comes down to me.

Heres the plan:
Date 29 more. Do not get exclusive. Take time and explore nESRE.

I like simple. May not be easy to do since I have never dated 30 woman total in my whole life.

Question
Do these need to be dates in person? Going out? I have not dated in over 32 years. What do you consider a date today? Does a long deep chat on-line or telephone count? Does just meeting for coffee at Starbucks count? Any thoughts on this with how technology has changed?

nESRE

nesre #2673762 10/13/12 03:45 AM
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Hi nESRE, good to meet you. I don't hang out in the SAA forum, and I'm sorry you had to live in that world for a while. I'm roughly your age, was married almost as long as you, and just like you, got into an exclusive relationship too early, which I broke off in July.

How do you feel about Ruby? Do you still contact her as a friend? Or did you decide no contact was best.

Regarding your question, I'm sort of like you in not knowing how to implement the date-30-people rule. A few thoughts I've had about that:
  • It may be more applicable to younger people who don't have a good understanding of their needs.
  • I have a hard time casually dating several different people. When I meet someone I like, I enjoy exploring the relationship.
  • When Dr. Harley used the 30 people rule in the dating service he once operated, he suggested 30 people in one year.
  • That sounds like a full-time job to me; I'd have trouble dating 5 people in a year because of the way I like to explore relationships.
If you're like me, I'm sure you have 2nd thoughts about Ruby. She sounds like a fine woman. If I were in your shoes, I'd start dating soon to find out what's out there and how they compare to Ruby.

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Hey KL. Have read your thread and seen other posts from you. Thanks for the e-mail to Dr H on the other thread.



Quote
How do you feel about Ruby? Do you still contact her as a friend? Or did you decide no contact was best.

This relationship was different for me. From what I witnessed many times was a woman who lives the christian life, Knows her Bible, studies regularly, is involved in church, would unselfishly share what she had if she truely felt a calling to. Very educated yet warm and down to earth. I never felt talked down to. Respectful in our R from a Biblical standpoint-believes God-Man-Woman-Family-Others. Very much believes a man is the leader of the family and household. Much like what is described in the book Tender Warrior.

This just blew me away throughout our whole relationship. About 5 years ago I went back to church. This was nearing the end of my M. I would hear the pastor referance things like this about M'd people but with the deep doo doo I was in could not even fathom anyone really living that way.

I really grew to love and respect her for upholding what she believes in. Our conversations would run deep on just about any subject. Sexual abstinance was agreed upon using what the Bible says. Even without the sexual aspect of the R in my whole life the only experience that out did the intamacy I experienced with Ruby was witnessing the birth of my son and daughter with XW.

Ruby took me to a new level of intamacy that was definately lacking in my M.

Over the past year I still see my IC. She worked under Dr H for 7 years and is very familiar with MB's principles. She has kept cautioning me about going to fast. Going too far and the affect of our R to surrounding family and friends. When her grandchild started calling me grandpa this really hit home. Even this 4 year old was being affected. I know adults can deal with R but how do young children. nESRE either s..t or get off the pot.

Even with all we experienced throughout the last year I have to see and experience if there are more out there similar to Ruby. Until I do that (and also some self reflection) I know I would always wonder and second guess. I know when I truely decide to M again I do not want any reservations or lingering doubts present.

At this point we are having no real contact. I had some large items (boat/fish house) at her house. We agreed to times as to pick them up. She did not want to be there. Today I got the last item and along with it was every item I gave her over the last year. A necklace/watch/a painting she had always admired/ cards/letters/every small item I ever gave her.

The note on the box
nESRE
If God means for any of these things to come back to me...they will...differently.
Otherwise it was never meant to be.
Be safe (referance to me from earlier in the R when I would not say ILY to her)
Giving your last year back to you...Your choice to do with it what you want...
God Bless
Ruby


I never asked her for anything back and actually at this time feel somewhat offended. I gave these items from how/what I felt at the time. Does this mean my feelings can be discounted and were not real at the time of giving? A bit confused by this. I understand her being hurt and not wanting reminders. Does our time together mean nothing good happened?
Maybe a female POV on this?

At this point I am leaning on very limited contact for a while. We live 60 miles apart so in person running into each other probably won't happen.



Quote
Regarding your question, I'm sort of like you in not knowing how to implement the date-30-people rule. A few thoughts I've had about that:


With second marriages we probably do know more about needs compared to younger first marriages. 30 people in a year would be extremely hard for me also although should a person really be motivated to get married again probably way more motivation. If it was set as a goal probably easily achievable.


Quote
I have a hard time casually dating several different people. When I meet someone I like, I enjoy exploring the relationship.

I know from before M casually dating was hard. I to would get hung up and explore. This time I will be open and honest with any I date right from the get go that I will be dating others.



Quote
If you're like me, I'm sure you have 2nd thoughts about Ruby. She sounds like a fine woman. If I were in your shoes, I'd start dating soon to find out what's out there and how they compare to Ruby.


Ruby is a very good woman. Second guessing is what kept me from breaking it off for about a month. What if she is "the one" and I let her go?

nESRE

Last edited by nesre; 10/13/12 11:45 PM. Reason: t/o
nesre #2673928 10/14/12 07:10 AM
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The way you describe Ruby, wow that must've been very difficult to break up with her. I had a similarly tough time breaking off my first relationship after divorce, although it was for a different reason. And just like in your case, my exGF gave back a bunch of cards, pictures, etc that I had given her. I still have them, and I'm not sure if I should keep or not.

Ruby's note to you may hold the answer: if it's meant to be, those things will come back to her, differently. She sounds like a very wise woman.

Good luck with your new dating experiences

nesre #2679168 11/02/12 05:53 PM
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Hey nesre,

I hope all is well for you and you see my flare I'm sending you. Could you stop by workit's thread in recovery? She is putting together her conditions for her WH before she enters Plan B. He is an alcoholic whom is in AA and fell off the wagon in Sept. I was hoping since you have experience with an alcoholic WXW you could give some pointers.

Thank you in advance.
workit's thread


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.




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