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gotcha! smile I was really scratching my head on that one!


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Melody thanks for your great insight on this and suggestions as well smile I definitely think this is a great topic on situations where fufulling an EN for one becomes a LB for the other and then vice versa

I was using the POJA on the website really rather than specific book.


BH
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Originally Posted by dotnetdave
Melody thanks for your great insight on this and suggestions as well smile I definitely think this is a great topic on situations where fufulling an EN for one becomes a LB for the other and then vice versa

That is a pretty simple one to answer if you understand the basic principles of the POJA. You don't commit lovebusters, period. If it is a lovebuster, it is off the table.

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I was using the POJA on the website really rather than specific book.

Do you have His Needs, Her Needs and Lovebusters?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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LoveBusters is on order smile as my some recommended on my thread I can read it alone to help with my AO and some of the subtleties I have in AO which I don't see

So basically from what I understand you don't fufill your spouses EN if it causes a LB in yourself and vice versa


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Originally Posted by dotnetdave
So basically from what I understand you don't fufill your spouses EN if it causes a LB in yourself and vice versa

Right! You find a way to meet that need that makes you both happy. Sacrifice is off the table...


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Ok taking this a step further suppose I dont do the vacuuming so I will not fufill her EN and not cause a LB in myself. So now she does the vacuuming as I don't she is pissed off with and feels I am not helping/giving support etc so I am in a no win situation.

So do I do it knowing that she won't ask but I am fufulling her EN and I don't get any EN's met but I am not unhappy doing this and look for other ways to get EN's met


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Originally Posted by dotnetdave
Ok taking this a step further suppose I dont do the vacuuming so I will not fufill her EN and not cause a LB in myself. So now she does the vacuuming as I don't she is pissed off with and feels I am not helping/giving support etc so I am in a no win situation.

This is where you negotiate the chores until you find WIN/WIN solutions. Sit down and list out the chores and decide who does what. Hopefully CWMI comes along and helps out with this exercise, she has gone through it. I will look for an article on it.



"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Oddly, the division of the house work has been the EASIEST thing for my H and I.. We will have fistfights over lettuce in the grocery store grin but have never had a minutes trouble over division of labor.

That is because we agreed early on that he is responsible for all outside chores and I am responsible for inside chores. I am happy with that because he is HOPELESS with housework. Unless our house looked like an episode of hoarders, he would think it looked just fine! That means I am FREE to keep the house just like I like it.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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ok, I found a good article about it: How to Divide Domestic Responsibilities (Part 1)


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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I don't think the solution Steve gave to us would apply in this case, because I feel like dotnetdave is more after admiration for what he does than to simply not do it, right?

With us, my H is OCD, and felt like I should keep the house at an OCD level. Steve had us each make a list of the chores we felt were important to be done, how often they should be done, and estimate the amount of time each chore would take. My H's list was waaaaay more extensive than my own. The next time we got with Steve, he said, "Okay, now each of you is responsible for the things on your own list." bwahaha. I love Steve. He's so smart. smile

Anyway, one of the things was daily vacuuming--I didn't want to do it everyday, H thought I should do it anyway because it fulfills and EN of his, so we bought a Roomba and now IT vacuums every day while I do other things that don't fill me with resentment.


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That is too funny! Thanks for the explanation.

I love my NEATO!! My house has scads of wood floors and they get so dirty so fast. It was driving me crazy. But this neato does a super job keeping things clean.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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dotnetdave,

I offer a three-part solution that works for my marriage:

1. POJA a division of responsibilities (per MelodyLane's suggestion). This relieves your wife of the annoyance of asking you to do something, and so protects her lovebank balance.

2. Make it a habit to review with her what you've done. This gives her an opportunity to throw in a few "attaboys" and "thank yous" to help meet your admiration need. When you do a particularly stellar job, bring her over by the hand and ask her specifically to admire your fine job and reward you with a kiss.

3. Make it a habit to thank your wife and show admiration for the things she does -- every single time. If she does the dishes every night, thank her for it every night. Express admiration for the things she does. This normalizes the language of admiration in your house and gets both of you used to it, so that expressing admiration won't be so much of a hurdle.

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Curious and melody between you have seen the solution now smile curis hit the nails on the head about admiration as well smile the kiss would be wonderful but if you read my blog thread you will know its going to bd a while before that happens smile

I would still love her to ask me to do things as well, maybe something I can talk about with her like a previous response mentioned to find out what she would be comfortable asking me to do etc, then woud be all good and I get to feel wanted/needed its amazing how much different it will feel to be asked to do something rather than continually offering to do it smile


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Curious's #3 works remarkably well with children, also. Just use the language of please and thank you with kids, and they'll use it, too.

There have been a couple of times here where my H unloaded/reloaded the dishwasher on days when I am away from home for 11-12 hours. Usually, I notice if I've left the kitchen a bit of a wreck and come home expecting to clean it before making dinner, and on those days I'll walk in and text him a thank-you. One day I hadn't noticed, so he texted me, Did you notice I did the dishes? lol. I am perfectly fine with him bringing me to things he wants admiration for when I've missed them. I can be a bit oblivious at times to my surroundings, and my H notices everything.


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Dr. Harley has a very specific plan for meeting the emotional need of Domestic Support, and I think that plan would give you what you are looking for. The plan is in several articles on this site and is also in His Needs Her Needs for Parents. (I think it is also in the original HNHN, but I think the presentation in HNHNFP made more sense to me.)


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Hmmmm interesting I have been showing lots n lots of admiration to my wife but getting very little if any back from her despite everything I have started doing.


BH
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Originally Posted by CWMI
I don't think the solution Steve gave to us would apply in this case, because I feel like dotnetdave is more after admiration for what he does than to simply not do it, right?

I'm not sure if Steve gave you Dr. Harley's full plan, but returning admiration (or other EN and signs of appreciation) is part of the plan. On the radio Dr. Harley says that if you try to do something on your spouse's list and it doesn't seem to have an effect on them, you get to quit doing it! smile


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

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If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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Oh, also, there is a plan for meeting the need for admiration. That's in His Needs Her Needs. It's best to inform her straight out of your need and ask if she'd be willing to follow the plan with you.


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

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Originally Posted by dotnetdave
Hmmmm interesting I have been showing lots n lots of admiration to my wife but getting very little if any back from her despite everything I have started doing.

Where does she put admiration on her list? I don't have a great need for admiration, so I don't really notice when it's being paid to me. It's love-bank neutral for me. It's nice, but doesn't really 'do it' for me, you know? My H has a much greater need for it (as many men do), so I'm good with him asking for it when I forget and/or don't notice. If she doesn't have a high need for admiration, she might not notice, like me.


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Somewhere in the middle is where it comes I also think cause I haven't shown it in the past either showing it now to her she may feel it is patronising as its fit things she has always done frown

Markos thanks for the advice on telling her my need but if you read my thread you will find the situation I am in and are a lot slower and more delicate. The fact we have even just taken done tiny tiny steps into recovery has taken s lot of ting n patience. So right now throwing the whole EN list at her would send her running so I have to work with thf counciller very slowly n slyly as well to introduce things to my wife, at the moment we are trying to get admiration going both ways, but we digress any comments regarding my specific situation feel free to read n post on my thread smile


BH
Married 13yrs, togther 18yrs
1 son, 11yrs
DD: 27th July, Current status plan A

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