I agree.

Why don't you email Dr Harley?
He said he would help you so email him and ask him if the form in the book on sexual history needs to be completed.

I've read continually, "the mb program must be followed without deviation" ...
And this form is in the SAA book I have.

I suggest you mail him this question:

"I am a previous caller to the show (previous emails attached) and I had an affair. I am working to reconcile with my betrayed wife. Is it important for us to both complete the Sex History form in your SAA book? My wife refuses to. How important is this to recovery?"

My stbxw pulled this same crap in the "attempt" to appear the he was working on the marriage. All it amounted to was my repition of the same information that he was already provided with when we were dating but his response was "you never told me that!" Like I was keeping secrets from him then it turned into a personal attack of "what else are you not telling me?" This was all an attempt to intimidate, control and deflect.

Time to stop it KISS.

JK,

With all due respect, this topic needs to die or his marriage is going to die a death of a thousand cuts.

It's a wayward request that only a thoughtless wayward would ask for.

This is NOT a deal breaker for the marriage and needs to stop.

This type of questioning on Kiss's part must end.

Either he's willing to do whatever it takes to recover, and let this go for now or he's still just being a con and a manipulator and a liar.

IMO, They aren't even in recovery yet, their marriage is still in triage. Hell' It's still on life support.
This topic is TOXIC and needs to die!

NeverGuessed,

So why does Dr. Harley say how important doing all the questionnaires are. Knowing everything about your spouse and their past? I don't know if you listen to the radio show or have read any of his books but it seems like he puts a lot of emphases on them. Maybe we are looking at two different programs.

This all came up from a post from HPB he had asked me about the RC questionnaire if we had done it. Also I just read Surviving An Affair and at the end of some of the chapters it has checklists and some of the questionnaires are part of those checklists. I asked her when we were planning out our week if Wednesday night she would want to work on some of the marriage builders materials and questionnaires. Her reply was that she was not doing the sexual history questions or the personal history questionnaires. I never said what ones I thought we should do. I did not push it or question her about any of it. I was not using it to pressure her or deflect guilt!! I never have brought this up like it was a contest or look at all the skeletons in your closet kind of thing. Thanks for the negative view of my post.

So when she asks me questions about my past growing up I have always told her 100 percent the truth. We meet when I was 21 and didn't have a lot of life experiences where she was 24 had two kids and divorced. I knew she wasn't a pure angel. I know that I was pretty damn lucky and she was a great person. Not every person makes the right decision every time.

KISS

HPB,

I never requested or tried pushing RQ to do the questionnaire. The view of some people on my thread is that I was trying to us this as leverage is a bunch of BS!! I never brought it up. It is something I have wanted to know 14 years and 2 months that I have known RQ but its not something that is a must at this time. I requested to go through some of the questionnaires like the RC you asked about and I got the defensive I'm not doing the personal history or sexual questionnaire response. I never made a hint toward them.


KISS

LogansRun,

Sorry but it was nothing like that. I never brought it up or questioned her on it. She stated that she didn't want to do them when I asked about doing some of the questionnaires that HPB asked if we had done them. I then posted it here to get everyone's feed back and how important it was. I never discussed it with her. I brought it to you guys and never said a word to her. I thought that's what I am supposed to do. Everyone jumped on the negative with it. HPB was the only one that gave good advise and not looking to attack me without any explanation!!!

KISS

Jedi-Knight,

I will wait like HPB said its not important right now.

THANKS,

KISS

I did not push it or question her about any of it. I was not using it to pressure her or deflect guilt!! I never have brought this up like it was a contest or look at all the skeletons in your closet kind of thing. - Kiss, 11 December

See, dude, the problem with written communication is that it leaves footprints, to wit:

She said she would not do the sexual history or the personal history questionnaires. This bothers me a lot. I have asked her in the past through out our relationship how many people she has been with and she has no idea. I have asked if it was 10 or more and she has no idea. I believe she is lying to me. It is something that is very important to me. I was only with one person before meeting her. So I have been with three woman in my life. I wish it was only one. I really don't feel like I know that much about my wife's past. I don't know if she is embarrassed or ashamed of her past or what the deal is. I feel like I have the right to know - Kiss, 10 December

And, oh, btw:

Thanks for the negative view of my post.

You're very welcome!

Kiss I see this the same way as NG.........


If you would have comeback with a simple post;

Saying something like, "OK everyone, I'm letting this go, thanks for keeping me on track". I think we all would have been much happier.... but instead we got what we got.

I concur.

Kiss, do you see what's going on here? You are how far out from the last contact with OW, and you are still extremely foggy. When I read your posts about MB, and what RQ needs to change, I get angry for HER. She WILL be changing, as you two enter a different point in your marriage, but right now, the focus is on YOU. As long as she is working on not committing LBs and she is showing a willingness to meet your ENs in the future, you have a green light to work on YOURSELF, and woo hoer back to you. That is assuming you do want a recovered and happy marriage as the outcome.

You didn't even answer my concern that you are only spending what amounts to 3 hours of UA time this week. This is a MAJOR stumbling block to ANY relationship.

Scotland,

I'm not sure how you get only three hours? We had
Wednesday 7 pm - 10 pm diner time together
Thursday 9 pm - 11:30 pm we wrapped cristmas presents, time to talk and alone time
Saturday 2 pm - 8 pm family time Christmas tree and decorating
8-1 am going out with RQ to see a band
Sunday 10 am -12 pm Church
12 pm - 8 pm shopping with RQ
9 pm - 10:30 alone time with RQ


KISS

Regarding the family time, it is my understanding that Dr Harley says UA time does not include family time.
Just the husband and wife

20 hrs of UA time (as long as you didn't have anyone else with you)

The ones I struck through don't apply toward UA.

Looks good so far.

Can you do it every week?

Kiss,
Last week being over, and this week being a HUGE opportunity to make progress, please tell us (and understand we will remember) what are your plans this week to entice RQ to more surely agree to continue approaching full recovery?

What do you plan to do for her? What do you plan to do for her children? How do you plan to demonstrate that the new Kiss is the real Kiss?

Today is Christmas-9, friend. Don't let this chance slip by!

HPB,

I know that the two things you crossed out didn't count toward UA time. I wanted to show family time but I didn't note that as I intended to.

I haven't made our schedule for this week yet but we will have our time in this week. On wednesday we are taking the kids to NYC to see the Christmas tree and spend the day in the city. Should be a great day.

KISS

Kiss please post details as soon as you make the schedule.

You cannot skip the schedule.

The schedule is a recipe that you follow.... Without a recipe to follow, the outcome will leave a bitter taste for both of you.

Scheduling UA time is something you'll get in the habit of doing...... For the rest of your life!

Wednesday 7 pm - 11 pm ?
Thursday 9 pm - 10:30 pm radio show and time to talk
Saturday 12 pm - 8 pm family time Christmas tree and decorating
8-1 am going out with RQ to see a band
Sunday 10 am -12 pm Church
12 pm - 8 pm shopping with RQ
9 pm - 10:30 alone time with RQ

The above is what I was going off of, which you posted on Dec 10th. You didn't know what you would be doing Wednesday, so I crossed it off of my list. So, I gave you credit for the 1.5 hours of radio show and talk, as well as the Sunday, 9-1030. I don't know how many ENs you will be meeting by shopping, or going to church, and depending on if anyone else is with you when you go see the band, and how loud the band is, there isn't going to be much EN meeting going on.

UA time isn't just about being with RQ, you have to be meeting the 4 most intimate ENs.

Scotland, we need to remember that the emotional need of RC is one of the 4 intimate emotional needs that needs fulfilled during our UA time. This could include shopping and depending on how much they interact, a concert could be included as well.

Although Kiss has been a royal screw'up, a little encouragement might be due on this one.




The Policy of Undivided Attention:

Give your spouse your undivided attention
a minimum of fifteen hours each week,
using the time to meet the emotional needs of
affection, sexual fulfillment, intimate conversation, and recreational companionship.

Link to entire article

I understand that encouragement is may be needed here, I also see a great need for Kiss to understand what constitutes UA time, and what doesn't. The fact that he puts the family time as UA time is discouraging to me, since he has been here for so long, he has counseled with Steve, he has over 100 pages on his own thread, he listens to the radio show daily.

I liken a concert in the same regard as a movie, or watching TV which DrH does not include in UA time. It seems more likely that Kiss believes that he IS doing his part, and I wanted to point out that he is still lacking. And while 15 hours of UA is good enough to maintain LB balance, Kiss is going to have to put up a lot more time to get RQ's LB balance into the black. That time should also be more focused of meeting the intimate ENs, rather than just spending time. This marriage is on it's last legs, and some major EN meeting on Kiss's part is the only way it will survive.