I have to echo what Miss Indiegirl has stated.

My only question I had is why the delay in the divorce? I know there is a waiting period, but that should be well past done. If financial reasons, well I think many of us can understand that.

Great to see you posting. I hope to see more.

I know that in this particular case Scotty was done with her marriage and trying to find a way to afford divorce. Divorce in her case would have left her without as much financial support at a time when she was in dire straits.

It wasn't that she was waiting for her H to return, as is usual with Plan Bers who are still married.

I didn't necessarily think it was a good plan because she is human and I felt she would naturally start to crave companionship when she wasn't dedicated to following a recovery plan. I felt that if she was done, she should divorce.

I am sure she would agree with me now, and wishes that she had. That's hindsight.

However lets remember that she has followed a dark Plan B with very high boundaries around members of the OS for many years. Longer than I ever did. It's not like she hasn't done the tough stuff willingly and well.

I think the lesson here was rather that she maybe should have considered Dr Harley's advice to divorce at the two year point when he essentially considers the marriage unrecoverable.

I thought at the time when she decided to carry on she may have underestimated how lonely that would be. Being a married Plan Ber is not designed to be a permanent state of existence. It is very lonely and very tough.

Plan Bers after all cannot go on being alone forever. I am a proud Plan Ber and always will be. Yet I am dating.

*Disclaimer. I cannot be objective about Scotty. She was my IM, one of the few (only?) proper Plan B examples for me to follow and she absolutely saved my life.

Actually she isn't using any tools she learned and is not following Dr Harleys advice

Indie, many of the excuses you make are the same that others have made.
For example, ChristianSamurai wife is saying the same thing, that she was done and emotionally divorced.
We all hear this all the time.

The fact is nobody is taking a moral high road here.
But the fact her boyfriend is married is a major red flag and we have a dear poster yhat has downgraded to renter adultery status

I don't want to bash Scotty.

But I confess to being surprised that someone who continually described herself as a "Supreme Buyer" (in fact she used all-caps) would let a man move in with her and her boys after, by my count, 4-5 months of an online relationship.

While she remains married.

Am I missing something here? Is this not utterly contrary to everything that MB stands for?

I'm not making excuses, but neither will I be so gauche as to tell her what she 'should' do.

Remember, she hasn't asked for our opinion.

If she wants MB advice, she will ask for it.

Someone asked why she wasn't posting much so she told us.

Last time I checked, Canada is a free country where people can do as they please.

If someone isn't requesting advice, you have to yell pretty loud when giving it. I suggest we not do that.

I respect what your saying indie but this is a simple affair. Plain and simple they are both married and living together. It's very weird and confounding to see veteran posters wish her happiness when we all know she is setting herself up for failure. Even though she hasn't asked for advice the forum is for advice whether she takes it or not. ***EDIT***

Gauche?
This is a forum to share Dr Harleys philosophies.
Its not a personal blog.
If a friend start s making bad decisions do you come to them and talk or juat say, She hasn't asked for my opinion

That is rather disrespectful, don't you think?

It is also inaccurate. Dr H has been asked specifically if relationships that began before parties divorced are the same as affairages. He says not. He does not advocate either one, but he makes a distinction between the two.


Not even Dr H gives unsolicited advice. He makes a point of saying it is disrespectful to try and tell others what to do. I take my cue from him.

If Scotty wants my advice she can have it. Until then I will not say a word about it either way.

I don't know Scotty's motivations for posting here, but Indie's suggestion that if someone isn't seeking advice then it is "gauche" to offer them an opinion about their actions simply does not square with SOP (std op proc) on this board.

***EDIT***

***EDIT***

***EDIT***

Indie, I'm sorry but you sound just like my WW's enabling friends and family. If a friend is making a bad decision. Do you let them know of let them destroy themselves? I won't commit further but it seems you are letting Scotty get a pass because you guys are friends. If this was a new poster I bet my paycheck we wouldn't see all this enabling. How many times does Joyce say on the radio show you don't date while in separated or in Plan B? They are living together while married I'm sorry that's an affair and renter relationship. Saying it might leave to a marriage ***EDIT*** is just being honest. I haven't heard Dr. Harley once say its ok to date during a marriage. Please post that quote or link.

Such as? Am I being dim, I really don't pick up on your meaning here.

I didn't say it was OK. And if Scotty was unaware of MB, I would let her know the facts and then let her choose what she wanted to do. But you seem to have a problem distinguishing between your WW, and Scotty. Between affairages and this situation.

That's fine, I respect your viewpoint and your value of marriage. I just wouldn't place those values unwillingly onto others.

This is also really rather disrespectful. If you wouldn't mind, please do not do that.

Enough with the bickering. Please help this poster with Marriage Builders principles or refrain from posting.

Well, but�

With the exception of Scotty's last post, I kind of thought that those WERE her values.