CatLady, that was me. I'd always been a loving husband, good dad, model employee, pillar of my church, level-headed, clean-cut. I wasn't some "playah", I was a boy-scout! I didn't think I was even capable of having an affair.

Thanks to that complacency, I didn't take fundamental, basic precautions that would've kept me from venturing onto the slippery slope of infidelity.

You know how innocently it started? She wasn't even an ex. Hell, I barely knew her, as she & her husband had only been coming to the same church as me & my wife for a couple of years. She was a fellow singer of mine on the church's music team. That's how safe & innocuous it all was at first. And she wasn't even anything so special.

We'd been getting together after group rehearsals to do some extra work on some duets. (By no means was I looking for an affair, from the outset!) Yet I should've recognized that sharing confidences with a friend of the opposite sex is inappropriate. I should've seen the red flag that was raised when she began sharing with me the tidbit that things weren't going 100% great between her & her husband. I should have arranged never to be alone with her after that. But because I was so damned sure of my righteousness, I stupidly allowed myself to be in positions where she could pay me compliments and come to view & treat me as a confidant of hers. And that mix of cheap admiration and feeling "needed" by someone as a friend to lean on, was heady stuff for me. I got myself hooked. Even when I admitted to myself that she was making a play for me, I thought I could enjoy the free attention & the flirtations and that I could put on the brakes before things went too far. And I was too prideful to admit to myself that I was liking it, and certainly wouldn't have admitted it to my wife. And I didn't. About halfway through the affair, before it had gotten physical, my wife expressed some concern about the time I was spending with the other woman. And I assured her that nothing untoward was happening.

Why am I rehashing this for you? Because of what you said about your husband saying that he could never do such a thing.

CatLady, the people who're most at risk for affairs are the very people who're so cocksure of their own incorruptibility that they think it could never happen to them; and so they take stupid chances -- they allow themselves to have inappropriate conversations, they allow themselves to have inappropriately close opposite-sex friendships, because they think they can handle them, and they think that only people who aren't as self-controlled, as smart or as socially mature as they are would succumb to an affair. They think that the only people who have affairs are scumbags & sluts from start to finish. They don't think a nice guy, a good guy, an incorruptible guy like they are, would ever have an affair.

Wrong. The people who actually are self-controlled, smart and socially mature are the ones who are conscious of human falliability & limitations, and who don't put themselves into those risky situations to begin with, who make it an active practice to avoid those risky relationships & situations.

I learned this a very hard way, and it almost cost me everything I hold dear. Almost destroyed my family & my self-respect. I have been very lucky to have been able to rebuild a marriage that's even better than what my wife & I had before the affair, but it was a close call. You & your husband, I presume, are younger & less experienced at this whole 'marriage' thing, and I hope you'll both learn from this -- him especially. You can learn this stuff relatively easily, or you can learn it a very hard way.

CatLady, I don't know whether you & your husband celebrate Christmas, but please let this knowledge be a gift to you all the same.

CatLady, your reasons should have nothing to do with his thoughts and hopeful guarantees. Your reasons have everything to do with the way this makes you feel. Period. It hurts therefore it should be eliminated.

I thought this may help you in understanding the reasons why you justify your position (on top of the fact that opposite sex friends are dangerous).

This was posted to me a few weeks ago by MelodyLane:

Effective Marriage Counseling pg 112 - 113

What about Resentment?

One of the most common objections to the POJA is that it creates resentment when it�s followed. I agree; it does usually create some resentment. But far more resentment is created when it is not followed. An illustration will help make this important point.

George is invited to watch football with his friend Sam. He tells his wife, Sue, that he plans to accept the invitation. Sue objects.

If George goes ahead and watches the game, he�s guilty of independent behavior. He is not following the POJA, and Sue will be resentful. When George does something against the wishes of Sue, I call
her resentment type A.

If George follows the POJA and doesn�t accept Sam�s invitation, George will be resentful. When George is prevented from doing something because of Sue�s objections, I call his resentment type B.

Which type of resentment makes the largest Love Bank withdrawals: type A or type B? The answer is type A, and that�s why the POJA helps build Love Bank balances. I�ll explain.

When George violates the POJA, Sue has no choice but to feel the effect of the thoughtless decision (Love Bank withdrawals) for as long as memory persists�possibly for life whenever the event is recalled. But when George follows the POJA, the negative effect is limited in time. It lasts only as long as it takes to discover an enjoyable alternative that is acceptable to Sue.

George lets Sue know how disappointed he is with her objection but is willing to discuss other options. Sue wasn�t invited to watch football and doesn�t want to invite herself to Sam�s house, so she suggests inviting Sam and his wife to their house to watch football. George calls Sam, he and his wife accept, and the new activity puts an end to George�s type B resentment.

Type A resentment can last forever, but type B resentment stops the moment a mutually enjoyable alternative is discovered. Those with poor negotiating skills may have trouble seeing the difference
because they have not learned how to resolve conflicts. They may feel resentment about a host of issues that have been unresolved in their marriage. But after you teach a couple to negotiate successfully,
unresolved issues are minimized. Then it becomes clear to them that the POJA helps build Love Bank balances by eliminating type A resentment

Also here's a radio clip on the different types of resentment.

Radio clip on the Different Types of Resentment

Glove Oil, thank you for your detailed and thoughtful responses. It means so much that you took the time to post this and it is written in a really non-confrontational way. I may have my husband read just your posts.

We ended up sending her the no contact email but instead of him sending it from just him, he wanted it to come from both of us. I felt like the undertone was, "I would talk to you but it bugs my wife so I am not going to." I don't know if this is okay, I would have felt like the no contact would have been stronger if he just said HE doesn't want to have contact with her. He also blocked her email address in his email, she was already blocked on FaceBook.

I have his login information for all of this emails and his Facebook, I can see his credit card spendings, and I have access to the phone records. Do I still need a key logger?

Yes, you need to see what he is writing to her. It is real easy to delete emails.

99% of the time my husband strives to do things that make me happy and avoid things that make me unhappy. The only place we really get hung up, and it is only occasionally, is regarding who to talk to and spend time with. He is much more social and open than I am. I prefer small gatherings and a small network of very close friends. He often accommodates me but at times, he feels very restricted if I try to limit who we spend time with or how we spend it (some friends I am okay spending time with under specific circumstances).

It's part of his value system to be friendly and treat everyone well, it's really important to him, so he feels like I am turning him into a bad person when I restrict social time with people he has known for a long time or that he thinks need a friend. I don't really know how to get past this.

One thing he did recently concede, is that my instincts about people are much better than his. So, as soon as I get a bad vibe or notice subtle things, I respond accordingly. But it is hard for him to trust my instincts when he isn't picking up any bad vibes or negative subtle cues. Still, he is amazed at how good I am at calling out affairs and shady behaviors before they are discovered. I have been trying to verbalize the cues I see a lot so that over time, he might learn to trust my instincts more and he might notice some of these things on his own, but I don't know if that means I am inappropriately trying to "educate" him.

If he really wanted to write to her he could use his work email. It's locked down so that he can't access it from anywhere but his work computer and I can't go in his office and view it because of security reasons. However, it is also monitored and he doesn't send me emails from it because he said he doesn't want the powers that be to view his personal stuff. I will certainly get a keylogger, but I will most likely have to pick up on any interaction through other cues.

Well, yeah... I can't read his thoughts, and there's always the possibility that he simply thought it'd seem more polite and/or more likely to be properly-received & abided-by if you were both writing.

However, having the letter be seen as coming from both of you does give him an 'out' if by chance he's planning to remain in contact with her. Then if he got back in touch with her by some other means (secret gmail account, etc.?) he could claim that he only sent the "no contact" message in order to placate you. Here's hoping that's not the case; but as they say, "Hope is not a plan" -- and here's where the keylogger may help confirm or allay your worries. Probably best not to tip him off to this site until you've covered that angle.

Can you get a VAR put in his office?

Can his IT allow off site access to his email and/or have it linked to his smart phone?

Great that he's friendly & thinking of others. Admirable in & of itself.

Just as long as he's not having 1-on-1 friendships with women, because that provides an entree for them to come to him with personal problems of theirs.

That's the slippery slope that I spoke about previously. In my case, the other woman & I were just talking about music, for cryin' out loud -- it was that innocent at first -- but simply being alone with her made it real easy to go from talking about music to talking about music we'd liked in college, to talking about kids & parenting (we each had kids), to talking about our life histories & our families, and that ease of conversation that we developed allowed her to venture to start telling me about small dissatisfactions in her marriage. All of this, along with the small compliments + the idea I formed that she needed me as a friend to lean on, was a cup from which I never, ever should've sipped. There's a "damsel in distress" dynamic that certain guys will bite on, because we start out wanting to be helpful, & not wanting to be so impolite as to shut off a conversation.

God, do I wish I'd been impolite enough to shut off the conversation! That's why boundaries in marriage are so important. He needs to make sure there are no women getting under his perimeter wire, even (or especially) if they're in the guise of "friends in need."

Yes, a few times per-marriage and a few times post marriage my husband has bordered on "being there" for a damsel in distress. He doesn't hide it from me, though, so what typically happens is that I express I am uncomfortable and then we agree to some things that I see as boundary setting. He is generally reluctant because he wants to be the good guy and doesn't see the harm so I fear that I might selfish demand him into it sometimes.

For example, one divorced woman from work texted him a few times asking him about how to do some stuff around the house and was overly conversational so he agreed to letting me respond back and say, "My husband is busy, this is his wife, can I help you with something?" Then, the next time we saw her in person I gave her a great recommendation for a handyman and a few websites with helpful information. She stopped after that. My husband tends to think it's rude and won't set the boundaries himself but will generally let me do it as long as I am not coming across like a jealous crazy woman.

In my ideal world, he would do it before I say something but my boundaries are much wider than his. He thinks someone has crossed the line if they try to kiss you or initiate intimacy. I think it starts way before that.

So what is your H doing to have boundaries?

To make you feel safe in your M?

He does not have a moral obligation to cater to and befriend every female that comes across his path. But he does have a moral obligation to treat his wife well and avoid behavior that puts his marriage at risk.

The basic problem here is that he doesn't put his marriage first. His friendships come before the marriage.

Saying that this is just how your husband is, is a freeloader's approach to marriage. A freeloader will only do what comes naturally. And it is the kiss of death in marriage.. You could really benefit from Dr Harley's book, Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders.

Freeloader is unwilling to put much effort into the care of his or her partner in a romantic relationship. He or she does only what comes naturally and expects only what comes naturally. It's like a person who tries to live in a house without paying rent or doing anything to improve it unless the person is in the mood to do so.

Renter is willing to provide limited care as long as it's in his or her best interest. The romantic relationship is considered tentative, so the care is viewed as short-term. It's like a person who rents a house and is willing to stay as long as the conditions seem fair, or until he or she finds something better. The person is willing to pay reasonable rent and keep the house clean but is not willing to make repairs or improvements. It's the landlord's job to keep the place attractive enough for the renter to stay and continue paying rent.

Buyer is willing to demonstrate an extraordinary sense of care by making permanent changes in his or her own behavior and lifestyle to make the romantic relationship mutually fulfilling. Solutions to problems are long-term solutions and must work well for both partners because the romantic relationship is viewed as exclusive and permanent. It's like a person who buys a house for life with a willingness to make repairs that accommodate changing needs, painting the walls, installing new carper, replacing the roof, and even doing some remodeling so that it can be comfortable and useful.

Renters believe Our relationship is temporary. You may be right for me today and wrong for me tomorrow.

Buyers believe We are together for life.

Renters believe Our relationship should be fair. What I get should balance what I give.

Buyers believe We both contribute whatever it takes to make our relationship successful.

Renters believe As needs change, the relationship may end if needs are difficult to meet.

Buyers believe As needs change, we will make adjustments to meet new needs.

Renters believe Criticism may prompt me to change if it's worthwhile for me to do so.

Buyer believe Criticism indicates a need for change.

Rentersbelieve Sacrifice is reasonable as long as it's fair.

Buyers believe Sacrifice is dangerous and to be avoided.

Renters believe Short-term fixes are fine.

Buyers believe long-term solutions are necessary.

He wants to be the "good guy" to others at your expense. He is the bad guy in your marriage. Saying that you "set boundaries" in these situations is like saying you set boundaries for a drunk driver. A true boundary would to not go drunk driving in the first place.

I will say it again: your husband puts his friendships BEFORE his marriage. Anything that is more important than one's marriage will eventually come between the spouses and that is what is happening here. It is only a matter of time before he has an affair.

Thanks, Melody. Buyers, Renters, and Freeloaders is how I came across this site. A friend of mine gave me the book before we got married and it made me realize that we were both renters. We made some changes and I think a substantial amount of progress and that is when we got married. At the time of us getting married, there hadn't been any women that I considered even a slight threat for a long time.

It has been just recently that these minor things have bubbled back up. Our relationship is going through some changes because I am 6 months pregnant and am a bit too tired to do some of the things we used to do together. Also, for the past month we have been living with my husband's parents because our new construction house that was supposed to be finished has been delayed. So, our routine has changed dramatically and we aren't getting our typical 15-20 hours of UA time.

Mel, I see where you are going with this. Yes, I agree it's a problem. He doesn't do it all of the time, just occasionally, but that is still too much. I just haven't figured out how to get him to think differently about it. However, I can sometimes say, "This hurts me and therefore our marriage" and he will adjust, he just gets stubborn about some things randomly, maybe when he feels like he has had to adjust a lot recently.

Catlady, the best thing you do for your marriage is stop capitulating when he does these things. That is exactly what Dr Harley would tell you. Keep the problem on the front burner until it is resolved. Do you have the book His Needs, Her Needs?

What do you mean stop capitulating? I always bring things up and then negotiate to some sort of resolution as best I can. For example, how could I have not capitulated with the ex-girlfriend email that I described at first? Or with the co-worker handyman example?