A married woman with young kids has ZERO business hanging out at bars.
Don't you recognize how detrimental her current life style choices are for the family?

You need to DOCUMENT everything.
Link to DOCUMENT thread <~~~ Click & read and start documenting TODAY.

This is vital. Document the facts, not your perception or interpretation of the facts.

Example:
~~~>"WW was at (name of bar/club) from 8 PM until 2 AM."
(not "WW was out drinking") Unless you saw her drinking, just document what you can prove. If she paid for drinks in the bar with a credit card, you can document that once you have the evidence.

You need to think ahead. You may end up in family court. If you do, YOU be the one with the diaries filled with dates, facts, etc.

Got it?

Hopefully, you will never need this. Think of it as insurance.

Edit to add:
Once you are done documenting a particular event, it needs to be stored somewhere away from your home. Somewhere safe.

Im 33 and my wife is 29. We married when she was 24 and have been together since she was 21. I agree with what you are saying Melody and this was my overall thoughts in the back of my mind.

I'm gonna have to have this talk with her. I do feel like a live in babysitter and while I do feel we are closer ( and have had more intimate moments) than we have been in recent months, I know it will not ultimately pick up until she sheds that lifestyle.

I ended up looking at her phone last night just physically while it was charging. i almost got busted because siri went off when i was trying to take a screenshot of a text. i was not able to get it out of the room. I looked at texts from a variety of people and I saw a lot of recent texts but I only saw a couple from the OM that were somewhat flirty but the tone definitely seemed more just close friend than lover (things were more lovey and dirty 10 days ago) and all her friends ones were pretty harmless. She even asked OM if I could come out with them drinking the other night. Lucky me right I think she wants me and him to be friends at some point, which is like WTF?

That still doesn't speak for what is going on in person though. Which is hard for me to gauge without insider help. My inlaws are taking kids for afternoon tomorrow so I will be digging around. I was thinking of hitting up that bar she goes to and ask the bartender questions, hopefully (since she is friends with my wife now) she wont rat me out to either of them.

I have the VAR in the car now as of last night, but unless she talked to someone on the way to work early this morning, she wont be in the car until about evening tonight. Hopefully something will happen at that point.

Her big thing all along has been if her and I don't work out, she said she will be alone. This was another big clue she was kind of numb to me and my efforts. That makes it harder to save things in my opinion.

I appreciate your honesty, I know it is an uphill battle, but ultimately it is worth fighting for until its dead.

Can you remain calm if she tries to bait you into a fight?

Yes, I admit I did have an outburst over shocking news like her lying to my face and such but now that I have read things the last few days and have gathered a lot of intel here, I am coming from a place where my emotions are put aside and I am dealing with feelings. Its a conversation I am not reacting to and I have my thoughts collected ahead of time. I'll be able to know when to end the discussion before it escalates to fight mode.

I think she will be more upset but i will just have to keep that "i'm doing this to save the marriage" mentality which I am okay doing.

Are there any tips for diffusing any argument inducing words? Do I take the time to really drive home separation again?

I wonder if I should wait until after NYE to do this because we have plans with family. Or is this something that is better addressing sooner than later?

Yes. I like to call on my "pocket replies".
Such as:

"I am certain this is upsetting (stressful/trying/hurtful/difficult/etc) for both of us."
"Nevertheless, my decision is as follows....." (called the broken record)
"Tell me more ...." <~~~ This is an important one when the betrayed is listing your faults/short comings/etc. let her exhaust herself complaining while you JUST listen. Do not defend anything.
"Anything else to add?"
"I see."
"How does a bite to eat sound? I'm too hungry to argue." <~~~ This can be modified to meet the situation.

She may still be angry, but you did not bite the bait !!!



Do you think she is hearing impaired? or memory impaired?


What would be the risk/benefit to either choice?

The sooner the better. But I would DEMAND that she never see the OM again since you have evidence of sexual, flirty texts. That is evidence of an affair. Does she work with him? If so, she needs to find another job.

I would demand that she end all contact with him NOW and stop catting around in bars. Let her know your marriage will be headed to divorce if this doesn't stop. And you need to let your family and her family know this is going on and that it is destroying your marriage. Ask for their support in persuading her to stop acting like an alley cat in heat.

Don't wait to have this discussion. In fact, I would be calling up her mother and dad TODAY and asking them for support. Tell them what is going on and explain that you are going to have discussion with her tonight about this. Tell them how devastating this has been for you and your children for her to run around with men all night.

I would frame it up like this: I have evidence that Sally is having an emotional affair with this bum at work. [the sexy texts on her phone] She has been going out at night to bars and partying several nights a week. I am asking that you use your influence to persuade her end her affair and stop bar hopping like an alley cat. Her actions are destroying our marriage and I don't want that to happen.

ASK them to call her tomorrow and have a talk to her after you have your talk. If there are any other friends and family who would help, I would ask them too. There is a good email in my exposure thread that you could use.

I will just tell you what Dr Harley says about trying to find a good time to tell someone something. He says the best time is always NOW. [when physically possible, of course] There is no such thing as a perfect time. Waiting is usually a delaying tactic.

Say you will never put up with a secretive marriage ever again.

If she accuses you of not trusting her say: "I most certainly do not but I am willing to give you a chance to regain my trust"



I would take anything 'she says' with a HUGE dose of salt. Because a) she is basically dishonest and b) she's not terrific at following the decisions she makes anyway, like remaining faithful while IN a marriage. So she thinks she will become a nun after its over?

This claim of hers doesn't make any basic sense at all. She is a wayward. She is never going to turn down offers to have needs met!

So by 'all alone' is she going to do without your friendship, your parental support? Is she going to cut off the ego-boosting flirtation with OM? And spurn all other attempts to woo and win her?

You can't possibly believe this can you?

I would believe only what you can verify in future. Not what she says.

Thanks, I'm beginning to lose hope for the marriage but gain hope for the future, if that makes sense.

Confronting her about this guy again and all her friends, I am not sure she will be willing to:

a- just kill off all these friendships she has with her coworkers, OM included.

b- though part of her job may be in jeopardy (shes a nurse and works on two different units) i don't think she would just leave that job behind for me.

It's a sad realization, but these friends, especially OM are divorced and already living this life. I think she wants in.

s1, I fully expect her to scoff at your requests the first time. You will need to be a broken record and hold your ground because you don't have a marriage otherwise. You have nothing to lose here because this is not a marriage.

I strongly suggest you contact family members who will be supportive and ask for their help.

If she places her job and her loser "friends" before your marriage and your children, you don't have a marriage anyway.

The only hope you have is to fight for your marriage and stop going along with her destructive, anti-marriage behavior.

p.s. women do not respect men they can treat like a door mat. Our love is very contingent on the respect we feel. So don't think for one minute that your wife is going to love you if you allow her to treat you like her live in boy; she will not. She loses respect for you when you allow her to mistreat you.

Capitulating to her destructive behavior has all but destroyed your marriage. You have to stop doing that.