We were together for a year and a half. Got engaged for a year and a half. We have been married now for four and a half years. I am 29, she is 27. For the 7 years we have been together I can honestly say we never had any major fight, heck I'm not sure we had a little one. We both seemed completely in love. In fact, I would sometimes look at her and think "wow, she really loves me". Just a very thoughtful, loving, great wife. She expressed 0 concerns or feelings of negativity toward me and our marriage. I don't think of myself as being out of touch or hard to talk to either.

We lived in Oregon for the first 5 years together, then we moved to montana, california, and back to oregon in the last two years all in the name of my jobs. Decisions were made together and she never objected. In fact she now has a job she likes best of all as a result of having to find things on our moves. So, 4 months ago we arrive back in oregon. A couple weeks later she finds a job, which she absolutely loves. Her job requires long hours and lots of texts, emails, etc after work. I started to think that it wasnt all necessary and it was taking time away from us. So i went to grab her phone one night in an attempt to see just what from work required this much attention in the evening. She grabbed the phone and reacted odd. THIS is when i got suspicious of foul play. A few days later I saw her texts and found some from a guy at her previous job in Cali. It was an emotional affair. They would call and talk, text, email. To get to the point I am sure nothing physical happened, and it all started when she moved and the guy professed his feelings. Coincidentally she was getting to personal with her new boss at the same time. Both relationships ended as soon as I found out (the boss was less severe and was mostly flirty) and she expressed deep remorse and said how awful she felt etc. I love her and want to remain married. We took the Emotional Needs test and some of the other topics on here. #1 for her was communication. I worked 12 hr days in Cali and could see how maybe she just got ignored and someone else gave it to her. She kept saying she just like feeling good and hearing the compliments and thats why she did it. I assumed we were on the road to recovery.

I left to visit family in Dec for Christmas. When she joined me she seemed distant and broke the news to me that it doesnt feel the same and she doesnt know if she is attracted to me romantically anymore and wants to be married. She went back to Oregon and I have been with friends and family for a month now. She says she is deciding if she wants to be married or not and needs space. She has since moved into her own apartment (we moved suddenly and had actually been living in her parents upstairs until we found a place). Instead of wanting our marriage and wanting to work on it she has jumped all the way to "if I want to be married" She says she just needs space and to make decisions for her and wants to focus on her career. Its just too much to do it all. we will still talk. some conversations better than others, but she gets overwhelmed easy. She has told family and me that she cant handle all the advice and talking and needs us to back off. I now only respond to her calls or texts and dont initiate. She says she doesnt want to give up on the marriage and is seeing a counselor, but at the same time doesnt want to really work on the mariage. Its more about deciding IF the marriage is what she wants right now. She still will occasionally say she loves me and cares about me, but who knows if thats the truth. I find it hard to believe that she just all the sudden doesnt find me attractive and doesnt love me the same. It seems the traumatic experience may be causing some issues. I just dont know. I love her dearly and just want my wife back so that we can work on things together. Is it over, is this temporary, is there hope? Any advice and insight would be appreciated

Welcome, cc. (if that is your real name, you should consider using a pen name, and ask the moderators to change it.)

Sorry for your reason for being here. You are in the right place to recover your marriage. We know the pain you are feeling.

Soon the veterans will be here with specific advice for you. Meanwhile, read the post at the head of this forum for columns to begin reading.

I'm sorry to hear what you are going through. I'm no vet, but I'm 100% certain she is having an affair.

CC,

You're going through a very traumatic event. PLEASE listen to what the vets tell you to do; they WILL steer you in the right direction.

Sorry you're here. You'll be well taken care of.

So sorry you are dealing with this.

First....read this post
http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1659680#Post1659680

then read the basic concepts
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3000_intro.html

and buy and read the books
Surviving An Affair
His Needs Her Needs
Lovebusters

all written by the person who developed the MarriageBuilders website
and then you can decide whether to try to save your marriage or not.

Uh, no they didn't. At least one of these affairs continued.

Waitaminute. Sounds like you might've tried to move on to attempting to rebuild your marriage without fixing the foundation. When someone has an affair, the "foundation" of recovery involves making sure the affair is dead; and this requires that the affair be exposed. To whom did you expose her emotional affair?

No, you misunderstand. Unmet emotional needs don't cause affairs. (Unmet emotional needs can lead to stress & weakness in a marriage, but not everyone in a stressed or weak marriage goes & has an affair.) What causes affairs is, crappy boundaries around the opposite sex. Your wife obviously has one heck of a time drawing the line in her communications, flirtations, and the intimate confidences she forms with any number of men. In short, she has no friggin' boundaries right now. Women like this are a disaster -- I know, because I got to know one & had an affair with her, back at a time in my life when I allowed my own boundaries to go to hell in a handbasket. Don't ever think her infidelity is because of "poor communications." Her infidelity is because, in her current moral condition, without boundaries, she would boff a fire hydrant if it was male & spoke English.

Cooper, you understand that that's a huge load of complete horsecrap, right? She wants feedom to pursue her other love interest without your interfering. It's not about anything so noble as even a career or a job.

Well, I'd say it's darn near over. With her living apart from you, out of state, almost certainly in regular communication with this other lover of hers, where he's filling her love-bank [at least for now, until some other fire hydrant comes along], your odds of saving your marriage are pretty slim.

So going forward, what can you do? Well, this: If you want to have any shot at all, then you need to expose her affair, massively & without warning, to anyone & everyone whose esteem she (as well as the other man) value in the slightest. If you don't have solid evidence of her current affair, then, with her living away from you, your best shot at getting such evidence is to hire a Private Investigator who's local to where she is & who can get you the goods on her in a way so that your exposure will be credible & irrefutable. If you expose the affair, with such evidence, then at least this is likely to put huge strain on her affair, and might even cause it to end. That still won't guarantee that she'll get clear-headed and consider returning to you & working (genuinely this time) on the marriage; but my friend, there are no guarantees to be had, and massive exposure is your last, best shot.

GloveOil:
It is exposed to her family and a couple mutual friends of ours. I am living with those mutual friends. I have actually talked to both men. One is in Cali and she cut it off the day I found out. no plane tickets have been bought and no records of communication. The other is her current boss in which she flirted with. I of course have no way of knowing for sure nothing is happening here. I can only go off of my conversation with him and her. He says it was inappropriate, but it never went beyond office flirting. She claims it has completely ended (all i can base it off is phone records, in which there has been no contact) and is purely a work relationship. swears up and down it was never about anything more than flirting and getting the compliments. Says she absolutely never wanted more than the flirting. I know there is no real way to know, but based on our talks and that I know her at least somewhat being married ( i know i know, i didnt see this coming) I do sincerely believe that there is no current relationship going on. I cant really convince anyone on a forum of this, so i understand I will get advice on no current relationship happening and current relationship happening

I do agree that lack of communication didnt make her do this, she still made the choice.

Unfortunately, she is having an affair. This is why she needed "space." That is code for need some "space" to have an affair.

If I were you, I strongly consider leaving the marriage before the stakes get any higher. Can you imagine going through this with 3 little ones and a mortgage? It would be a nightmare. It would be much easier for you to just get divorced and find someone who is marriage material.

Sorry.

Have you told your parents so they can support you?

Yes both sets of parents know whats going on.

I have been very upfront with her and asked for a divorce if she is still seeing someone or wants to see others. I honestly have proposed the divorce a dozen times and given her the out to leave if she wants to be with or see others. She maintains she doesnt want to give up on us, but is just confused about what shes feeling and needs some time and space to sort it out. Keeps telling me if she wanted to give up and leave she would.

ML is correct about "space." But I don't agree with her on her advice for you to run for the hills. Very rarely do I disagree with ML. In fact, ML helped me a great deal when I was dealing with my WW's affair.

But...

If you feel this marriage is worth fighting for, then fight, man! We marry for better or for worse, and a promise is a promise. To give up now without a fight would be just quitting. Doesn't everyone deserve a second chance? And isn't a marriage worth fighting for?

Dr. Harley says its up to the betrayed spouse to decide. He doesn't judge either way. But he also says that when his program is followed by both spouses the chances of recovery are 100%.

Having said that, I do agree with everyone that she is having an affair and that she has piss poor boundaries.

Gather your evidence, expose the affair, and go into "Plan A" with ferocity.

You are now at war, sir. Fight like a soldier and be assertive.

Here is more information on plan a (and plan b too, which is the next step).

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html

FYI, you are not disagreeing with me, Just, but with Dr Harley and basic common sense. Dr Harley recommends moving on in these situations where there are no children and very minimal history, so you are dead wrong when you say he "makes no judgement." He damn sure does.

It makes no sense for a young man with no children to stay in a marriage that fell apart so quickly when he has nothing holding him there. Especially after TWO affairs. This is someone who is looking for affairs, not someone who fell into it blindly.

That is just pisspoor bad judgement. He is not held to his wedding vows if she has left him for an affair. Sorry, you missed the boat on this one.

She is having an affair. Asking her to tell you is fruitless, you must find out on your own.

Do you have spyware on her phone?

Is her boss married? Is the OM in California married?

She is not wanting a divorce nor being honest with you because she wants options.
She wants to keep you thinking the relative best of her so you won't hate her while she is vacillating.

It has been working for her in the relationship with you so far.

You have been loving, honest and adoring while she dates other guys in private.

You need to follow a plan (marriage builders has the best) and work on your actions and not try to read her mind nor control her.

I just have records of calls and texts. no spyware. I also have her email passwords. There has been no contact with guy in Cali...he is single. There has ben no contact with boss...he is married. obviously there is work contact, but nothing outside of that that I can determine anyway. IDK I asked if she wanted to take time away for us to see others. Both of us see others or her. She said no, I plan on being faithful during this time and dont want that. Both emotional affairs happened simultaneously

Is there a key on this site somewhere. I honestly dont know what all the initials mean

cooper, the affair is very likely with her boss since they have all day to do things at work. That is where I would start.

I think it makes sense to get the evidence of the affair and expose it but I also think you should strongly consider leaving the marriage. I would get out while the getting is good because I predict your future will be one of serial affairs.

The ONLY way your marriage will ever recover is if your wife makes radical changes in her lifestyle and I don't see her being willing to do that. Right now, she just wants to string you along and keep you as an "option" while she has an affair.

Here.
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