Definitely, I think it would help both of you if she posts on here also.

Have you seen this?
Recovery After an Affair

Although we betrayed spouses love to see remorse in a formerly wayward spouse, Dr. Harley doesn't suggest that it is needed in order to recover. Many formerly wayward wives aren't remorseful at all; they often even blame their husbands for the affair. It would be best to leave that expectation out. She may feel remorse for it one day; she might feel it now, or she may never feel it, but remorse won't necessarily help your recovery.

Just Compensation is what will help your recovery. Dr. Harley lays this out in three parts:

No contact with the AP for life.

Extraordinary precautions for life - to make another affair virtually impossible for either spouse. This means living an integrated transparent lifestyle. You wouldn't be going out without each other, shared passwords, no nights apart, no opposite-sex friends (where the two people are sharing personal details.) Eliminate all the conditions that led to the affair.

Joining with you in a program of marital recovery - so that your marriage post-A is better than the one that was pre-A. You will have a romantic, passionate and safe marriage.

The foundation of the "new" marriage is the Policy of Joint Agreement and the Policy of Radical Honesty. This will turn your marriage into a wonderfully egalitarian transparent partnership where you make all your decisions together with a win/win outcome.

This should all be presented in a calm discussion with your wife. This kind of marriage will be really good for both of you. You should do this tonight.

The questions you will need to have answered are how many affairs and with whom? How did they start and how did they end? Where and when did the affair take place? Beyond that, details will simply be painful. Write down all your questions and get all the answers in one session set aside for that purpose, then never bring it up again.

Your morals and character alone won't keep your marriage 100% safe. Sure some people have different struggles and levels of vulnerability but why put yourself "in many precarious situations" when you don't have to?

Are you really saying that since you won't ever cheat that it's ok for you to have friendships with ex-girlfriends and co-workers?

I'm suggesting you humble yourself a little bit and realize that as a human we are ALL wired to sin and infidelity, though unlikely perhaps in your situation, is not impossible. The next "precarious situation" you find yourself in will necessarily involve the added rationalization and justification that your wife got one free pass...I deserve one too. It's human nature that a small part of you would like to even the score a bit and that little voice may override your character.

MB is a marital recovery plan...not a wayward spouse reform and punishment program. Isolating your wife while you get to do whatever you want because you weren't/aren't the cheater is a sure highway to building resentment. It could be crossing that fine line between boundaries and manipulation/control. If the rules are reciprocal at some point they forever become terms of her disgrace versus the way marriage is supposed to be FOR BOTH SPOUSES.


There is some discrepancy here. This was a recent affair and the rules of extraordinary protection and even just compensation require/demand that she be hyper-diligent rebuilding trust through consistent and verifiable actions/behavior. Not that your wife is a serial cheater but in serial cheating situations I've heard Dr. Harley counsel recommend that they really can't do anything without their spouse if they wish to stay married and that rule wouldn't be reciprocal. So there is some room to discuss this and early on you better to error on the more demanding/safe side. However, the attitude that cheating is somehow beyond you...doesn't bode well for your eventual recovery. I've yet to see a great MB recovery where the parties didn't eventually become equal marital partners....both equally on guard to protect their marriages from "precarious situations".

Even if you don't necessarily buy it yourself yet...the attitude that you understand this stuff and wish to practice what you preach (so to speak) along side her TOGETHER...will go a long way towards restoring her love for you because we aren't just talking about taking precautions but EXTRAORDINARY precautions and in doing so you are telling your wife how much you value her and your marriage TOO.


Godspeed,

Mr.W

Thanks for posting this.
I think where I am stuck is the details of the affair. I don't feel that simple cursory information is enough for me to digest and and not bring up again - I know myself, and I know that I need as much information as possible to understand it inside and out and to be able to move forward with confidence that there is no more information to gleaned from that situation.

Yes I have - we actually printed it out and read it together.

I never placed myself in precarious situations - they usually just happen - as life does. A really good female friend (who I didn't know really liked me) got drunk at my place when I dating someone else in undergrad - every had left except my good buddy - i put her in my bedroom (fully clothed) while I slept outside with my best male friend. It's depth of character. Not too many people would do that.

No. Quite the opposite, because of my strong conviction, I know that you can't be friends with people who you have previously had a relationship with. My wife has yet to really comprehend this concept and I find it difficult to explain to her using clear terms (Dr. Harley has several radio broadcasts about this). The point is - I didn't need a book or Dr. Harley to tell me that you can't be friends with ex-lovers - it's been innate. I have never been friends with my ex's. When I move on - I really do move on and never speak to them again.
As for co-workers - yes. I am friends with some of my co-workers - but it's within the confines of a professional relationship. There are sometimes that conversation gets in the gutter real quickly (due to my profession), I try not to be a prude about it - but I clearly state quite frequently and loudly that I'm married and taken and to look elsewhere. I actually interject my marital status as often and as frequently as possible in every conversation. It's a reminder not only for myself but for those within earshot. Again - I never read that concept in a book. It's who I am.

I couldn't agree more - we are all wired to sin. Within the same breath I'm staring my 40's down and I have never been drunk nor have any intention to. I have never smoked. Never done drugs. Never had a one night stand. We all have our strengths and weaknesses. Infidelity is not a weakness for me, but rather a strength. Because I abhor it so much in my own way (probably due to my early childhood exposure to cheating) I enacted my own version of extraordinary precautions to ensure it doesn't occur. It's very difficult to cheat when the environment to cheat doesn't exist.

I agree 100%! I have been living my life within the same boundaries of the EP's my wife now lives within. There can't be two sets of rules. A unified front is a must - division doesn't work.

I agree. My wife and I are in this together - me living within the confines of the EP's as well as her demonstrates solidarity.

I hope my answers don't come across as arrogant. I know my limits - in fact thats what my wife loves about me - that I know myself and what I can do so well. There were times in my past when I was in a highly competitive post-graduate program and I sought psychological help just to make sure I was ok.
I appreciate your insight and your post. It really helps me to visualize things in a different way.

Nice discussion...

Thanks for clarifying.

I recognize your analytical clinical thinking. Your confidence is refreshing but there are stages to this ordeal you are enduring and embarking upon. Don't speak to soon as you may need a drink or a smoke before this is all said and done. lol

Godspeed,
Mr. W

Well played good sir.....well played!
That actually made me smile and laugh a little. Off to the gym I go!

Mr. W - I like your responses. Please keep them coming!

Mr. W is one of our finest posters. You're in very good hands everything.

What did your WW say about posting here?

My husband and I have both reached a place where we are able to discuss the affair openly without spiralling into pain or anger. That place of healing does exist. It sounds like you are doing the right things for yourself and your marriage, by holding her accountable, and being honest with yourself about what you need from her. Blessings and support to you both along your journey.

Andreadenis, that is not a place of healing, though, to bring up past mistakes. Discussing past tragedies is bringing the sadness of the past into the present. This is why Dr Harley recommends that the affair NEVER be brought up again after all the facts are known.

My husband and I very healed, but it is only because we do not revisit the tragedies of the past. We don't bring up past mistakes. I know MrW said that "flooding" worked for him, but that is very, very rare. For most people, being reminded of the absolute worst thing that ever happened to them brings past unhappiness into the present.