I think I misread your post to say HE is married, but I see now you didn't say that at all. Is this POS married?

No, he's not. Twice divorced. Based on the timing of his first divorce and the age of his son, it's obvious he's cheated before. It's odd that this mathematical detail slipped my wife in his "open and honest" intimate conversation with him.

I didn't think of it that way. It's really easy to think we're on the right track since we both feel better and are really restoring our romantic love.

I need to talk with her about additional EPs I feel are necessary.

She was in the fog. "Openness and Honesty" and "affairs" simply do not mix. APs are rarely open and honest with each other. Once they start with the lying, it is very difficult to discriminate in who they are lying to. They are almost always "look better than you are" liars with each other.

I did say that. That was the reason for my post. I've since seen the light, and have changed my mind. Like it was said above, would I give an alcoholic a little shot of liquor?

She is going through withdrawal and even demonstrating some depressive tendencies. In my moment of weakness, seeing her suffer, I wanted to help her out. She said she just wanted to know general friendly things, like how his father was doing. This guy is a joke and I couldn't imagine her falling for him again through email alone. Anyway, I contacted the OM and told him if he met with me in person I would consider her request. He declined of course, but the door is still open. They have still not contacted each other as far as I can tell, and I have done some digging. He is really a louse and doesn't want her...way too hard of a target with me hounding around and too far away. She's the one that wants contact.

Well, I'm not having any of that. I was not satisfied by the NC email she sent. I will give him one of my own and copy her. It's not for him anyway, I already know he doesn't want to contact. She needs to know how that her contacting him, no matter the innocence of the discussion, is another smack to my face.

ok, thanks. But I would certainly expose him at work so he can't do this to some other man's family. It should also be exposed to your children, family and friends.

Did you see my comments about that?

MMM, I know you are worried about upsetting her, but that is ok. The goal here is to save your marriage and affair proof it from another affair, *NOT* to avoid her anger at all costs. Exposing this affair will catapult you into a new realm. Keeping it secret keeps her fantasy alive and sends the wrong message to the OM. He believes, and rightly so, that you will do nothing to stop him. He has been given the green light to pursue your wife. You can't have that. He needs to be sent a message that hell is coming his way if he EVER contacts your wife again. You can do that by exposing him at work and by contacting him and letting him know he should never ever contact your wife again or you will be suing that hospital for sexual harrassment. And you can do that!

Your wife is on affair #2. If you don't take serious, decisive steps to wake her up, I predict you will be facing affair #3. She needs a serious wake up call.

And she will respect you much more for that. It surely makes her sick and disappointed that you weren't willing to fight for your marriage before. A complacent approach conveys a lack of caring. And I know you do care about your wife. You just need to show her that.

Your WIFE must send the contact letter, written so that you approve it. ML posted one to you for her to write. If you write it, it leaves the door open for her to contact him. Makes you the "bad guy." SHE needs to write the letter to the creep with your approval.

This guy is her drug and she will fall for him through any kind contact, even email.

Gotcha!


Absolutely! No contact is not negotiable. And there is no such thing as "innocent" discussion." An affair is an affair is an affair. They can put lipstick on a pig but it is still a pig!

Prisca is right. She already did fall for this guy. That train has left the station.

Please read.
Read my Lips, No Contact Means No Contact

Also this.
Extraordinary Precautions

MMM,

(He was an older, lonely fellow, who felt really crappy about what he did)

No OM is not some fellow, he is a cold calculated predator who has made a sideline of spotting and seducing vulnerable women. His fellings of regret are a script he has honed over the years to keep himself out of professional and marital trouble.

Since OM is in a position of authority as a doctor you can threaten a lawsuit against the hospital or the doctors partnership if he is a member of one. You need to send a message to every one of his facebook contacts, along with his adult children and ex wives. Expose OM widely completely and without warning.

This is how Dr OM4 was with my W, nothing could have happened physically as he was so old, but after a lifetime of seducing nurses and the entitlement he felt as a Dr he had no problem emotionally involving my W without remorse.

God Bless
Gamma

Thank You for all the advise and for getting me on the right track.

The NC letter was sent, mostly in line with the provided template. I was agreeable to the terms. Absolutely No Contact. Included specifics as to HIS role in the matter and how he should know he is a dirtbag.

EPs are in place:
1. Her job search will be directed to facilities that do not put her at risk. [in progress]
2. I have all account passwords and all her email gets cc'd to my accounts.
3. I monitor for the generation of other accounts.
4. I have put administrative locks on browser history so I can monitor activity.
5. Her phone remains unlocked, I can review at any time.
6. No additional apps on her phone with messaging capability. I know there were recommendations to get rid of the smartphone, but her healthy relationships with other women is very important to me. They keep her honest. It's good to have allies.
7. NO MALE FRIENDS. PERIOD.
8. She will not participate in GNOs with women I do not personally know. And this will not be allowed at all for at least six months.
9. No mixed gender parties/gatherings that I am not present at. (This is how she was first approached by the OM).
10. Post nuptial agreement to be written. [working details, any ideas what to include here for Just Compensation?]
11. I've considered FB controls but still working on them. I think it can be a tool for me to communicate my feelings publically which she adores. And it can foster healthy friendships. Right now, I'm monitoring activity with a keylogger. One breach and it's gone. All other social networking blocked.
12. If OM, or ANY OTHER MAN, attempts contact, she will immediately break contact and inform me.
13. She will dedicate at least 15 hours per week UA time
14. She will use the POJA for all decisions
15. She will not share anything, with anyone (male or female), that she has not already shared with me.

To be fair, I have the same EPs in place. If an affair can happen to anyone under the right conditions, it can certainly happen to me.

We've been at this for going on a month now and I have absolutely no evidence she has contacted him, FB him, googled his name, or anything. And she is getting much closer to being over him. My initial desire was for her to hate him which is why I considered contact. She would find out pretty quickly he had no desire for her now that I was guarding her. He really is a slimy predator. But I agree, Compete NC is the only way to go, thanks for helping me see that. I see know that even if she has a tiny place in her heart of fond memories years down the road, as long as there is NC, there is no threat. Kind of like my HS crush, I still have a fleeting thought every now and again, but I share it with my WS so it doesn't consume me (and I would be a complete idiot to try and contact her, even with a standard Christmas Card).

Gamma,

I'm afraid you are more right than I ever considered until today. I checked the emails he sent me. They were beautifully scripted. He immediately threw himself groveling at my feet. All manner of "kissing up" to me. He said he thought I was a "great man", he's so sorry is not the same. What a load of baloney. He just doesn't want me to expose. Guess he thought wrong. I guess it's good that he's such a POS, I don't have to really worry about him contacting my WS again; he got what he wanted there, too much work to continue. I believe exposure will be to protect his next potential victim.

These are good EPs.

I would have all contact information changed so OM can't contact her.

Dr. Harley does not recommend Post nuptial agreements.

Extraordinary risky. She has already shown she can not be trusted with Facebook and her smartphone, and they should go. Your focus right now should be on affair-proofing your marriage and creating a romantic relationship together, not on fostering friendships.

Since she is on affair number 2, don't take the risk. Friends can wait.

Over the past few days, the following occurred:

1. NC letter was sent
2. EPs agreed to
3. Full exposure is done

I was afraid she'd shut down on me after it was all done, but just the opposite happened. Over the years, she felt I didn't value her, which I can agree I wasn't showing. By taking these aggressive steps to "win" her back, it just confirmed that she is more valuable than anything else in my life. Turned out to be a pretty powerful thing.

The fog of the affair is mostly over, she sees now what a ridiculous fantasy it was, and how the OM was taking advantage her and lying at almost every turn. As an example of her new found clarity, the other day she was changing the sheets on our bed and she remembered the night she slept with the OM, his bed was made. Up until that point, she thought "it just happened" or it was an "accident", now she knew he had planned all along to take her home to sleep with her. After all he is a single man that lives with his 13 year old son and the rest of the house was a disgusting mess, why would his bed be made? Maybe he just likes to make his bed, but most likely he had plans. She remembered he was the one buying her all the drinks and he was completely sober on the night her took her home. This might be TMI but I had a vasectomy years ago so she was not on BC. After the OM started his business, she remembered that she told him she was not on BC and it freaked him out. Let's just say he had a bunch of trouble...all that work for nothing. She says it was soooo bad. That's one reason it never got physical again, even though he tried. I call that poetic justice.

I'm not trying to be crass, I'm just surprised at how much she remembers after the fog lifted, and just as surprised at her complete honesty. She says being able to be completely honest about everything is a wonderful feeling. I returned fire with a few things in my past that I hadn't told her about before, specifically, the handful of times I went to strip clubs while overseas (now on my list of EPs). We've had so many open and honest exchanges over the past week that my head is spinning with delight...such a great feeling!

Once that fog cleared, she has really opened up. While she was in it, I couldn't get through AT ALL, and I tried everything. We are happily carrying out UA time every day, and it feels like we are really meeting each others EN completely. It's great to be married to this woman, I think now I'm just mad at myself for not meeting them before and for not having the EP in place after the first affair.

I am wondering if anyone has any pitfalls that we should watch out for. DD was four weeks ago. Is it too soon to feel this good? Where is my blind spot? I want to save this feeling between us.

I don't want to rob you of any good feelings. Enjoy the progress you have made so far. But (and you knew there would be a "but"), recovery is a looong process, measured in months and years, not days and weeks. Don't be disillusioned with setbacks when they come. They will come. You have the tools available here to deal with them.

Just a quick question. I finished "Surviving and Affair" and am looking for a good followup. Was thinking "Love Busters" since I think those are harder for me to avoid than meeting emotional needs (not easy, but easier). WW is willing to read anything I read.

Any thoughts?