You just posted what I was going to post, North

LonelyMan, your posts are couched in speculation. For example:

Did he tell YOU this? Where did this come from?

Tell us about his arrests and convictions for swindling. Tell us about your conversations with women he has swindled. Please give us specific information about financial losses. Have these women filed reports with the police department? Have warrants been issued for his arrest? Have you gone online to pull up his arrest record? What has he been convicted of?

I've seen nothing on this thread to indicate that he HAS an M.O., which makes him sound all stalky and devious. I'm still looking for something to indicate that he has done something nefarious. I'm not seeing it. I'm just seeing a consensual affair between him and your wife. He just sounds like your garden-variety user, to me. That's not a crime, although maybe it should be

Be aware, LonelyMan, that it is typical of a wayward wife to sell the affair as being the result of being "conned". Don't forget the fact that your WW is a big girl who made the decision to be unfaithful to you. She gladly chose that. Don't make her out to be a hapless Pollyanna.That will not serve you. She needs to come clean with you and be totally open and honest about her role in her affair. You need to understand that she entered into an addiction. If she was addicted to alcohol, you wouldn't blame the bartender, right? She needs to own her part of this. And you need to acknowledge that.

Have you exposed this affair to her family yet?

The other man has an arrest record for burglary (twice), harassment, reckless driving, and ignoring hunting and fishing laws (multiple times). His ex-wife had to take out a restraining order. I have documented evidence of all of this, as part of my background investigation of him (originally intended to allow me to expose on his side, but I got surprised by what I found out).

He also has been sued on multiple occasions. The input that he is a con-man comes from his other ex-wives, not just by wife. So yes he is stalky and he is devious, but my wife doesn't justify her affair based on this.
My wife's justification for the affair is based on the fact that I neglected her over the years and that we were (in her mind) no longer married except on paper. Strangely, at times she recognizes the truth of the situation, and owns up being an adulterer, but at other times she justifies.

She was convinced that I didn't love her and didn't want her, though nothing could be further from the truth. I built an emotional wall around myself, and this is why she left. I didn't meet her emotional need for conversation and affection, and I practiced independent behavior. I was a fool. My inappropriate behavior on the internet was just the straw that broke the camel�s back.

All this is not excuse for her behavior. Married on paper is still married, and at some point it will come to either re-committing to our marriage or getting a divorce. You may recall I didn't want to divorce because of the health insurance issue, and her battles with recurrent cancer. I also didn't want to do this because she is the love of my life, and I can't imagine being with anyone else. However, in the end if I can't meet her needs, I will have to let her go, but I plan to give it my all to save the marriage and be the husband I never was before. But it is a hard sell, given so many years of our history.

She was fooled into thinking this man was somebody he wasn't, and sadly that is the reason for the break-up, not that she wants to be back with me.

So despite the end of the affair, which I believe really has happened, I am still in a bad way, with much work to do to get her back in love with me.

By the way, she self-exposed to her family during the breakup period as she was looking to them for some physical safety.

Regardless, it would be good for you to give them a call. You need to set the record straight with them on the affair and what you are trying to accomplish today.

Who have you exposed to on WW's side?

What about OM's side?

Latest News, just to keep things intersting,

The OM attempted suicide yesterday.

I hope in convinces you skeptics that my wife really left the OM.

Problem is she just wants to be "friends" but will consider dating me. So there is hope, but she is still very skeptical and remembers just about every love bank withdraw that I made over 14 years. Its going to take a great deal of despoits to get back above the critical leve.

For this to work, her Love Bank needs to be open only to you. You are married - if she wants do "date" you, she can do it from under the same roof with complete transparency.

How do you two know OM attempted suicide?

There must be a venue of contact there?

...but will consider dating me. So there is hope, but she is still very skeptical and remembers just about every love bank withdraw that I made over 14 years. Its going to take a great deal of despoits(sic)...

I think you just supplied the alternative definition of Plan A, dude!

Can you steel yourself for months (years?) of EN outlay, prohibited from entertaining thoughts of seeing improvement? That's the deal you will be signing up for, amigo. It can work, if you're strong enough!
As for OM's suicide attempt, as one of the lucky few MB'ers with a dead OM, part of me would suggest a note to him not to get discouraged, and urging him to greater efforts in his worthwhile goal. But that would certainly get moderated.....

His suicide attempt should make you realise how you should be MORE skeptical about this being 'the end' of the A.

Affairees are crazy, impulsive, use feelings over logic and are depressed and trapped by their addiction. That's why affairs are so off again/on again. Your wife will also have heard about his message of undying love (how she will perceive it)

As to her reaction to Plan A; very typical WW reaction!

She can be won over and affairs are typically unstable, unhappy things which die a natural death.

Stay wary and stay on course and you'll be fine.

That's my question as well.

I would also second NG's "Better luck next time" card, but kind of doubt that Hallmark makes such a thing.

As I understand it the OM still had my wife listed as emergency contact. The ex-wife's club told my wife this is the 4th time he has attempted suicide. My wife is on to the fact that he is just trying to manipulate the situation.

This guy is as sticky as chewing gum, just as the ex-wife�s club warned me.

My wife, for the first time since the affair broke off, actually agreed not to date anyone else. This means she has met 2/3 of my conditions for starting recovery. She is not ready for the 3rd condition, my moving back in, so technically we are not in recovery yet.

Yes, I know she could be lying, but so far she seems a straight shooter since d-day. As Gorbachev said, trust but verify.

Does your "understanding" of events come from your WW?

This doesn't really pass the smell test. All the more so when you write this:


When was the last time you saw your child? Are now resorting to asking for permission to do so?

I wouldn't let this sit for too long. With her and the child living elsewhere, she is at an advantage legally and may well claim that you have abandoned them. Ideally, you are all together but next best is you and the child living together with WW leaving to find her own place in which to pursue her affair. See the difference?

..."Better luck next time" card, but kind of doubt that Hallmark makes such a thing.

A business opportunity! I'm on it.....

Here's the front:



...and the endearing sentiment inside:

POSOM:

I Understand You Had a Real Fright,
Looked Around and Only Saw the Night!
This Card Will Offer You,
Advice to Help You Through:
Pull Yourself Up and Do the Job Right!

That'd get a thumbs up from me!

Understand the abandonment angle, that is one good reason to move back into town.

My wife gives me free access to my son. I will be taking care of him this coming weekend, but no doubt she is primary care giver. However, I think she knows that if she hangs around with felons long enough, she will give up that right.

Right now thing are very amiciable. I don't belive in lawyers unless really needed. As long as she acts in good faith and is honest, I see no reason to escalate things. If she goes back on her word, that would be different.

But you and your son did not chose to leave the marriage/family. She did. So why should the two of you be displaced? Why should you and your son only see each other sporadically?

If she wants out, let her be the one that is out. Let her be the one that sees her child 50% of the time. Let her be the one that is missing out.

When you get back, tell her that you are bringing your son back to live in his home (emphasis on "home") and that she is welcome to join. Her "rights" to the child are no more than your rights, so don't let yourself believe otherwise. It is in your child's best interest to live in a stable environment away from the drama that accompanies an affair.

Watch how amicable she remains.

Nice plan, but prior to my wife's affair, we had a separation agreement that we both signed up to, so I am a bit out of luck here, unless the affair continues and she puts our son in danager. But I will ask for 50% time once I am in town, and see what she says to that.

Is this separation agreement something that was filed in the courts or just something that you guys printed off the internet, signed and stuck in drawer?

If the former, see what needs to happen to get it changed. If the latter, then who cares what you agreed to. Tell her you've changed your mind, that you and your son didn't ask for any of this and are going home. That if she wants to be a part of this marriage and family, then, for now, you are willing to consider it if she commits to a recovery plan.


Don't ask because we all know what she's going to say and that is something you only do if you hold no power over a situation. You have plenty of power here. He's your kid, too. Tell her that you're taking your son home and that she is welcome to join you both. If she wants to see her son, she can do it from your home.

I'm worried that you're setting yourself up for a false recovery here.

Ok while staying at wife's house to take care of our son, I went through her entire email history.

What she says about breaking it off with the OM is all true. The OM won't accept it, and thinks if he changes she will take him back (plan A for ex lovers?)

Sadly, I found that this affair is her second. The other affair lasted 9 months and ended in May, when my wife found out the other man had an other woman. My wife was so shocked that he would cheat on her that way. Ironic.

On the good news front, my wife and I spent two night together in bed, but no sex. She spent the weekend alone (not good) but has invited me to spend the remaining 4 nights with her. We have been affectionate and loving, but she wants to take it slow.

How recent is this continued "negotiation" via email?