Probably not, but he did make a good point about not chasing him, don't you agree? It usually makes the situation much worse and makes the chaser unattractive to the chasee. He was also making the point that since this is a very young marriage without much investment that it might not be worth the tough uphill climb. The bottom line, of course, is that you can't force your husband to come back.

Right, I understand that because it it's a young marriage he feels it might not be worth the battle, but honestly I'm not at the place where I want to just say it's going to be "to hard"
I do understand what he is saying about not being the chaser, and I guess I'll have to work on that.

And do you recall what Dr Harley said about how you are owed an apology?

Yes, but he has already apologized. He's actually apologized to the point where I've had to tell him that an apology is not what is going to fix things until he comes home.

But an apology without a willingness to correct the situation is not really an apology. It is an empty sentiment. I think what Dr Harley was suggesting was a sign of true remorse. Remorse would be demonstrated by a change of heart and behavior.

Hi bp

Have you ever spoken to your husband's exW or know anything about her other than what your H has told you? Given his behavior, he may have been the problem in their marriage. It sounds like you got involved with him way too soon regardless of the reasons for his D. How old is your husband?

I would not rule out the possibility of an affair. Sorry to say, but his behavior is the same of what some BSs have experienced. I would agree that it's best to stop chasing him and really think about what you will be in for if you try to recover this marriage...given all his issues, no children, and short marriage. If there is no affair, your H is displaying disturbing and immature behavior...and I would not blame it on the power booster drinks.

Hi Black_raven,

No I have never spoken to his exW. She moved out of state before their divorce was even final. I'm sure that there were issues on both sides of the marriage, he has never disagreed with that, but the main reasons for the divorce were her emotional and verbal abuse. It's not just him that has told me these things, I have talked in detail with many members of his family. Again this is not to say he is without fault in the divorce.

I'm not totally blaming the ephedra and energy drinks for his behavior, but as Dr. H said, when you already have a problem like his OCD and you take something that is exact opposite of what your system needs like the ephedra, you do run the risk of magnifying your problem. I'm not saying he isn't OCD when he's not on ephedra, because I'm well aware he is, but I have known him for a good long time at this point, and have never seen this severity of this problem before.

MelodyLane,

You are right, I do agree that an apology would only really mean anything if he is home and actually remorseful.

Thanks for clarifying.

I am divorced from a serial cheating husband but even before the adultery was an issue my ex displayed poor coping mechanisms and "intense" behavior that was killing our marriage. He is not OCD but exhibits mental/emotional problems...no official diagnosis. If you are dealing with a spouse like that, he has to be willing to help himself or there is no hope...and even then it may be a battle to deal with him.

What is your issue with his mother?

I would classify myself as "obsessive," and I identified immediately when I heard the description in the show that he "thinks there shouldn't be any discussion about stuff to do around the house; you should just see it and it should get done." It reminded me a lot of my thoughts and discussions with Prisca early in our marriage.

I haven't listened to your whole show yet (listening to it now). I just wanted to chime in immediately to say that, on this point alone, I can identify, and I think that a typical obsessive husband can learn to make the changes necessary to have a good marriage. It starts with learning not to be demanding, disrespectful (any sentence that uses the word "should" is disrespectful!), or angry about the things one obsesses about.

If you can get him obsessive about listening to Marriage Builders radio and putting this program into practice, that might be very helpful! (Ask me how I know.....)

Yep - I had to learn to stop offering apologies that did not involve any change on my part. The goal of an apology was NOT to make my wife feel better - because it wouldn't make her feel better to just apologize with the continued risk that I might keep doing the same thing.

My main issue with his mother is that she believes she is the most important member of the family, and treats him more like her husband, than her child. She has, on more than on occasion said that she doesn't care what her kids do, she just wants them happy(this isn't the "I will love my child no matter what" which I expect from a mother, this is the, my child can do amoral things, and I will not say anything to them because I just want them to be happy, if that means doing something clearly wrong, I'm just going to say "well as long as your happy").
She has a husband of her own, but instead of letting him do things around the house, she will call my husband and tell(not ask) him to do it.
Granted, the other issue with the above, is that my husband doesn't know how to say no, and we have talked about that. But, my mother, and most other mother's I've talked to about my situation have said once your child is married, their marriage has to become more important to you(as a mother) then your relationship with your child (e.g. your child needs to consider how things will impact their marriage before they consider how it will impact you, as a parent, and you accept that).
His mother takes the opposite view, that if he has free time, she has the right to fill it with him doing things with and for her, instead of considering he has things to do with and for us. I can't recall a single time in the years that I've known her that she has said anything different.

She has also take the opinion that "he is a grown man, I can't make him do anything, and if he needs a soft place(meaning living at her house) I can't(won't) do anything to take his "soft place" away.

I actually, although not her biggest fan, didn't have what I would consider real "issues" with her, until I saw her behavior the last couple months.

I'd say on the forums, we've found that in general women don't have a lot of luck turning their marriages around when they are the only ones on board with the program.

Thank you Markos, I knew there had to be someone out there with a happy marriage despite being obsessive.

I would LOVE if I could somehow channel his obsession in the MB.

I really think you have to set up a situation where, if he wants to keep his marriage, he's going to have to pursue you. Where if he wants to keep his marriage, he's going to have to turn that obsessiveness towards these principles.

He may decide that he does not want to do that - that it is not worth the effort. That's going to be hard, but that is not a decision you can make for him. If you hang on trying to make him do it, i.e., make up for his lack of commitment with extra on your part, you are only going to drive yourself nuts.

So I haven't been "chasing" WH since my discussion with Dr. H. Yesterday as I was finishing up my work day, he texted me and asked what I was doing. I said I was wondering how the work day wasn't over yet. He asked if I wanted coffee(he often brings me coffee when he comes over, so I figured he was going to meet me at home) I said ok, and he said, meet at the starbucks by your work? This stuck me as a little odd, considering his mothers house is 20 minutes west of our house, and my work is 45 minutes east of our house, and an hour from his moms. So I asked, what he was doing all the way out here by my work. He said he went for a drive, was that a problem. I said no, and met him after work for coffee. Would this be considered..."chasing" on his part? He also then called me about an hour after we parted to make sure I got home safely, and continued to text me off and on throughout the evening to see if I had eaten dinner.
When he suggested coffee I was honestly a little afraid he had something not pleasant to tell me, and didn't want to do it in our house, but when I was with him, it really just seemed like he wanted to see me.

I really think you need to put a GPS on his vehicle to find out what he's doing on these drives.

GPS Units

Also a VAR in his vehicle. VAR

I would love to be able to put a GPS or VAR in or on his car, however, the issue with that is he is meticulous with the upkeep of his vehicle. It is 100% clean 100% of the time, inside and out. If I put something on or in his car, even the underside of his car, he IS going to find it.

He is very very detail oriented(because he is obsessive compulsive) so he knows when something is out a place, and he knows where things should be all time. Example, a few days ago, I asked him where something of mine was, in the house, that I couldn't locate. Even after being out of the house for 2+ months, he was able to tell me exactly where what I was looking for was.

The best thing, I think would be if I get a GPS on this phone, but as I said previously, he doesn't bring his phone with him into places, never has, even before he left, and his phone was always out in the open, if we went out to eat or something, he would leave it in the car.

does anyone have any suggestions of how to place a gps knowing he is going to clean his car inside and out once a week(but not on a set day)? and I mean clean as in wash and vacuum, not just rinse off dirt.

I suggest hiding it inside one of the seats. Many cars have zippers on the backs of the front seats to allow access to the seat sensors. It may be possible to hide it in there.

Hmm.. thanks for the suggestions Eureka, I'll have to look at his seats next time I see him.