This is precisely it.

I grew up poor, I know how to support myself frugally and be content on minimum finances, but my FS need for my husband is different than that.

I think sometimes people get the idea that those of us who choose to be SAHMs for a long period of time will just be in the welfare office if our husbands buggered off tomorrow. That's not necessarily so - I am trained in a career that starts at $60k per year. However, it's just not a priority to us, my desire for FS doesn't mean I desire a lot of money.

I agree with you on that. My stance has changed during my marriage because I've had reason to define just what FS means to me. Much like some comments above, it's about shared values, cooperation with finances, common goals. I was a SAHM by choice but knew I could earn a living if I had to. It was never about keeping me in some "standard to which I'd become accustomed."

My husband lost his job, and it wasn't the loss of income that bothered me, it was his attitude about it -- knew it was coming for six months and did nothing to have something else lined up, and once he was downsized he waited out his non-compete clause (nine months) rather than making an effort to find a different job. And took an expensive trip "because others were counting on him". All while we were living on credit cards. Since then, he has the well paying job he was waiting around for and we're planning for him to achieve his life-long dream next year. However, he won't cooperate on the budgeting that allows us to save for that, makes poor financial decisions completely against agreements we've reached, and complains about the things we "can't" do compared to our friends.

So financial support to me is now defined very differently than I had considered it early in our relationship. And it ranks much, much higher now for me. However, trying to ferret out his commitment to financial support would have taken me nowhere -- I honestly believed right up until he lost his job that he was the type who would do anything including a paper route to support us. The IB, however, which permeates everything is the real key. I just didn't know then what I know now...

If the men you're finding want sex before marriage, then..."These aren't the droids you're looking for..."

This is EXACTLY was I was trying to get at, Deacon, with the list below:

These are indications that the man will be stable, not impulsive or completely self-centered, i.e. a Marriage Builders man!

Gents, please weigh in: I hear men complain about women's need for FS. But I see FS as an indicator that a man will be a good partner in general. Do men see this differently?

Yea, not those "goods", but if she wanted to, she can use my tape measure to determine how long my 7 foot propeller is, then use that information however she sees fit.

Seriously though, you have some serious wit. I suspect your #1 EN is WIC. No, not women, infants, and children: Witty Intimate Conversation.


<Added your quote to wikipedia, referencing you as the source>


Wow, honesty, self reflection, learning from mistakes... Don't see that much anymore.

My exWW still blames all of our marital problems on me. She is right in that I didn't meet her needs or treat her the way I should have, and that created the environment for her affair, but I think she glosses over the fact that the affair itself was her choice.

This raises the question about how to deal with the past while dating. Has the topic of your past come up with any of the men you dated? What did you say?

I've had one girl ask why I got divorced and I told her that I didn't treat my exWW wife very well, and that she responded with an affair. The shock from that event sent me on a quest to try and save the marriage and learn to do things differently, but she went down a different road with other male relationships and independence. In the end she decided that divorce was the solution so I let her go.

I explained that I have spent a lot of time working on myself, and that I will not repeat that mistake, but it is my past and I'm going to be honest about it.

She said that she felt comfortable with my answer. It makes sense because any man that had his wife leave him, that claims that it was all her, is lying or clueless.

I have wondered if that is an arrogant answer, but on the flip side, I really did try to address my issues and make the marriage work, but it's just not possible with a renter in the fog.

ak

It wasn't arrogant. It was the truth. I suppose your delivery may affect whether your date perceived it as arrogant, but it doesn't sound like it to me.

You absolutely cannot go wrong if you stick to an honest, genuine answer even if it includes sharing something about yourself that you are not proud of.

It re-enforces the fact that you DID learn and you're going to apply it to your future relationships.

Yes, IC is my #1. And if it's witty, then all the better! Just your run-of-the-mill Elizabeth Bennett lookin' for my Mr. Darcy.

Thank you! I've always wanted to be Wiki-famous. Maybe Ed Snowdon is my perfect match?

Totally understand this. In fact, it took me a few years to acknowledge the same. I don't know why, but I had so much resentment built up, I blinded myself to my part. An unfortunate time in my life, for which I am heartily ashamed.

I've struggled with this. The two men I felt more 'connected' to both got "the speech" after a few weeks. But it's difficult because dating relationships are so fragile and rarely work out. I save "the speech" for a man I might actually see a future with, as soon as I think there may be 'a future.'

A man who said this would have my empathy and my serious consideration. In fact "dream dude" had a very similar story (though with a GF of 7 years, not a wife), and it made me respect (and love) him even more.

I believe that the stories people tell about their break-ups & exes say more about their character than almost anything else. So I listen very, very carefully to these stories.




....what am I DOING?!? This thread is supposed to be about $$$$$$$$$.

[Back to our regularly-scheduled programming]

What a great book. Not long ago I read it because IC is #2 on my list and I really like the old-but-witty style of writing. Yea, I'm I dude, no escaping #1


Heh, I call him batman. He isn't a bad guy, but not really a good guy either. Regardless, I'm thankful for what he did.

For years I have wondered how good AES encryption was, and if the government could break it. Now I know.


Yea, but 7 years? Dream dude sounds like he may have been a renter.

Once I find a girl that meets my needs, who is a buyer, that I feel confident I can meet her needs will get the proposal with the quickness. I'm ready to start growing the greener grass in my back yard, and building a new fantastic life together.

Anyway, Happy Thanksgiving to all of my MB friends!!! I hope you all have peace and much to be thankful about!

Here is a little glimpse into my world, a picture I took a few years ago, I hope you enjoy it:



Note: I was not in an airplane. I was standing on that mountain top when I snapped that one. I only wish the picture captured half of what I saw.

ak

Ak have you watched North To Alaska yet?

Wow ak how beautiful!!

Yes, good point, ak. He told me he wanted to marry her (asked) but she kept putting him off. Then she cheated on him (ish, they weren't married). Made me sad.

Gorgeous photo!

So, here I am getting kind of excited about a partner at the firm who (I've been told) likes me. He's started emailing and IM'ing me, and we bumped into each other in the cafeteria today. He seems pretty shy, but I really like him so far.

The point is, I know he is financially secure (he's one of our top lawyers). This is all I know about him, other that he is not arrogant (not overtly anyway) and strikes me as a kind person.

My little heart is actually hoping he'll ask me out - and I'm hoping it's not just about finances. Actually, all the dudes I've dated have been pretty well-off...

I don't like admitting that FS is one of my ENs. It seems so shallow. Glad you asked, ak. This one is a struggle for me.

I totally know what you mean, I don't like admitting that physical attractiveness is one of my needs.

On top of the shallow feeling it produces, it makes things more complex because the physically attractive women are constantly being pursued, so they tend to either be very skeptical, or know how to use men.

So did the partner dude ask you out? What do you think of him?

ak

Wow that's some kind of commentary on our society when you are embarrassed to admit that being a good steward of the gifts you're given is one of your top ENs. I am glad that you're setting the bar high.

He has not. He's emailed and IM'd. I'm not a patient person...I feel like if he hasn't bothered to ask me out for a simple drink, then he's probably not interested in me. I'm moving on

Good point, NED. I'll keep on keeping on.

Isn't it funny how your heart sees the opportunity for the relationship you really want: your needs being met along with the desire to meet the needs of someone special to you.

Then it passes and you feel a little sad?

I'm in this boat too with the girl I've been talking to. We have been txting/emailing/calling for months and I absolutely adore her, but she is so far away and is still holding out for reconciliation because she is intensely loyal and wants what is best for her kids.

Part of me wants to limit contact with her and move on since it doesn't appear that she is available, but I don't want to since she is everything on my list and more, she has expressed a bit of interest, and totally worth waiting for.

Some situations will be coming over the holidays that may sway her, so I'm just going to wait for a bit longer, but I admit, it's hard not to think about it.

That's a toughie.

I am convinced there are "more fish in the sea." But I've also experienced first-hand that many of those fish wouldn't work for me.

So it is difficult to let go of the 'idea' of a certain fish with 'potential.

Sorry ak.

I don't agree. Some people need to be dragged out by the hair kicking and screaming all the way. Often the best ones are like that. Try telling him you are going to a particular exhibition or a talk at the library. You can always open the conversation by asking him if he has seen it yet. Then state when you are going. Let him invite himself along. Works a treat :-)

Zhamila, if you like him, ask him out. Maybe he thinks you're not interested