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Freeloader is unwilling to put much effort into the care of his or her partner in a romantic relationship. He or she does only what comes naturally and expects only what comes naturally. It's like a person who tries to live in a house without paying rent or doing anything to improve it unless the person is in the mood to do so.
Renter is willing to provide limited care as long as it's in his or her best interest. The romantic relationship is considered tentative, so the care is viewed as short-term. It's like a person who rents a house and is willing to stay as long as the conditions seem fair, or until he or she finds something better. The person is willing to pay reasonable rent and keep the house clean but is not willing to make repairs or improvements. It's the landlord's job to keep the place attractive enough for the renter to stay and continue paying rent.
Buyer is willing to demonstrate an extraordinary sense of care by making permanent changes in his or her own behavior and lifestyle to make the romantic relationship mutually fulfilling. Solutions to problems are long-term solutions and must work well for both partners because the romantic relationship is viewed as exclusive and permanent. It's like a person who buys a house for life with a willingness to make repairs that accomodate changing needs, painting the walls, installing new carpet, replacing the roof, and even doing some remodeling so that it can be comfortable and useful.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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You are not objecting to him having friendships, you are bothered by him having OPPOSITE SEX friendships, and who wouldn't be??? It is disrespectful for him to disregard your complaint about this. You could find a solution that makes you both happy, by spending the time TOGETHER and YOU becoming his friend. Obviously this is the optimal answer since you are his wife after all. This is one of the main things I've been trying ever since I realized he had developed a bond with her. (In addition to introducing him to other men.) The problem is, he spends much of his time at home either moping, or angry with me, or withdrawn, so it's next to impossible for me to meet his needs. How do I do that in that situation? If he places this "friendship" before your marriage, Dr Harley would tell you to separate from him, before it destroys your marriage entirely. Anything that comes before your marriage will eventually come between you, and it is already beginning. The fact that he wants you to lose at his expense demonstrates a freeloaders approach to marriage that won't sustain a marriage. I have no doubt he is as thoughtless in other areas of your marriage. Check this out: When to Call It Quits - Part 1
x2 Unless a dramatic turnaround in his mindset occurs, you will not only suffer affairs in your marriage, but his thoughtlessness will continue to rob you of a happy and fulfilling marriage.
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If he places this "friendship" before your marriage, Dr Harley would tell you to separate from him, before it destroys your marriage entirely. Anything that comes before your marriage will eventually come between you, and it is already beginning. The fact that he wants you to lose at his expense demonstrates a freeloaders approach to marriage that won't sustain a marriage. I have no doubt he is as thoughtless in other areas of your marriage. Check this out: When to Call It Quits - Part 1
I will look at this over the weekend. Thank you guys for all of your help.
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But.....that is not rational. Asking him to stop hurting you is not making him suffer. It never should have started in the first place. He wants to win at your expense and that is a freeloaders philosophy that will wreck your marriage. But is there any way to help him see that? I asked him to read this site, and he finally did, but he just thinks it's wrong, and that he knows his intentions, and nothing bad will happen. And he thinks my insisting he not have this friend is me winning at his expense. How can you get a spouse to see the other side? I don't know how to force someone to care about your feelings against his will. The only thing I can suggest is taking steps to protect yourself from his thoughtless behavior. The fact that he places a friendship above your marriage should be very telling to you.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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I don't know how to force someone to care about your feelings against his will. The only thing I can suggest is taking steps to protect yourself from his thoughtless behavior. The fact that he places a friendship above your marriage should be very telling to you. Well, he says that if he has to choose between her and me, of course he will choose me, but he feels extremely resentful towards me for making him lose his friend.
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Don't listen to him, he is already in the fog. You are taking away his drug, of course he will resent you. But this is the only way your marriage will survive.
FBW 36 (me)
DH 35
DD6,DD4,DS1
On Recovery
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I don't know how to force someone to care about your feelings against his will. The only thing I can suggest is taking steps to protect yourself from his thoughtless behavior. The fact that he places a friendship above your marriage should be very telling to you. Well, he says that if he has to choose between her and me, of course he will choose me, but he feels extremely resentful towards me for making him lose his friend. His resentment at losing a 'friend' is nowhere NEAR the resentment you will feel if he continues this inappropriate relationship, which will eventually turn into an affair.
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It is a short step between him resenting you and him flat out telling you that he would take their side over yours. That is what I experienced. This is not a minor thing, and you are not getting the care you deserve as a wife.
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If this were my H I would tell him that his inappropriate relationship had to end, and this was non negotiable. I would ask him to move his job path so that he no longer interacted with this woman. Furthermore, I would tell him that if he wanted to be married, he would need to forego OS friendships in the future. And if he was not willing to protect and safeguard my sense of safety and my feelings and our marriage in this way, I would be separating.
I would also call the OW and tell her that it is in her best interest to stay FAR away from my H.
But that's just me. And I have suffered an A, and have learned my lesson the hard way. Do not learn this the hard way.
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I don't know how to force someone to care about your feelings against his will. The only thing I can suggest is taking steps to protect yourself from his thoughtless behavior. The fact that he places a friendship above your marriage should be very telling to you. Well, he says that if he has to choose between her and me, of course he will choose me, but he feels extremely resentful towards me for making him lose his friend. His resentment is not the problem, though. YOUR resentment will ruin your marriage. Your resentment will last forever: Effective Marriage Counseling pg 112 - 113
What about Resentment?
One of the most common objections to the POJA is that it creates
resentment when it�s followed. I agree; it does usually create some
resentment. But far more resentment is created when it is not followed.
An illustration will help make this important point.
George is invited to watch football with his friend Sam. He tells
his wife, Sue, that he plans to accept the invitation. Sue objects.
If George goes ahead and watches the game, he�s guilty of independent
behavior. He is not following the POJA, and Sue will be resentful.
When George does something against the wishes of Sue, I call
her resentment type A.
If George follows the POJA and doesn�t accept Sam�s invitation,
George will be resentful. When George is prevented from doing something
because of Sue�s objections, I call his resentment type B.
Which type of resentment makes the largest Love Bank withdrawals:
type A or type B? The answer is type A, and that�s why the POJA
helps build Love Bank balances. I�ll explain.
When George violates the POJA, Sue has no choice but to feel
the effect of the thoughtless decision (Love Bank withdrawals) for
as long as memory persists�possibly for life whenever the event is
recalled. But when George follows the POJA, the negative effect is
limited in time. It lasts only as long as it takes to discover an enjoyable
alternative that is acceptable to Sue.
George lets Sue know how disappointed he is with her objection
but is willing to discuss other options. Sue wasn�t invited to watch
football and doesn�t want to invite herself to Sam�s house, so she
suggests inviting Sam and his wife to their house to watch football.
George calls Sam, he and his wife accept, and the new activity puts
an end to George�s type B resentment.
Type A resentment can last forever, but type B resentment stops
the moment a mutually enjoyable alternative is discovered. Those
with poor negotiating skills may have trouble seeing the difference
because they have not learned how to resolve conflicts. They may
feel resentment about a host of issues that have been unresolved in
their marriage. But after you teach a couple to negotiate successfully,
unresolved issues are minimized. Then it becomes clear to
them that the POJA helps build Love Bank balances by eliminating
type A resentment.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Well, he says that if he has to choose between her and me, of course he will choose me, but he feels extremely resentful towards me for making him lose his friend. I would take him up on that offer. His resentment will fade once you learn to effectively meet his needs.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.
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FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.
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Snooping is VERY necessary; the man is pining for her before your very eyes.
He misses her so much that he doesn't even see how breathtakingly disrespectful it is to mope around like a love sick teenager before his wife's very eyes.
You say he does not consciously acknowledge romantic feelings but romantic feelings don't have to be.
Like any primal need your body drives you there without consulting your brain. You plan to diet but end up scoffing four doughnuts without realising what happened.
He feels miserable because he is in love. He is demonizing you and belittling your feelings so can put an end to his misery and recontact her. He won't be honest with his wife when he does this.
He had not been honest with you while the friendship was developing. He was not telling you about his day because he us not a radically honest person.
The fact he is capable of hiding his tracks electrically does not make me feel better.
I think if you were to snoop right now you would find an EA at least and good reason for him to leave his job and end all contact.
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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NB do not call him a love sick teenager!
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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"I care very much about your feelings for another woman. It makes me anxious that you have developed them."
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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If he places this "friendship" before your marriage, Dr Harley would tell you to separate from him, before it destroys your marriage entirely. Anything that comes before your marriage will eventually come between you, and it is already beginning. The fact that he wants you to lose at his expense demonstrates a freeloaders approach to marriage that won't sustain a marriage.
I have no doubt he is as thoughtless in other areas of your marriage. Oh my goodness I wish I had internalized all this when I got here back in '05! Instead I dragged my kids through an increasingly thoughtless marriage for 4 more years. You and your H can develop a marriage of mutual care though! What UA do you two have planned for this weekend?
Me 40, OD 18 and YD 13
Married 15 years, Divorced 10/2010
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Well, he says that if he has to choose between her and me, of course he will choose me, but he feels extremely resentful towards me for making him lose his friend. I would take him up on that offer. His resentment will fade once you learn to effectively meet his needs. Oh yes, run with this!!
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Well, he says that if he has to choose between her and me, of course he will choose me, but he feels extremely resentful towards me for making him lose his friend. I would take him up on that offer. His resentment will fade once you learn to effectively meet his needs. Oh yes, run with this!! Actually, this was what he said about a month ago. And then he kept trying to negotiate.
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I have read all of those, and they make a lot of sense. After much drama, he agreed to read this one, but it had no effect on him.
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