What do you do when you and your spouse have personal issues that get in the way of meeting each other needs?

For example, I have some anxiety/OCD that makes it really difficult for me to maintain an "acceptable" cleaning/cooking regimen to meet my husband's need for domestic support. I try to combat it with counseling, creating schedules for myself, etc. but in the end I feel overwhelmed and inadequate and like a failure. These feelings are my own, and then exasperated by my husband's disappointments. I feel like I can never make him happy because of my anxiety.

In a similar way, I'm sure, he has his own issues with meeting my emotional needs. He is not a very affectionate person and he shows very little admiration for things that I do. I have always felt like this need has been unmet, at least to the full extent that I need it. No matter how much I communicate this, nothing changes, and if anything, it gets worse. Sometimes he downright refuses to be affectionate because I ask.

My husband also has severe anxiety about spending money. This is something that he has had ingrained in him since he was young and he doesn't have any desire to change it, even though it causes many problems for us. I have moved his way a TON and become VERY financially conservative, but his level of obsessiveness about money is out of control. The amount of guilt and blame that he puts on me destroys my feeling of love for him. He doesn't seem to care either. It feels as though money is more important to him.

We are basically out of love. How can we possibly restore this feeling if we have personal issues getting in the way of meeting each other's needs?

And secondly, how can I possibly get him on board with the POJA if he refuses to find solutions that we can both get behind (usually because of money). He seems enthusiastic to find a solution at first, but then doesn't make suggestions and does nothing, which by default makes him the "winner" since he almost always wants to do nothing. OR he says that he agrees/is enthusiastic about something and goes along with it, even though he is not. This lie results in him throwing it back in my face later as a sacrifice he made for me.

I am the first one to admit that I am rather passionate and enthusiastic, sometimes to the point of missing out on his feelings, but it is NEVER my intention and I ALWAYS press for him to share and work my hardest to accept. He has even told me that it's a big reason why he married me - that he trusts that I won't sweep things under the rug like he does. But when I try to address things, he just resists and blames.

Any advice? How can we do this?

We have the 3 books of Dr. Harley's. I visit this site when we have issues, trying to stay grounded in solid advice rather than listening to my own "taker." But I'm tired of being the only one enthusiastic about solving. It isn't working.

Hi scaredwife, welcome to Marriage Builders. Are you and your husband actually familiar with this program? It sounds to me like you have so many issues that have gone unresolved that you have fallen out of love. And I would presume you are not spending 15+ hours of undivided attention time together per week?

Some of the major problems I see here are that you are both trying to meet needs in a way that kills romantic love. For example, the way you try to meet his need for domestic support surely does not make you happy. I would find a way to meet this - VERY MINOR - emotional need that does not make you unhappy. Even so, the EN of domestic support is not one that creates romantic love. That need can be met by a cleaning lady.

A husband can learn to meet his wife's need of affection using this program.

But first, I would try and sell him on this program. If you can sell it to him and you are both motivated, we can help you turn this around. If you can't motivate him, then you should strongly consider signing up for the Marriage Builders program. My H and I went through this in 2007 and we have a great marriage today. I motivated my husband to join by finding something about our marriage he did not like and showing him how MB would solve this. Maybe you can do the same.

I would not delve into the POJA first, though. I would focus first on eliminating love busters and filling each love banks, by getting 20 hours of UA time per week. Going out on 4 - 4 hour dates per week, meeting the top 4 intimate emotional needs will make the greatest impact on your love banks. People are much more motivated to negotiate when they are in love.

Thank you for your advice. We have begun the program on our own. Like I mentioned, we have dabbled before, but never fully committed to the entire thing. A quote in the workbook stands out - something about action therapy being greater than insight therapy. Before we gained insight, and we relied too heavily on our internal motivation to turn that into action rather than creating a system of accountability. We are excited to fully commit now and see what it does for our marriage. Finding the 15-20 hours is tough, especially with young kids, but we will figure it out. We have figured out ways to get some every day and some in chunks. Anyway, thanks again. I'm sure I'll be back with more questions. Should I use this same thread if I have further ones?

Yes, continue to use this thread. It will make it easier for the people who post to you to know how to advise you.

I'm very glad to hear ya'll are going to commit to the entire program. It saved mine and markos' marriage, and I am positive you will see some great results. I am a highly anxious person, too, btw.

One of the most common pitfalls newcomers to the program have is to cut corners when it comes to UA time. The program WILL NOT work unless UA is followed -- the entire program hinges on it. The recommended way to get UA is to go out of the house on dates, 4 times a week, for chunks of 3-4 hours. UA is most effective when done this way. If you stay home, or only get 30 minutes here or there, UA will not be good enough in quality to fill your lovebanks.

You need to be out of the house, looking your best, and having fun. It needs to be the BEST time of your week, something that you look forward to.

So, if you haven't done so already, start looking for babysitters.

When you are ready, your problems could easily be resolved using PoJA. For example, you aren't enthusiastic about a heavy cleaning schedule and you should listen to that instinct because it is not an effective way to build love.

I should imagine it would be easy to sell PoJA to a careful spender - not a penny spent without his enthusiastic approval! Barring health and safety spending of course.

If you were to 'do nothing' in the way of DS it may motivate your spouse to spend money in that direction, since it is his need and he will feel the lack.

We are responsible for finding ways to get our own needs met.

For example, when he does nothing it motivates you to fill his love bank and get marriage advice yes? Because you feel something is lacking.

The 'do nothing' stage is actually quite important for creating the need to do something.

So find ways to enthusiastically meet his needs. It's important to keep yourself cheerful.

Find a way to meet each other's intimate needs on 15 hours dates a week - and this need not cost anything!

If you plan on just diong what you were already doing, but "counting" it as "UA time," I want to assure you nothing will change. Most couples absolutely REFUSE to do this step so they go into a pencil whipping exercise that goes much like this:

spoke on the phone for 30 minutes: 30 min
had conversation on couch at 10pm after kids in bed: 1 hour
made dinner together and ate together: 1 hour

In other words, they count dribs and drabs and then wonder why they see no difference in their marriage. Please don't fall into that trap. If you want your marriage to change - AND THIS PROGRAM DOES NOT WORK WITHOUT COMPLETE ADHERENCE TO THE UA POLICY - then you need to sit down and schedule 4 - 4 hour dates out of the house per week. At first that will seem daunting, but after about 6-8 weeks, you will be champing at the bit to get even more time.

This is one step on which you cannot cut corners. It just doesn't work.

Have you seen this?
The Critical Importance of Undivided Attention

Well this is just disappointing. It certainly makes sense that you need to spend lots of time together, but I don't know how anyone can possibly afford 4 out of the house dates per week. Childcare and food alone that would be $200 per week, assuming you spend $30 on dinner each time (conservative bet) and pay someone $5 an hour to babysit (which is probably not enough). Are you all really spending $400 a month on dates? It really seems financially irresponsible. I have a hard time believing that Dr. Harley would say that at home dates aren't going to count. Plus my husband and I really don't want to spend that much time away from our kid. She goes to sleep at 7 (probably 8 by the time we have dishes cleaned up, etc), so we technically have 3 hours from when she goes to bed EVERY NIGHT that we could be using without having to pay anyone. What about hobbies that we can do at home? We like woodworking, playing cards, among other things. We went through the interest inventory and made a list of date activities and home activities, and surprisingly FROM DR. HARLEY'S LIST, we found just as many activities we agree on that we can do at home as we found out of the house date ideas. We certainly won't get 100% of our time at home, but I don't see why we can get a lot of it. Plus, if we are supposed to be meeting the need for sex during that time, does that mean that none of you have sex at home in your own bed? This just seems really unrealistic. I really doubt that any of you follow this advice.

In addition to woodworking and playing cards, how about the hobbies of cooking and home remodeling?

My husband and I used to spend hours in our home on remodeling projects. We worked on everything together, as a team. I am convinced that that time was quality recreational time and was mutually beneficial. Since we finished the projects and had a child we have been missing that time. But by your definition that shouldn't have counted. DESPITE home remodeling being on Dr. Harley's list.

And where else do you cook but at home? That is sometime my husband and I are really excited to learn how to do better, and we always do it together. Why shouldn't that count? We are considering purchasing some cooking DVDs and watching them together, finding recipes we will enjoy, doing the grocery shopping together, and then cooking and eating together. Why wouldn't this count?

We already do woodworking together. I mean that isn't a new hobby for us. We haven't done a project in a while but we always enjoy it when we do. We do that in our garage. Why wouldn't that count? We plan the project together, shop for the lumber together, set up, clean up, build it, finish it. All together. Seems like it should count.

I'm not talking about counting 30 minute phone conversations, or even the lunches and breakfasts we share every day. That is family time. I'm talking about real hobbies here. Ones that Dr. Harley even includes in his list.

I also don't see why *some* family time can't also work as recreational companionship. Our daughter is only a year and a half old, so when we do recreational things with her as a family, we do things that both my husband and I enjoy. Obviously I don't want to count all of that. But for example, this past weekend we spent a few hours at the zoo together as a family. We had just had a huge fight the night before and spending that recreational time together really built us both up. I don't think that all of our family time should count, but I don't see why some of it can't, like in that example. Obviously when our daughter gets older and more verbal, she will take more of our mental focus away when we are spending time together as a family, so less and less of that time will be bonding time for me and my husband. But it was the other day and I see a few activities like that that would be awesome for us. Examples: going swimming as a family (planning to join the YMCA and go swim twice a week), going bike riding as a family (our daughter would ride in the bike trailer behind one of our bikes).

My husband and I don't spend a lot of time apart. Almost none. He works 40 hours a week and I have one night class that is 2.5 hours per week, but other than that, we are together, either alone or with our daughter 100% of the time. I realize we need to make a conscious effort to go on dates and spend specific, appointed UA time together, but saying that we need to go out of the house on a date 4 nights per week just isn't the only way to do it in my opinion.

Oops, I miscalculated. That would be $800 per month on dates if you didn't spend any money on your recreational activity and only spent $30 per meal and $20 for childcare. NOT HAPPENING.

I'm not a vet but I have exprience with finding UA time available. We have three little kids, a 8yr, 6yr and a1yr. The older girls have afterschool activities three hours three days a week. We drop the little one at my parent's for this time, but we could hire someone.

We do not spend more than $10 at our UA time, no way. That is a lot of money. We share desserts if we are at a cafe, or we do something for free, walk around the mall( now that is cold) or in a park.

Family time does not equal UA time, as much as I love my little munchins, there is no way I would enjoy being with hubby if I had my three little monkeys with me, they are a handful. You only have one babe, but it can still distract you from your hubby.

You can look around for cheap daycares or sawp with your neighbors. There is definitely ways to add up on UA time, but you have to actively look for them.

I can certainly attest that 15hrs of UA makes a difference, do not spare on it. At the begining it feels like a daunting experience trying to find 15 hrs, but the results are well worth it. Even your little girl will benefit form it.

Are you in love with your husband?
Has your way worked?

We have been through this program, talked to Dr. Harley himself, and are telling you what we have learned from him AND have put into practice. We are deeply in love with our spouses because of this.

No one is going to force you to do it this way. But don't expect results if you cut corners.

Finding the 15 hours isn't tough. Like I said, we don't really have much on our plate at the moment, no independent hobbies. It's just justifying putting our daughter in someone else's hands for that much time. I mean we would potentially miss 4 out of 7 dinners per week with her. That is something we are absolutely not willing to give up. We value our family time, just like we value the time we spend together as a couple.

I agree that family time can't be primary UA time, and perhaps none of it, but I still don't think that 4 hour out of the house dates 4 times a week is reasonable.

What are we going to do for 4 hours that doesn't involve eating ($$) or spending other money? I don't want to walk around the mall or even a park for 4 hours. That's just boring. I can see doing that for maybe an hour or two every week, but not 15-20.

It's honestly a lot about not wanting our daughter to be in someone else's care for 20 hours a week. That's a part-time job. Not reasonable.

.Nope. We've got 7 kids, too.

Making your marriage a priority is not financially irresponsible.

Believe it or not, he does. I have spoken to him about it.

Then don't expect UA to work. The program WILL NOT WORK unless you put this effort into UA.

Frequently, actually


It is very realistic, and is followed by many of us who have saved our marriages.

I don't doubt that you are completely in love if you spend 20 hours a week on out of the house dates. Makes sense. It's just far from reasonable for us.

$800 a month? You really do that? What on earth do you do if you don't spend that? How can you go on a 4 hour date without eating?

Who would willingly send their kids somewhere for 20 hours a week on top of the 40 they already work? (I stay at home with our daughter, so that isn't our situation, but I know that it is most people's.) My husband only gets so much time with her since he works a 40 hour work week. So to give up 20 of that and pay someone to watch her AND pay to eat out is just unreasonable.

Did you read my other comments? Our plans of how to get lots of UA time at home? Not only are those activities ON DR. HARLEY'S list, they are activities we are both enthusiastic about.

I am honestly taken aback by the idea to "not expect this program to work" if you don't go out of the house on dates with your spouse 15-20 hours a week. We just don't have that kind of money. AND if our daughter's sleep schedule gives us a minimum of 3 hours per night, plus 3 hours of naptime on the weekends, I don't see why it couldn't be JUST AS QUALITY to use that time doing at home dates - with activities that Dr. Harley approves.

I'm not talking about "counting" 30 minutes here or there. I'm talking about intentional date time, just spent at home.

It is realistic for us too. I have more kids than you, including one with autism. It is self-serving to think that a child needs SO much parental time that romantic love between parents cone 2nd or 3rd or...

Kids grow up and leave. They start to prefer peers to parents. Nobody complained their parents had too much romantic time for each other.

Most parents, me included, balk at the idea at first. It becomes a habit. Kids like babysitters, families, friends.

What is your long-term goal? To be part of that "we grew apart" empty nester divorce rate?

I trade babysitting for tutoring. Moms without teaching degrees could easily swap with other moms, or take in an extra daycare kid. Special needs babysitting pays double.

If what you say is true, this program must be the program for millionaires OR you go on FREAKING BORING DATES.

Why would Dr. Harley include woodworking and cooking and playing cards and home remodeling if home dates weren't allowed?

Also, stop saying it's realistic. Spending $800 a month and leaving our child with someone else for 20 hours a week is NOT realistic. Maybe it is for you, but we aren't millionaires and we actually CARE about spending time with our daughter.

You can have someone come over when you child is asleep and go for dinner, bowling, dancing, a concert.

Myabe going to dinner every date is not doable money wise. But you can look for hobbies outside your place. Being at home, you are easily distracted. You need to be 100% on your H

You are being really rude. We are not self-serving. So much for getting SUPPORTIVE marriage advice. You all are really condescending. Our marriage does come first. But not $800 a month first. We can't afford that.


Again, you are being really rude. Stop making accusations. SHAMING us or insinuating that we don't care about our marriage isn't going to help us.

Please stop replying to this thread so someone more supportive can. I really don't care to hear from you anymore. You're not being supportive. You're being alienating.