Yes, you are right that not being radically honest is a big Love Buster, so you had better tell her right away. Tell her who you have been flirting with and give her the information she needs to identify these people.

Why haven't you mentioned this flirting before?

I'm concerned she's having sex with you while out of love as a quick fix. Does she seem genuinely enthusiastic or is this 'trying hard' for your sake? The comment about feeling like a bad partner is telling.

It's a good way to sell her on UA time too. No sex, or porn until you are dating and bonded. Unenthusiastic sex isn't going to meet your need anyway.

By doing nothing she'll have to confront this issue without sexual sacrifice.

I did mention it in my original post, sorry for the confusion, it was in a different thread.

"[almost total lack of SF for 15 years] makes me feel lonely and unattractive. I have found myself lately getting on dating websites where people 'rate' your photos for attractiveness, or flirting with colleagues on occasion, just seeking validation that I am desirable. I also can't help but wonder, although I think it's very unlikely, if my wife would consider infidelity later in life. "

Actually flirting is probably not the right word, it was simply being more friendly with female co-workers than I ordinarily would be, talking about things that didn't relate to work like their weekends, smiling, etc. Normally I am very work oriented in all my dealings at the office so for me this was a stretch. I recognize this is still looking to meet conversation and admiration ENs outside of marriage so totally not appropriate.

Though she is not the one to initiate I would say she has been very enthusiastic about half the time, the other half she's been a little more neutral/tired. She wants 2-3 hours of TV time to zone out once the kids are in bed so SF ends up being at late hours, like midnight, so no wonder. Predictably the more enthusiastic times were at the end of actual date nights or nights where we spent time talking rather than watch TV.

But she's not one to hide her feelings. Per my original thread I lived through 10-15 years of "No way!" replies to my initiating sex without any interest in 'trying hard' for my sake. Honesty is her top EN and has always been one of her most clearly defining characteristics. I don't think she would fake enthusiasm or agree to sex unless she had at least some genuine interest.


Understood, but I don't think withholding sex would be a motivator for her to spend more UA time or go on dates. In fact the longer the stretch of time between SF, the less interested she seems.

So, are you going to tell her?

Based on the resounding feedback from you all, yes I think I will. I do anticipate it will drive us further apart so I may be returning here for further advice.

Thank you for your help and talking things through with me.

Prisca, could you give me some insight into your thinking here? I'm not challenging your advice by any means, but would like to understand what brings you to this conclusion. If her top EN is honesty and this is a recurring thought I am having that is bothering me, is it not something i should tell her?

Thank you Markos, this is what I'm trying to do at this point.

- In addition to spending all my time with her, at the TV or otherwise, continuously gently suggesting that we take on other more dedicated forms of UA time, Is it worth continuing to bring up "I am somewhat/fairly unhappy in this marriage. I would like my ENs for admiration, affection, SF to be met and I would feel so much happier." ? At what frequency to bring this up, daily?

- the original reason for my posting was a consistent lack of SF. After talking things have gotten a little better (once a week, or every 2 weeks, I always initiate but she seems enthusiastic at least half the time). But what do I do all the other times that I am in the mood and I sense that she is not? This is kind of gross to talk about so forgive the explicit nature of my question - I've done away with porn, but what about masturbating while thinking of her, is that an acceptable form of SF that would minimize the damage to our marriage?

And to what extent should I be honest with her about what to do about SF when she's not in the mood question? discussing with her how else to have SF seems like it would be a difficult conversation no matter how I articulate it, probably offensive and/or perceived as laying on guilt.

Have you told her about your flirting yet?

Not yet.

When are you going to?

It's very important you do.

You asked about being honest about a non issue - something in the past which is dead and buried - but this is a pressing and relevant issue.

In fact the seeking of ENs outside marriage is what's probably prompted you to look into her past for justification.

Just be honest. You are unhappy and need her attention on this problem!

You can't solve this one on your own.

Don't expect much success, then.

I will, I have not yet.

Success with what? The relationship overall?

When will you be telling her?

There's wisdom in what you say, you may be right. But I have had those feelings since day 1, they're not recent.

My wife is periodically referring back to the years before we started dating (ie. her high school and early university years) as being 'the best time of her life'. Not because of the guys she was dating back then, but just because for her those were her most exciting and carefree times. Her mind goes back there, so does mine, seemingly for different reasons though.

I'm hoping to tell her on the weekend when we have some time alone together.

I've recently told her about my long-term porn use, esp. over the last few years, and getting on a dating site last year just to see how my photo was 'rated' as a way of validating that I was still attractive. She did not react much to that news. But I suspect flirting, however innocent (I don't even think the women in question would have even thought of how I was behaving as flirting in any typical sense of the term)... anyway I honestly don't know how she'll react.

You see, I see no point in digging up her past before you were married in the name of radical honesty, when you will not even be honest with her about what you are doing while married.

Your flirting is a whole lot more serious to your marriage than her pre-marriage relationships.

OK thank you for clarifying. I thought perhaps it was just general advice that after so many years a person's flirting/EA/relationships are not worth revisiting, or that a woman/man's pre-marriage relationships are not their husband/wife's business.

So in my case, should I share instances of flirting pre-marriage? And during our time living common law? (yes, we were 'renters'

Should I describe instances in detail, ie. "Once I went to lunch with a client. Over lunch I smiled at her frequently in hopes she would smile back, as if in some way that would validate that I was still attractive. I cracked a few jokes and she laughed - that felt nice. Otherwise I have not seen this person for year and our company does not do business with her. Her name was XYZ. I did not have any serious intent with this person and nothing materialized, but I realize that it was very wrong, disrespectful, and dangerous to our marriage."

Or keep things very high level, ie. I exhibited 'flirty' behavior in a half-dozen instances over the last X years.

How far do I go back?

I imagine I should not include any explanations or justifications for my behavior, only objective descriptions of the behavior itself?