Looking for advice from a womans point of view. Whether you have been cheated on or cheated yourself I am looking for some advise on my situation. At the end of the day I chose to stay but I live with the burning question will this ever happen again and trying to wrap my head around why it happened and who and what I am to her today. If your interested in helping please read this very long story and any advise would be appreciated.



So here is my unfortunate story... I am a 35 year old guy and have been with my wife for 14 years now married for 6. We started dating when she was just finishing high school so we were young. We were very connected in the early stages but we were also young and immature. She was a very jealous type and I still wanted my independence along with the relationship (guys nights out etc). We both treated each other great at times and not so great at times and did our fair share of fighting. I always thought we had this connection that kept us together. Last year on her 30th birthday my friend who is a total player cheats on his wife constantly has always had a thing for her (my stupid fault for staying friends with this Ahole). She has always had a huge crush on him too but I never really saw or noticed. I was completely na�ve in thinking we loved each other and nothing would ever happen. I had asked him to babysit for us so I could take her out for her bday. He texted her to say happy birthday and they started chatting. She was totally smitten and just threw her self at him and he happily accepted. I have not always been the best husband and she was equally not the greatest wife. We did not communicate or really fulfill each others needs. I always knew we would have to address these issues one day but just didn't act soon enough. They had a 2 week thing until I caught them. She used me to make this happen as I was the only real access to her being with him in person. We went out with him and his wife for dinner and UFC the week after it all started and she was rubbing him with her foot under the table right beside me. She followed him to the bathroom every chance she got and finally she met him coming out and they kissed quickly. That week they did a lot of sexting and texting. They only talked on the phone a couple of times and once was for an extended period. She tried hanging out with him during the day as she works from home but since he knew there was no opportunity for sex he made excuses why he could not. She knew who and what he was as we have talked about it before but just ignored it as she was having a lot of fun and excitement. I became completely invisible to her and she painted this horrible picture of me in her mind to maybe ease her conscience. She saw nothing wrong with what she was doing and was just being very selfish. She had sex with him once during the 2 weeks. We went out again the following weekend drinking and Karaoke and I saw her looking at him a certain way. He went to the washroom and she followed. They were gone for a while and I knew something was up so I went and caught him just leaving. She took him into the womens washroom into the stall kissed and BJ. I believe she enjoyed the physical part but also it was a way to keep him interested in her.



It took a few months for me to finally unravel the whole story as all I knew was the karaoke night. After that night we talked about our relationship and I immediately changed everything I was doing wrong. I work for her dad and we have 2 kids I didn't want to break up my family and lose my career. I also very much love her I always have. She has had a much harder time changing her part of the bad marriage and is realizing how much of it was actually her issues as well as mine. I have been sticking with it working very hard helping her work on her issues as I told her you have to change or I will not be able to stay. She has been doing very well but more work to be done... She has shown an incredible amount of remorse, shame and guilt. To the point she goes to pretty dark places every time we talked about it and is very self loathing when she is confronted with what she did. She never once made any effort to talk to me prior that she was unhappy. When he texted her she had no interest in trying to fix our marriage as she was really into the excitement and had complete disregard for our family and figured she wouldn't get caught.



I have struggled with this every day the pain and horrible feelings are the worst. Like so many others I struggle most when I am alone driving to/from work etc. It has gotten a little better but I am so badly hurt and damaged by what she did. Since I have lost 35 lbs changed my look and everything about me as a husband. I truly believe she loves the new me. My biggest fear is will this ever happen again down the road. If she is ever confronted with a similar opportunity and feel confident she would not get caught will she do it again. Is the excitement she had like a drug once you have had a taste it would be hard to turn down. What is a woman's perspective on all of this as men just don't think the same or understand women...

Hi Burned13, welcome to Marriage Builders. There is a very, very specific path to recovery. It this path is not followed, repeat affairs are typically the result. If the problems leading up to the affair are not resolved, you will end up with a crippled version of the marriage that is worse than pre-affair and more vulnerable to another affair.

A couple of questions before I show you the steps, though. Was the affair exposed to the OM's wife, your family and friends? Have you and your wife cut off all contact with this couple? Do you EVER see them in any capacity? How far away do they live?

Thank you so much for reading and replying!!! I exposed the affair to his wife yes indeed. My wifes family knows mainly because I work for her dad and had to take sudden time off work on D day. My family and our friends do not know as far as we can tell. We never see them at all but they do live close. We avoid that part of town at all costs. I think she does not carry any kind of feelings for him. If she saw him in public I think she would walk away but is she still insanely attracted to him I don't really know. She tried to connect with him and he pretty much shot her down. How to be a player 101 do not let them get clingy right? e.g. after she slept with him she asked him in a text hey I don't really know you what are your interests and his reply was long walks on the beach. She did realize that was BS and said lol and that was the end of that conversation.

Thanks for answering. One of the big reasons for the affair is that your wife has very poor boundaries around men. Most affairs occur because of opposite sex friendships, but in this case, it was a couple you associate with. So she will really need to CHANGE how she communicates with men. She absolutely should not have opposite sex friendships and you should be leery about even associating with couples since that is the environment in which she had an affair.

I would get the book Surviving an Affair and diligently follow the program in that book. That means, affair proofing your marriage, meeting each others emotional needs, eliminating love busters and spending 15-20 hours per week on DATES meeting the top 4 intimate emotional needs. That is what it will take to recover your marriage. Otherwise, your marriage will always be crippled.

Here is the checklist of extraordinary precautions from the book Surviving an Affair.

From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.

That "work" should all be devoted to affair proofing your marriage and creating a romantic, passionate marriage. We call that just compensation.


I don't want you to be assured or distracted by her "remorse, shame and guilt" because none of that changes bad marriages. What changes a marriage are action steps to prevent another affair and give just compensation to the betrayed spouse.

Are you still in touch with the OM's wife to make sure there is no more contact?

Burned13,

You wrote, my friend who is a total player cheats on his wife constantly

So drop a dime to the betrayed husbands of the women he cheated with previously, perhaps one of them will either run him out of town or break his legs with a baseball bat.

Have you exposed OM widely? To his employer and relatives?

God Bless
Gamma

Does the POSOM's Betrayed Wife know about all of his previous affairs?

She should know the type of danger her serial cheating excuse of a husband is so she can sort out her life too.

LTL

Put OM on a cheaters exposure website.

The A was a boundaries problem. Be more protective and aware this can happen. Ensure she is transparent with you and her life is daily entwined with yours. Like us your naivetes about your 'connection' being a protection have been stripped away.

Has EVERY list item been checked?

Will your independent guys nights life style change? When a woman is not involved in every aspect of her husband's world it creates a void.

First I can't tell you how much I appreciate your help on this. I see you reply to a lot of people and it is a great thing your doing. I don't expect you to continue to help but I very much appreciate it. Even if you can read this when you have time you seem to know what your talking about and any additional advise would be very appreciated. I have been suffering gut wrenching hurt for over a year now. After she was caught she of course blamed me for everything telling me all of my short comings. I have pointed hers out and it has taken all this time for her to really realize her part bit by bit. I made it clear and I think she understands it was not my fault at all. She could have talked to me but she wanted the quick selfish fix of the excitement.



My faults and I admit to all of them.



Did not pay enough attention to her

issues from our past that she hung on to

we were in a rut looking after the kids and not taking care of us (no excitement date nights etc.) She was as much to blame for this one also

I failed on attending to her love languages and did not give her the affection she needed

I did not help her nearly enough and support her with the kids, house and day to day

I let myself go a bit gained some weight and just didn't put the effort into my look (she gained some too but always finds a way to look good).



She also hated her job and felt alone with that.

Family issues and again felt alone with that.



She is not the type to act she needs someone to guide her along.



My actions



2 days after the karaoke I had us enrolled in ballroom dance classes

I immediately started helping her with day to day with the house, kids and everything else. I can honestly say rock star husband over night.

I immediately started paying attention to her love language needs (we went to some counselling).

I dropped 35 lbs and changed my entire look. If I showed you a before and after it would blow your mind. It does to me every time I see it.

I addressed our past issues even as far as calling an old friend of mine from an issue she had with him from 10 years ago. I did not support her when he was an Ahole to her so called him right beside her and admitted what he did was wrong and I should have stuck up for her.

We started going on date nights and I went as far as going on You Tube and learning how to dance at a club type thing. I stood in front of the mirror at 5am before work everyday for 3 weeks to get it right.



Her faults



She has anger issues and does not know how to handle anger, stress and frustration

She talked at me not to me so communication was non existent and she was a little aggressive at times.

She complained a lot about everything and is kind of the victim type. If she explained a situation and my advise was not what she wanted to here she would get mad at me

She is very loving and affectionate but when her button is pushed there was no talking to her

She started fights and was just a mean selfish person when that button was pushed. She would act out in front of friends and not think twice

She was not giving me what I needed as far as love languages even after the affair

I had as many or more passed issues with her





Her actions



She has recognized the selfish behaviour and is making an effort to do better (still working on it)

She has recognized the anger issue and we have struggled with that one but again she is making an effort

She has made efforts to provide me with more of what I need to help rebuild myself. I have to communicate to her as she is not very good at going above and beyond to really make an impact on what I need. The effort is real I am not making excuses for her but I still feel a little short changed

She tries very hard not to complain as much and when I tell her she is "venting" and I am at my limit (I say it in a much nicer way) she is much better at responding

We have closed the books on her past issues

She seems to be excited about the new me and I have really blown her away a few times to really grab her attention again. I am of course skeptical...



I struggle with the question was she ever really in love with me and am I really the guy for her, or am I just safe and reliable and she hasn't had the right option to leave. Is this new me really enough and better than the scum bag she had such a crush on (the OM). If I am not THE guy for her deep in her heart what is going to stop her from doing it again? I work for her dad and it is a high level career and we have 2 kids. I grew up in a broken home and vowed to not let that happen to my kids. Life is very complicated but I am sick every day thinking about what she did and how she did it. I am sick of the thought she might do it again and am I really it for her. I feel all the horrible feelings everyone in this situation feels and I want some relief... Her remorse has been intense to the point she goes into almost a nervous break down. It is very real and maybe the only reason I am still around as the job and kids are not enough to suffer for the rest of my life. Thank you for listening melodylane any advise would be appreciated

Every item except the letter is checked off. I almost feel like I don't want her to have any contact with him at all and it has been over a year. Is it important at this point? If you read my last response to melodylane you will see much more of the story. I am completely exposed here but I need the help. I have not had an independent lifestyle for years lol so yes check that one off too. Yes there is no protection at all and that scares the s*&^ out of me... He is definitely out of the picture phone number and email address changed. She is transparent with me as far as I can tell I have access to her phone and all accounts FB email etc. I will never let my guard down again trust me on that one. Thing that kills me is he is scum. Remember he was my friend so I know everything about him and his dirty secrets. She should have known that but he was way hotter than me and probably always will be (but I have closed the gap considerably She felt unhappy with her whole life (kids job family and me) and said she needed to escape reality and go to fantasy land. Yes I told his wife everything she chose to stay and told me to stay out of their lives lol. Her mistake.

indiegirl what is your experience? Have you been in this type of situation before?

From a womans point of view to anyone helping out here why did she do this and do you think she would do it again. I know impossible questions to answer but as a woman knowing the way a woman thinks and feels... Any thoughts anyone?

Burned, I am sorry for your pain. There is no guarantee your wife will not cheat again. No one has a guarantee about that but implementing EPs and having strong boundaries will greatly reduce the opportunity to make an affair possible. Cheaters cheat for a variety of "reasons" but at the end of the day they made a choice to do what they wanted (often thinking they won't be caught) and simply don't care about their spouse, children, reputation, etc.

As for the OM being scumbag...your wife likely knew she could sleep with him given that she already knew he was a scumbag.

Welcome to MB

Burned13, whether or not she was in love with you is a moot point and I will explain why later. I suspect what happened is that she fell out of love because your marriage was neglected. Most married people STOP doing the things they did when they dated, and after about 5 years they fall out of love. They put everything before their marriage, careers, kids, the lint in the dryer; everything comes before it.

What we can teach you is how to fall in love again. Having a romantic, passionate marriage is not a matter of accident or hope, it is a direct RESULT of a lifestyle that creates and sustains romantic love. The KEY is:

1. affair proof your marriage by following the guidelines on the checklist
2. eliminating ALL lovebusters
3. meeting the top 4 intimate emotional needs for a MINIMUM of 15-20 hours per week out on DATES [without children or people]

If you will do all these things, you will create a passionate marriage [takes about 8 weeks] and the bad memories will fade into the past. When a person is happy in the present, their mind does not tend to wander to the past.

And I agree it is not necessary for you to send a no contact the OM since contract ended a year ago.

I am concerned that you have full and complete access to absolutely everything, i.e.: her computers, cell phone etc. Do you? I would also strongly suggest you get spyware on her phone that has a built in GPS. That will help you relax and trust her again. [eblaster is a good one] She should never know about this.

You can go through the MB program in several ways. Some, like me, could not do it on our own, so we went through the Marriage Builders course. You are assigned a coach who takes you through weekly lessons spanning a year. Dr Harley supervises this program directly.

If you are both diligent and committed, you can go through this program on your own using the books, workbooks and questionnaires. If you ran into trouble, we could help you on the forum AND/OR you can email Dr. Harley on his radio show and solicit his input. [for free] You could get all the books/workbooks you need for around $45.

It is very possible to answer why. She cheated because she has pisspoor boundaries around men. She allowed another man to meet her needs. That is WHY. It really is very simple.

I would expose to your family and friends. You (and even W) get the support you need and W can be held accountable. I would remedy this ASAP. Are any of your friends mutual friends of OM and his wife?

How old are your children?

Unfortunately the story might be slightly different but waywards are all the same......

Believe it or not this is it in a nut shell, you would not think the answer would be that simple but it really is. Listen to Mel she knows her stuff and has been giving advice for a long time.

What do you mean by bad boundaries? Does that simply mean that she allows herself to be excited by what she thinks are good looking men and allows herself to act e.g. flirting and sending the signals she is available? If a guys cheats it is often a matter of lust. Just wanting something new and sexually appealing as far as I know. Is it possible she did it just because she was hot for him and wanted the physical sexual experience?

No!!

Read up on boundaries on this website.

Boundaries are simply not allowing yourself to be in a situation where a member of the OS (opposite sex) could possibly meet any of your emotional needs.

She was HOT for him because she allowed him to meet her needs. That is what caused her to have feelings for him. That doesn't happen by accident. A woman might admire a cute guy in passing but that doesn't mean she is HOT for him and wants to sleep with him.

She flirts with men and has personal conversations with them, inviting them to meet her needs. That is why she had an affair.

So, the issue is that she allows men to meet her needs and she INVITES that inappropriate attention by flirting and having personal conversations with them. Unless that stops, welcome to your future!