How important is it to believe that the marriage builder's process will create romantic love and have certainty about that from the beginning? My wife and I have been married 28 years. About a year ago I felt like I had had enough. I felt like I was dying - emotionally and physically, and can't recall being romantically in love since being married. I think we have both been too passive - haven't experienced conflict - although I think for me at least the conflict has been internalised. I certainly feel in the withdrawn stage.

Having now discovered this awesome website and working through the exercises I have hope for our future. We are both learners and into personal development. We have read all the articles, listened to the videos and read the love busters book. His Needs, Her Needs arrived today! Last year I had private conversations with two females that I now see as getting my need for conversation met apart from my wife - so I'm guilty of emotional affairs - I now know this was inappropriate and have removed myself from those relationships.

We have both done the love busters questionnaire - there is a lot that I have done to 'Love bust' our marriage - so great to have plenty to work on! I couldn't find anything other than two little annoying habits as love busters that my wife does.

My wife has observed that I am not totally convinced and has expressed her feeling that if I'm not totally committed to believing it will work that it could be just an academic exercise for me. She encouraged me to ask the question whether my lack of certainty will hinder a positive outcome of romantic love which we both desire. She has expressed that she is totally committed to seeing it work and is open to the changes required for her to meet my emotional needs now we have the knowledge from your books and website. (I don't yet have clarity on what my emotional needs are - there are things I currently think might be my emotional needs that I can't imagine her meeting - maybe my emotional needs will change and she will meet then - right now I have doubts and I just don't know.)

My understanding is that if we work though the material together that given 6 months romantic love should show up and if it doesn't them we'll face that issue then. I am committed to working through the material - I have also got to the point in my life of not being prepared to settle for a relationship without romantic love. I'm OK that it takes time and I would prefer to develop genuine romantic love with my wife. I'm not totally convinced at this stage that the process will work - I think it will require us both to change significantly and that leaves the outcome to something that neither one of us can control.

I have hope for our future - I don't have certainty. Do I need to change my belief and have certainty? If so how do I do that? If not what do I say to my wife?

RLPA, you will believe it when you SEE it. Obviously you are not going to believe it before it happens. I only believe it because it happened to me and because I have seen it happen hundreds of times over the past 14 years on this board.

Dr Harley often says that people who are in love don't believe they will ever fall out of love and people who are NOT in love don't believe they will ever fall back in love. So, you are no different than most couples who show up here with one reluctant, skeptical spouse.

It works out, though, if the couple is willing to follow these step strictly. Feelings follow actions. The ones who cherry pick, pencil whip, cut corners, do not make it.

The KEY to the program is getting in 15-25 hours of undivided attention time meeting the top 4 intimate emotional needs of conversation, affection, recreational companionship and sexual fulfillment. If a couple will commit to this step every week, eliminate love busters entirely and learn to negotiate using the policy of joint agreement, they will fall back in love. If a couple REFUSES to follow the policy of undivided attention, they will not fall in love again. So it is absolutely essential that you schedule 20+ hours per week out on DATES in order to fall in love again. There is a worksheet in the workbook, Five Steps to Romantic Love, that should be used to track this: here

The emotional needs that will make the greatest impact on the romantic love in your marriage are the intimate emotional needs, affection, conversation, recreational companionship and sexual fulfillment. I would focus on becoming experts in meeting those needs out on 4 - 4 hour dates every week. You can read up those emotional needs in your book His Needs, Her Needs.

I would start, however, with the book Lovebusters, because if you are committing love busters, it will completely negate your efforts at meeting needs and make your dates miserable. You will be pouring "love bank deposits" in the top of the bucket, but any lovebsuters represents a hole in the bucket.

Thanks Melodylane - appreciate your feedback. We are both committed to putting in the undivided attention time. We're both having some trouble identifying our top two emotional needs. For my wife there is actually 5 that are really important:
Affection, conversation, honesty, financial provision, and sexual fulfilment. For me at present I think they are physical attraction, recreational companionship, and conversation.

Question: are we complicating things by tying to identify our own top emotional needs or should we just concentrate on the 4 you have mentioned: conversation, affection, recreational companionship and sexual fulfilment?

Yes, just put aside the matter of emotional needs for now and focus on becoming GREAT at meeting the top 4 intimate emotional needs. That is where all of your focus should be during your dates. I would focus specifically on very high quality dates, outside of the home. A good way to kickstart this is to take a romantic vacation together. Would that be a possibility?

And how would you rate your wife on physical attractiveness?

This is the most important thing to work on. We have seen people navel gaze for years about how to rank their emotional needs, and they don't recover love in their marriage. When Dr. Harley works with a couple, he focuses on the couple following the Policy of Undivided Attention and learning to meet the four intimate emotional needs (recreational companionship, intimate conversation, affection, and sexual fulfillment). Regardless of how they ranked their needs. If something else is very important, it will be easy to cover it later on, after the POUA is being effectively used to meet those intimate four.

The most important thing you can do is start following the POUA.

Thanks so much Melodylane your feedback is very much appreciated.

I'm not sure on the romantic vacation! Sounds wonderful, I think we have more progress we need to make first.

Rating my wife on physical attractiveness is a challenge. I feel confused and uncomfortable with the question and ramifications of doing so. My wife has said one of her love busters is dishonesty. I have been dishonest thinking that if I spoke positive things about my wife that I would come to believe them and they would be affirming for her. I didn't do it very well, my wife has felt a lack of encouragement and affirmation - maybe because she knew it was not coming from my heart and/or maybe because there was insufficient of it! Since reading marriage builders I have started being more honest. So far it has been painful and I feel even further disconnected from my wife. She says that it's the truth and it's good that it comes out. I wonder if it is the process that is required and it will feel worse before it gets better....

I also wonder if my lack of appreciation of her physical attractiveness is my problem - we have read "Getting the Love you need" by Harville Hendrix and I wonder if I have inappropriate expectations from some childhood issues??? Or am I just being selfish?

My wife has kept her body in great shape compared to her Mum and most of her sisters who have weight challenges. I'm grateful for that. She doesn't look much different in shape since we were married 28 years ago. I feel like I should be more appreciative of what I have got. I also know that I'm no Brad Pitt! I'm skinny and hairy! My wife is definitely not ugly or obese. So my mind tells me I am ungrateful and blind to her beauty.

These are notes that I wrote in agreement with her from a conversation we had yesterday, "She sees herself as attractive and says that others see her as attractive (and have told her so), but I don't see it. Unless she looks the way I want her to look I will never see her as attractive. I don't see the outward and inward beauty that is currently there, there is an openness to further develop the beauty that is there, but she doubts that it will ever be enough to satisfy me."

I think she is probably right. However I think that there are deeper issues. I feel that if we enjoyed doing life together, if there was 'Chemistry' - romantic love, then I wouldn't care as much about how she looks. I feel like we are disconnected at a deeper level in our beings and that makes it harder for me to see the beauty that is currently there.

Here's some of the 'honesty' that I have confessed: On the night of our wedding I saw her naked for the first time and thought 'Oh no, what have I done?' By a few weeks into our marriage I wondered why we had married and had the realisation that if we had known each other better we would not have got married. (We had a short courtship and engagement through autumn and winter seasons only) Being both Christians we took our vows seriously and made a conscious decision that even if we were not a good match we would make it work - we both felt that we had no other choice. We both cried out to God, continued praying and endeavoured to make it work. Unfortunately we didn't have the benefit of marriage builders back then!

More honesty: I have felt embarrassed and disappointed that she would not wear a bikini to the beach, clothes with strap tops, or show much cleavage. We have now recognised that this came from Christian teaching she received earlier back. I never felt right about pushing the subject as I felt like it was me who had the problem. She was pure when we married, I was not - so it felt like I was the one with the 'sex' problem, wanting my wife to look inappropriately seductive. So I sucked it up and grieved. I cannot remember ever feeling proud of her appearance in public. One time it came close - about 20 years ago, together we bought a 'pink dress' it had a split up the leg, showed a little cleavage and although it covered her shoulders it did look GREAT! Unfortunately I had no idea how risqu� it was for her and I didn't protect her. She wore it to a family wedding. What I didn't know was that a family member was very disparaging making some comment about her looking like a hussy. If I had thought better going to a family wedding was probably not the best outing for the pink dress! I think that dress may have got another outing or two, but then according to my recollection she told me that she didn't feel comfortable wearing the dress and she felt like God was telling her it had to go. I felt like I was in no position to argue. My wife has a different recollection and was really shocked to read this as she cannot recall telling me God told her it had to go but can recall us discussing the dress. The dress went and since then she has never worn a dress that did anything for me. The funny thing is we talked about it a few months ago and her comment was that she loved that pink dress. I was floored - how could that be true and if it was how could we have mis communicated so badly for so long. We have agreed to buy another pink dress! Our first attempt at looking was stressful - the only dress I liked (black thin strapped, no bra - her words) she said she would not be able to wear ***EDIT*** We will try again!

Another area this effects is our recreational companionship. We have done the questionnaire and found 12 things that rank 4 or above. Our top two that we both ranked 3 are Salsa Dancing and Dining out. Getting honest about salsa dancing - as much as I enjoy it, every time we go dancing I feel disappointed and grieve - so no love bank deposits! Salsa is a seductive dance and I feel like my wife doesn't yet know how to do that part. Firstly I don't get a wow when I look at her - then when we dance it feels more mechanical than sexy. What's worse is in the classes we rotate partners - so we both get to dance with other people who 'feel' the dance - when I dance with my wife that feeling is not there for me. I recognise that it is probably as much or more me than her. I think that if I was more manly or better in some way I could draw that out of her. (My wife says that when she dances with the other experienced dancers she feels sexy and they draw out of her the ability to enjoy the sensual part of the dance but it is a safe place as they are not inappropriate with it, it does feel a little uncomfortable at times for her.)

I prefer that we both sleep naked - yet I don't like to look at her naked. She has picked that up and we have talked about it. For now she wants to cover up, in her words 'to protect herself'. I feel like my honesty is destroying anything that we could do together to create the romantic love we both desire!

I would love her to grow her hair long like she had it when she was younger - she is now aware of how important this is to me. Being 56 years old, her thoughts are the style she had when she was younger does not seem appropriate now and she says she is open to looking at new styles with me and has specifically told me she will discuss this with me before having her next hair cut . I'd like her to use more makeup and wear more jewellery, I'd like her to wear more feminine and revealing clothing - but all of that I feel is superficial.

Probably what's more important is what I feel is communicated from her being. At that level I get conservative and boring. However recently I see that has been changing and I'm very encouraged by that. Last year we both read 'Intimate marriage' which from my perspective awoke sexual desire in her! (ironically the tables have turned and I'm now the low desire partner) Before Christmas we both skinny dipped from our yacht and I sense more of her true self is emerging.

I'm left with my own question - How do I be honest, recognise the beauty that is there, and draw out more?

How can I have a romantic date with someone that I feel emotionally dead around, that I have little desire to have sex with, that the recreational activities that we both enjoy have conflicting components. Yet at the same time I recognise that my wife is an amazing person, with a special uniqueness, a tender heart for God, a connection with her purpose in life, she is wise, perceptive and is a fantastic Mom to our two beautiful daughters!

Do you look at porn?
Do you look at and enjoy any woman besides your wife?

I would be absolutely beside myself if my husband danced the Salsa with another woman, and then went and compared me to her.

You are never going to be able to find your wife attractive if you allow other points of comparison in your life.

If you follow Hendrix�s recommendations, you will not �get the love you want� because his program [which did not work for him] dictates you just suck it up and not require changes in your spouse. That is sure fire path to lose the love in your marriage.

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What could she do to be more attractive to you? And do you watch porn? I will just tell you that if you restore the romantic love in your marriage, you will find her attractive. Here is a quote from Dr Harley about this issue:


The "deeper issue" is that you have not created/sustained romantic love. It does not happen by fairy magic, but by DESIGN. We will teach you to "connect" in a romantic, integrated, passionate marriage. We will teach you to fall in love.

And if you were in love, you would find her very attractive.


Not sure why you felt �embarrassed� but you should never demand she wear something that feels uncomfortable to her. She should wear things you BOTH feel enthusiastic about.


You need to cross this activity entirely off your list. It most certainly does not complement your marriage, NOR IS IT undivided attention.


It sounds to me like you are using �honesty� as an excuse to bludgeon her. Do you want her to be in love with you? Then you need to stop being �honest� when it is hurtful. And if she does not prefer to sleep naked, then drop it. Most women I know don�t like to sleep like that.


It is not superficial at all, however, you seem to be missing HER DESIRES in all this. This is not a one man show. You should both dress in ways that you are BOTH enthusiastic about.


You use this program and start acting in ways that will CREATE romantic love. Feelings FOLLOW ACTIONS. Romantic love is not some magic fairy dust that happens to you against your will. It must be CREATED. It is like quitting smoking, at first it doesn�t feel right, but after a while it becomes second nature and the rewards are VAST.

You've done it once with the pink dress. Find ways for her (and you) to dress that you are both crazy about.

I think it's quite possible that you need lovebank units to really see her as desirable. That can often happen. You keep using the word 'sexy' to refer to what's lacking in her dancing, demeanour and attitude to clothes. If she was in love with you there would be a very sexy attitude coming your way!

I think this plan will work wonders for you.