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Let me get that straight:
Exacly the same action is consideread an EA when two people are married, and is considere perfectly okay when two people are not married.

Forgive me, but that just sounds plain stupid.

But all I stated were the facts what are happening and I am asking for possible solutions.

She has fallen out of love. She is tearing down our family with one hand and building another with another hand. She is confused and doesnt't feel anymorte. I have to move out.

Can someone please tell me that this is right or at least logical?

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You really need to read "Buyers, Renters, and Freeloaders".

Nobody said that deceit in relationships is "perfectly okay". But it is necessary to understand the dynamics of your relationship if you are to have realistic expectations for it. Not being a buyer has consequences.

Your best hope for restoring this relationship is to try to win her back, but that will not be enough to secure it's future. You will both have to become buyers. That is why you should read the book.

Also, you need to avoid disrespectful judgements. Saying your partner is "confused" is a DJ. She is a renter who thinks she has found a better place. If you can convince her differently, then you are free to try. You still need to respect her freedom to choose what she wants. As long as you are not married, she (and you) retain the right to choose someone else. That is the essence of what it means to be "not married".



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Originally Posted by namad
Let me get that straight:
Exacly the same action is consideread an EA when two people are married, and is considere perfectly okay when two people are not married.

Forgive me, but that just sounds plain stupid.

No one said it is ok to be deceitful. But when you are not married, you are a free agent. Her relationship with this new guy is just as legitimate as your relationship since you never married her. There is a huge difference between being married and living together. HUGE.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by namad
Let me get that straight:
Exacly the same action is consideread an EA when two people are married, and is considere perfectly okay when two people are not married.

Forgive me, but that just sounds plain stupid.


Namad, the problem is three fold:

1) Now that a new point of comparison has been found - she doesn't ever remember being in love with you. She has never formally vowed that she was going to be with you forever which exacerbates that problem. There are no pictures to remind her of a day when she was committed and in love, no ring on her finger which she can feel every time she uses her hands. There were no witnesses to the commitment who would be useful in exposure.

If you were to expose to anyone they would just shrug and say 'so what?' They have no idea if you were ever serious or if she simply got pregnant accidentally to the wrong guy.

Since exposure is the #1 tool this is a severe problem.

2) Since the relationship was formed informally it can be dissolved informally. She decided to be with you when she was in love, equally her not being in love is enough to dissolve it.

3) She never actually did decide to be with you forever. She decided she wanted to live with you, be in love with you and have children with you but only for as long as it was rewarding and she felt in love. Neither of you took the precautions to safeguard against the problem of falling out of love (see 1 and 2). She's always been free to go whenever it became unrewarding and loveless. Trying to tell her otherwise or treating it like an affair is annoying and will drive her batcrap crazy.

It will be creepy and controlling for you to name yourself a spouse figure while she does not agree and has never made a formal agreement for you to be that guy.

The past is the past and I'm not criticising your decision in any way. I know your agony is just as severe as mine was when my husband betrayed me. More so, because of the kids. At least I had the memory of him looking so sure on that day - I do so very much feel for your predicament in not even having that.

However this situation is what it is is and your chances are higher and will be more effective if you treat her as a woman who is free to choose (making yourself the best choice!) rather than treating her as someone who is bound to you - because she isn't.

I would not leave either btw. Abandonment of the children legally. See a lawyer.


Last edited by indiegirl; 01/28/15 10:50 AM.

What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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***edit****

Last edited by JustUss; 01/29/15 08:49 PM. Reason: Removed old link

What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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mrEureka, MelodyLane, indiegirl thank you. I have accepted that she wants to be without me and I am treating her as such, which basically means I do not question her choices and actions and just let her be her own person.

I understand it very well logically, it makes sense and it is true. Emotionally its a different story and I need to get myself back to balance.

As for the current situation, I have left her in peace in any way she has asked. I am being nice and we get along. Its cold in the house, but I am giving her space.

The hard part for me is that objectively, she changed from warm chatty person who used to come and hug me every day, into distant and cold and she won't even look me in the eye anymore. It happened overnight and it is really painful. I do understand that she is free to do and be with anyone she likes, but I am still in love with her and its freaking killing me inside.

Now: I have a dilemma. I stay, and watch her every day and die a little bit inside BUT I see my children. Or I leave, stay away from her, start healing and NOT seeing my children. It is an impossible choice, one that I cannot make right now. Yet waiting also doesn't improve anything.

So I have no choice currently but to treat her well, which I actually want also, because I hate to see her in pain. There are no good choices. I just fail to understand, why must I lose everything I love just because she fell out of love?

Last edited by namad; 01/29/15 06:05 AM.
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Originally Posted by indiegirl
The past is the past and I'm not criticising your decision in any way. I know your agony is just as severe as mine was when my husband betrayed me. More so, because of the kids. At least I had the memory of him looking so sure on that day - I do so very much feel for your predicament in not even having that.

I remember vividly us sitting on the bed and her telling me that "I want to be with you forever and I want to have your children". It meant something, our kids were not accident, both were planned, both were wanted, both were born out of love.

I get the marriage part and I do truly regret not asking her years ago. But, as you said, the past is in the past and she doesn't even remember being in love with me. I wish I had the same now, maybe it would hurt less.

To find something positive in all this, I am amazed how many supportive friends I have around me. They are truly amazing and even though I am not religious, I feel blessed.

Last edited by namad; 01/29/15 06:17 AM.
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Have you seen a lawyer yet? You should find out what your legal parental rights and obligations will be in the event your girlfriend breaks up with you and insists you move out.

The reason your girlfriend doesn't remember being in love with you is because she has a new point of comparison.



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Rather than give her space do 'hit and run' - this means meeting her needs regularly but do it in a drive by fashion instead of hanging on her.

Give her gestures and compliments quickly and walk off.



What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Since she has moved forward and now having an physical affair, I find it extremely hard not to start hating her.

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Originally Posted by namad
Let me get that straight:
Exacly the same action is consideread an EA when two people are married, and is considere perfectly okay when two people are not married.

Forgive me, but that just sounds plain stupid.

But all I stated were the facts what are happening and I am asking for possible solutions.

She has fallen out of love. She is tearing down our family with one hand and building another with another hand. She is confused and doesnt't feel anymorte. I have to move out.

Can someone please tell me that this is right or at least logical?

You should consult an attorney before moving out and have a background check performed on the OM.

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Can you avoid lovebusting her do you think?


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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No. Honestly, this comes at my emotional expense. I am so worn out that I can barely control myself. I cannot keep faking that I am okay with all that.

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Originally Posted by namad
No. Honestly, this comes at my emotional expense. I am so worn out that I can barely control myself. I cannot keep faking that I am okay with all that.

If you are unable to control your lovebusting behaviors then you have little to no hope of saving your relationship with her.

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I would implement no contact then. let her think it over in the cooler. Lovebusting will only make things worse.


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Yes. Done. No contact, its hard because of the kids but I let her be. Only contact points are picking off the kids from kindergarden.

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