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I am not nice to my H as well. Today, he kept bothering me over and over and over. He is very mean. He read my post and made fun of me. H said I need to post that I told him I hated him (I went a week without saying it, so I think I'm getting better). So I am posting it here. I think he enjoys picking at me.

This was the problem earlier that I asked about. If someone is mean over and over and over, how do you stop it?

Regarding divorce...we cannot afford two house payments like the one we have. I could move all three kids into a one bedroom, but this seems unfair. I am quite sure H would draw things in court out as long as possible and try to make my life a living hell for leaving him.

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Originally Posted by Loving29
If someone is mean over and over and over, how do you stop it?

You separate and let him decide if he wants to stop it or not.

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Regarding divorce...we cannot afford two house payments like the one we have.

After divorce there is no "we." The courts will make him support his kids, and then he'll have to worry about what else he can afford for himself.

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I am quite sure H would draw things in court out as long as possible and try to make my life a living hell for leaving him.

I'm pretty sure the court will do what is necessary to protect you if you don't roll over and surrender.


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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Are you listening to the Marriage Builders Radio show?


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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I started listening to the show. It was ok, but I thought some advice was vague. I am going to try and listen daily.

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After divorce there is no "we." The courts will make him support his kids, and then he'll have to worry about what else he can afford for himself.

Quote
I am quite sure H would draw things in court out as long as possible and try to make my life a living hell for leaving him.

I'm pretty sure the court will do what is necessary to protect you if you don't roll over and surrender. [/quote]

The courts do not have the authority to make him leave the home. He is on the lease. I watched several people go through this - lawyers can draw out the process and drain the bank accounts. It is in the lawyers' best interest to make things go as long as possible. I don't think I would be destitute. I do think he would try to turn the kids against me, and I know a couple of families where the kids refuse to see one of the parents b/c the other adult turned them against the spouse who left.

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Quick question. Is it breaking the POJA if I post on MB boards here, ask my coach for help, or ask Dr. Harley a question if my H does not want me to?

Thank you for helping.

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Originally Posted by Loving29
Quick question. Is it breaking the POJA if I post on MB boards here, ask my coach for help, or ask Dr. Harley a question if my H does not want me to?

Thank you for helping.
You're signed up with a coach, correct? So he's on board with MB? Why would he not want you to use the tools you've been given+


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Originally Posted by Loving29
Quick question. Is it breaking the POJA if I post on MB boards here, ask my coach for help, or ask Dr. Harley a question if my H does not want me to?

Thank you for helping.

No.


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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I spoke with H about this again. I think he doesn't want to speak, interact, email, etc coaches. He has said he doesn't want me sending correspondence from him because he thinks when I post or send emails, I am being one-sided.

I am being one-sided. I am asking for help with me and my actions. H has said he doesn't have a problem with me posting, emailing, etc... As long as I offer both sides/am honest and don't copy/paste anything from him. I find this difficult bc I don't want to speak for him.

Last night he read my question here about POJA and told me he was confused by my post bc he never said I couldn't post. And in his opinion, of course, I am going against POJA by not consulting him before posting. The way his opinion was offered made me feel like mine was wrong and did not leave room for discussion. I told him I was upset and left the room. Today he asked what the problem was.... Said that I never let him express his opinion, etc....I explained the way he did it was threatening to me.

We can't get past our first lesson bc when H speaks, I feel threatened. When I express this, he gets mad he can't tell me his opinion. I really wish he could learn a new way to express himself. When he speaks, most of the time he is using LBs.

H also says his number one LB is me having a double standard. We have gone over and over this. I ask, what behavior am I doing that you would like to stop? (He will give an example on Friday you called me a name and today it's wrong when I do it). I will say, I'm sorry I called you a name. I will not do it in the future, and ask you not call me names. How do you feel about this?

He will then say I acted like it was ok at the time, but now I'm telling him he's wrong. I will say I think we were both wrong, how do you feel? Etc...... on and on. To me, two wrongs don't make a right. What should I be doing differently here to make H feel better about the double-standard issue?

Thank you for your help.


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Have you corresponded with your coach? Since you and your H have signed up for the program, I suggest you rely on their expertise to help you.


Married 1980
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I did reach out to the coach last week, and she said to avoid LB. I have been trying very hard to do so, but I am not perfect. I have asked H if he thinks it's a good idea for us to come up with a contingency plan for when one of us does a LB. Right now, all we have is a timeout.

I saw my H posted here. I do not know if I should reply. I do not want to start a fight within the forum.

I will see if Kim can take a look at my questions this week. If anyone has advice on how to handle the double standard issue, I would appreciate the help.

Thank you again.

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Originally Posted by Loving29
I did reach out to the coach last week, and she said to avoid LB. I have been trying very hard to do so, but I am not perfect. I have asked H if he thinks it's a good idea for us to come up with a contingency plan for when one of us does a LB. Right now, all we have is a timeout.

I saw my H posted here. I do not know if I should reply. I do not want to start a fight within the forum.

I will see if Kim can take a look at my questions this week. If anyone has advice on how to handle the double standard issue, I would appreciate the help.

Thank you again.





"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr

"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer

"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Quote
I saw my H posted here. I do not know if I should reply. I do not want to start a fight within the forum.
Instead of replying and continuing the fight, quietly write down his disrespectful judgements and send them to your coach.

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Loving29, I would not post on his thread at all. There is no reason to bring a brawl to the forum. That helps nothing.

Quote
If you have any ideas on how I can fix my double standards, please let me know. I am thinking eliminating LB entirely will solve the issue?

Start by eliminating the TERM "double standard" from your vocabulary because it misses the point entirely. While neither of you should have opposite sex friendships, in general, what bothers you may not bother him and vice versa. You should both pledge to stop behaviors that makes the other unhappy. NOT because of a quid pro quo, but because you are DIFFERENT PEOPLE. So just because you stop something that bothers him does not mean that he needs to stop doing the same thing.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by Loving29
I did reach out to the coach last week, and she said to avoid LB. I have been trying very hard to do so, but I am not perfect. I have asked H if he thinks it's a good idea for us to come up with a contingency plan for when one of us does a LB. Right now, all we have is a timeout.

I saw my H posted here. I do not know if I should reply. I do not want to start a fight within the forum.

I will see if Kim can take a look at my questions this week. If anyone has advice on how to handle the double standard issue, I would appreciate the help.

Thank you again.

None of us is perfect...but that's no excuse to avoid eliminating our own love busters. When your H tells you that what you just did or said bothers him, simply apologize and then don't do it again.

When your H says or does something that bothers you, you should respond with, "When you ______, that really bothered me." He should apologize and stop doing it. But if he doesn't because he's not on board yet with MB, then it's a mistake to push the issue. Just stop the discussion if it's getting unpleasant.


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Originally Posted by Loving29
I did reach out to the coach last week, and she said to avoid LB. I have been trying very hard to do so, but I am not perfect

loving29, we are not asking you to be perfect; we are asking you to eliminate love busters 100%. Stop doing them. Saying you are "not perfect" is an excuse.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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I understand and appreciate what all of you are saying.

I am eliminating LB.

I brought up the part of me not being perfect bc I think when I mess up, instead of doing what you suggest above, H uses it as an opportunity to also use LB. I think this is where the double standard issue comes up?

For instance, if I perform any bad behavior such as swearing....and H performs the same bad behavior sometime after I did.... I nicely tell him I am hurt by xxx...." At which point he will say it is a double standard (ie, I swore at him so he should be allowed to swear at me). I think both of us are wrong to do so, and it seems he wants both of to be allowed to continue doing so?

I also see your point where sometimes one of us may be bothered by an action, but the other may not. So, it seems the double standard should be eliminated from our vocabulary, LB should be eliminated, and the POJA should be applied on a case by case basis. This makes sense to me.

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Originally Posted by Loving29
For instance, if I perform any bad behavior such as swearing....and H performs the same bad behavior sometime after I did.... I nicely tell him I am hurt by xxx...." At which point he will say it is a double standard (ie, I swore at him so he should be allowed to swear at me). I think both of us are wrong to do so, and it seems he wants both of to be allowed to continue doing so?

This is an example of you both being held to the SAME STANDARD. As you should. Neither of you should be committing love busters.

Quote
I also see your point where sometimes one of us may be bothered by an action, but the other may not. So, it seems the double standard should be eliminated from our vocabulary, LB should be eliminated, and the POJA should be applied on a case by case basis. This makes sense to me.

You got it!


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Another question came up today regarding POJA and LB. I emailed our coach Kim to ask for help. In the beginning, I stated I completed my part of Lesson one LB, and I did not know if H had completed those parts. I explained difficulties I have, and I asked for her guidance.

My H read my email. I do not mind him reading my emails, but he became very angry over my email to Kim. He said I was disrespectful in assuming/making judgement about him not doing the assignment.

He attempted several times to tell me how wrong I was, but he used LB each time so I called timeout. He told me according to MB, I was to say I am sorry and not do it again. I told him I was sorry I hurt him but am very confused.

Am I not supposed to email Kim with my feelings/asking for help? If H sees it as wrong for me to state I don't know if he completed assignments, should I not have said that? Am I supposed to go over all emails with H prior to sending? It feels very controlling, but I want to make sure I am following POJA.

Please, help she'd some light on this situation.

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I think the two of you need to agree NOT to read each others emails to Kim. Of course there is going to be DJs in your emails to Kim -- that is what she is going to help you on. Neither one of you deserves to be punished for what you say to Kim.

Write down this angry outburst of his and send it to Kim. Don't debate him on it. Don't discuss it at all.

Do not stop writing Kim. Do not stop posting for help.


Markos' Wife
FWW - EA
8 kids ...
What to do with an Angry Husband

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