My DH (50) is an executive at a large company. Several years ago he had an emotional affair. Part of what has made my husband so successful in his career is that he is very good with building relationships with people. Unfortunately, with certain women this relationship building tends to make them feel "special" and they tend read his friendliness as flirting and they end up developing feelings for him. I know this because this is how we ended up meeting, dating, and eventually getting married - granted, in our case we WERE actually dating not having an affair, but still I know what initially attracted me to him.

We went to counseling and he understood what he had been doing when he had the emotional affair and things got better (we also had a major catastrophic stressor occur in our life during that time that made things at home extremely stressful - we were having to deal with that all the time and our marriage was put on the back burner).

Now, my DH has a new employee who is working with him (and the rest of his team) on a new special project. She isn't actually even a member of management but is a specialist in her field within the company. I found it strange that although she isn't a member of management my DH requested that she actually be moved organizationally within the company to report directly to him. My DH is one of only a few Executive Directors in the entire company. Beneath him (and reporting to him in his department and on this project) are Senior Directors, Directors, Associate Directors, and Managers. Yet this "Specialist" is bypassing rest of the management chain of command and is reporting directly to the Executive Director.

I started snooping because one day I heard my DH on the phone (only discussing business - he works from home, and in a different state) but something about the WAY he was talking to this person sent off red flags. I found Instant Messages from his work computer and EVERY day between 6:30 am and 7:00 this woman sends him "good morning" IMs. They aren't necessarily overtly flirty, just what I would overly familiar for a "Specialist" to be sending to an Executive Director (I worked in a similar company for 10 years in management) and often contain smiley emotions. She also will include cute little anecdotes like she is so bummed it is Monday and already needs a drink because the complaints about their project are already rolling in. Then throughout the day she will IM him "Can you IM?" Same kinds of IMs but they sometimes banter back and forth about wouldn't it be great to just quit and be a cruise ship director. So now when they are on teleconferences and they are boring or stressful, one or the other will IM "Cruise ship director is sounding better every day." They also talk on the phone a lot - he talks to her more than anyone else. Again - always about business but there is usually a bit of subtle flirty banter and then she always tells him about something fun she has been doing or about her kids or something, and he just SOUNDS different when he is on the phone with her - he talks to her in a different tone of voice. She also IMs him to tell him if she is going to work out during her lunch break or run to the bank and tells him that he has her cell phone number if he needs it - both of them. I don't understand why he would have the need to constantly be in touch with this women.

I have talked to him about this and he gets annoyed with me and says that he isn't doing anything. Maybe that's true but I feel that SHE is being too familiar with him and I warned him that I think she is mistaking his friendliness for more and if nothing is going on than he needs to back off so she doesn't feel like he is encouraging her. I have been very upset because I feel like this is the start of another emotional affair even if HE doesn't realize it yet. He has told me that I am getting myself all worked up and worried over nothing. He knows I have been looking at his IMs so he starting deleting them. But I know how to access the deleted ones. They aren't any different than the other ones.

He denied and denied his emotional affair before. I found some suspicious things but really it was just my intuition that told me something was not right. In this case, he doesn't even live in the same state as this other woman but the same red flags are going off again.

Am I just over-reacting because he had an emotional affair before? Most of this does seem to be coming from her end and they aren't in the same state so am I worrying over nothing? What should I do? I feel like I'm making it worse by trying to talk to him about it but I don't want to just ignore it and have it lead to something more either.

Sorry but this is BS (betrayed spouse) fog talking, looking for a way to absolve the WS from responsibility for the affair. Your WH engages in OS friendships and flirting behaviors. It's really that simple. This is the type of behavior that leads to every affair I have ever seen on this forum.

Repeat offenders are the ones who (a) won't take responsibility for their own actions and (b) develop an EP (extraordinary protection) plan to avoid scenarios into the future. Your WH fits into this category.

If he truly cannot control this behavior, then he should not be in an environment where he is EVER in contact with women without you standing beside him again, meaning work, social settings, errands etc.



Big red flag!!

Sounds like the affair was swept under the rug while other issues were used as a distraction. If you had used MB, the other issues would have set to the side while the emphasis was placed on how your WH could protect you and your M into the future.




You know the answer to this. Of course this relationship with the female coworker has crossed the line. Because this is not your WH's first time down this road, it should not really matter to you whether it is a blossoming EA, EA or full blown PA. Your WH is not protecting you and engaging in extremely risky behavior....when he already KNOWS how this has hurt you and your M in the past.

Who did you expose the last affair to? Anyone?

You are putting WAY too much of the blame on the OW. Your WH knows EXACTLY what he is doing. Yes he does realize it and he is gaslighting you in order to get you to BACK OFF.




More gaslighting.



The content of the messages isn't as important as the fact that he is erasing them. I have spoken to Dr Harley personally about my ex continuing to erase "innocent" messages while we were in a FR (false recovery) and he said that that is a sign that the WS hasn't given up their SSL.

Big red flags SHOULD be going off!

Your WH is very good at gaslighting you. Instead of listening to his WORDS, look at his actions.

You are not over reacting, you are spot on.

It is an inappropriate relationship, and it is occurring at his work place.

Wildly inappropriate. He shouldn't IM during meetings anyway.

Also, they have developed "in" jokes. Meaning you are outside the fun. This needs to end now.

Do you have access to his financials? Are the two of you getting enough UA time?

Thank you everyone. I guess I just needed to hear from other people that I wasn't over-reacting about this.

I only have access to his iPad that somehow sends messages from his work computer. He has a personal phone and a work phone that I don't know the passcodes for.

And, no I don't have access to his financial information I don't know the passwords.

When we were in counseling he did give me access to everything and for quite awhile I would occassionally look into things. I never found anything. I feel stupid for saying this now but over time,because I didn't find anything, he got mad that I was continuing to look through things even though he said he had proven he was no longer doing anything wrong. He said that I was just never going to be able to trust him even though he wasn't doing anything. He said my "searching" for something wrong was causing me to be distrustful. So I agreed to no longer look. He changed the passwords so I wouldn't be tempted to keep searching. So now I no longer have the ability to look into things and I'm sure if I ask he will turn things around and try to blame me.

He doesn't have a need to be in constant touch with this woman...he wants to be in constant touch with her.

Your situation has many similarities to mine...my exWH was an executive and used the workplace to conceal and carry on affairs. That OW doesn't live in the same state means nothing. If either of them travel they can meet. Even if they don't meet they can swap naked pics, skype, and obviously text/phone.

Have you thought about calling up this woman to confront her? Have you looked into her background? Is she married?

Welcome to MB.

I've found some info about her on the Internet - married with 2 young children, she is 16 years younger than my husband.

Yes, I have thought about confronting her - I just have no idea what I would say.

I'm not a veteran like many on here but I have been read a lot about gaslighting.

I actually got a little sick to my stomach when I read the part I underlined. That sounds like MAJOR gas lighting. And SO manipulative. So condescending. "Here, my poor fragile creature, I will change my passwords so you won't have to endure the emotional turmoil of making sure I'm not cheating..." Ugggg.

Try this mental exercise: Read that paragraph back to yourself but pretend someone you don't know wrote it. What would you think of the situation?

BTW - I think the reason this upset me so much is because it's the kind of perverted logic I've passively capitulated to in the past, due to my own conflict aversion (AKA weakness). But when I see it done to someone else it's clear as day. Red Flag alert.

I would look to find/contact this woman's husband and inform him that his wife is getting way too cozy with her boss. Give him some specifics and let him know your H has already had one workplace affair and you would hate to see this happen with his wife because you already see many, many and that your H acts as if it is no big deal...and has started deleting their texts.

Does your H travel for work? Any conferences? Would this woman travel to your state for this project?

Legomom,

You wrote, Yes, I have thought about confronting her - I just have no idea what I would say.

You don't have to say anything just make a list of all the inappropriate communication, about non-work related topics, and give it to her betrayed husband. If her husband has any sense he will confront her for you!

Was the previous EA exposed or did he just slide away on that one too?

God Bless
Gamma

black raven I like your suggestion. I think what you said is the perfect thing to tell her husband.

My husband does occassionally travel for work- he goes to his company headquarters or a satellite office - no one has any reason to come here. We actually recently moved for family reasons that have nothing to do with his job, but he worked from home in a different state than his company's headquarters prior to this move as well.

That your H travels...he has an avenue to meet up with this woman. You would have no idea if she flies there too. Do you have access to your H's travel expense reports, credit card statements, etc? Have you verified he went to the city he was supposed to go?

I would also mention your H's travel to her husband. Lay out as many details as you can that this man will not be able to ignore and it may give him a starting point to start snooping.

Our families and friends know about his previous EA, however I didn't know anything about this program at that time so they didn't find out about it the way that it is suggested here. They knew something was very wrong so we told them.

legomom,

Did you tell the husband or so of the woman he had the EA with?

God Bless
Gamma

I know he goes to the city that he says he is going to because he does give me access to the company travel planning itinerary website so I always have his flight and hotel information. We share one car since he works from home and we live in a very walkable city and I am the one who drives him to the airport and picks him up based on his itinerary.

At this point I would really be looking for a change in his normal pattern of behavior about traveling anyway because he typically tries to travel as little as possible (he'll argue for teleconferences over traveling) and if he does have to travel he does everything possible to try to make them one day trips so he doesn't have to spend the night or he tries to get earlier flights home, often cutting his trips short by a day or more of he feels he has accomplished what needed to be done in less time than planned.

I don't think I would be able to get access to his expense reports but I doubt they would do me any good anyway - at his level he doesn't have to line item out who is with him. When he travels it is for big meetings with other companies or for major problems, both situations will involve expensive meals that he may or may not be the one paying for that particular evening. And he gets a per diem for any personal meals so he doesn't have to expense those. Plus since this woman actually works on one of his projects it wouldn't be unrealistic for her to actually be at a team meeting or dinner.

I don't believe this is something that has been going on for long. She isn't someone he would have had any reason to work with before until a few months ago when his group started working on this project and she was brought in as the specialist from another area to work with them - she wasn't specifically requested. Another person on my husband's team contacted that group and asked them if they could "loan" someone for the project. This I do know from looking through emails. In fact based on his travel, he would have only met her in person once - a few weeks ago when they had the official kick off meeting for the project once they had established the entire team and got the final ok from the CEO. And my husband split that trip between that meeting and working on another major project with his boss and another team - I can confirm that he did that via emails as well.

No, I did not tell the women's husband about their EA. Now that I see it being discussed here, I find it odd that that was never discussed in counseling. Although I guess when I think about it the counselor's approach was that we needed to focus on my husband taking responsibility for the EA (and not me being obsessed with every little detail about the other women and what happened) because he was the one who had vowed to remain faithful to me. The focus was really on what HE was going to do to gain my trust back. Strange though, now that I think about it.

Marriage counselors in general have no idea how to deal with an affair or how to recover a marriage from one. So it is actually not at all surprising that exposure was never discussed in counseling.

Legomom,

You wrote, No, I did not tell the women's husband about their EA.

Please do the other womans husband a favor and inform him now, your WH damaged their marriage and he likely never found out why. It's the right thing to do, actually the right thing would be for your WH to apologize to the BH.

The fact that your WH never had to atone for the damage he did in his last affair made him more likely to allow this one to start and grow.

God Bless
Gamma

I hope you see how irrational this comment is now? Looking at his emails/computer/phone logs would only create trust, not the opposite. He has a very odd, wayward attitude about transparency that should concern you. An innocent person WANTS to be open and transparent so he can prove his trustworthiness. Your husband ACTS very guilty.

I didn't see an answer to this. Someone else asked you again about the OW's H and you said no you didn't expose it. Did you expose the EA to anybody?