Yikes!

You need to review your lovebusters. Big time.

Also...have you considered moving this thread to MB101?

Ok - thanks for the input - thing is - and I know this sounds contrite but it will take me 5 minutes to think up a sentence that doesn't use and word that might be misconstrued as being derogatory or rude etx. Fact is, my wife was asked to read the book by her Doctor after visiting and discussing her mood problems with him/her. She never told me this until a few weeks after having read the book and then asked me to read the book.

When I got the book I noticed that most of it was still pristine condition and I asked her if she had read it. She replied saying "No not really just the bits I thought were appropriate" - and has then gone on to underline sentences and highlight paragraphs to point out to me stuff that she feels I am not good enough at.

As I read the introduction I thought , I need to read this from A->B to really get the best out of it and its proving right.

Not only does it show that I've been complicit in how I've treated our relationship it shows she has too. This is something we BOTH know but I want to get to the end as quickly as possible so that I can put into practice some of the things that I have learnt.

Thing is I don't really know if she wants to do this. She has agreed that she will read it again so that's a positive but I was taken back that she is where she is.

If I be specific about my complaints it will be taken as attacks within 30 seconds of me being as diplomatic as I possibly can. The table will be turned against me. Especially if I utter the s3x word which I cannot even imagine at the moment.

The more I type this the more it makes me realise that she is totally committed to the children. To the point that she will see me go so that she can bring them up - rather than have a marriage or relationship with me. That's not to say that I am not committed, far from it and relatives and friends would vouch this. It simply means that I have interests that she simply doesn't.

Here is a question.

Some of these interests/hobbies mean that I spend 'sometimes' a few hours of my recreational time away from the family. It might be a morning spent riding my bike with my brother or a close friend. Or it might be going for a drink with a long time friend. Is it that I am to stop doing these things? My first ever friend (our mothers were pregnant at the same time) has asked me twice now for a game of badminton, which we both enjoy and I've had to turn him down with various rubbish excuses off the back of my wife saying that she did not approve of me going.

If so - I find it incredibly claustrophobic and I am not sure that I'll last if those are the sorts of changes people on here feel I need to make....

Whats the choice be incredibly unhappy but married - or be divorced but happy?

Hi SusieQ - I hadn't , but was wondering what the benefit would be? I'll have a look through the threads and see.

Thank you Rich

When are you going to read Lovebusters?

I just want to tell you that you are a VERY FORTUNATE MAN to have come here and getting straight advice from clear-eyed bystanders how to save your marriage. I can't emphasize enough how GREAT it is for this to have happened. I am probably in your wife's shoes, and I have checked out. My husband has not and will likely not see the value of changing the dynamics of the marriage to save it. To have come this far is a great blessing for you. It's not an easy road but take it, for the sake of your own happiness, your family's happiness, take it. It's worth it.

You seem to have a blindspot about your own attitude towards your wife, and yes, you are quite judgmental and self-congratulatory at times. Honestly, a bunch of flowers isn't the panacea that many men think it is. Putting serious thought into what she needs from you and acting on it *is*. That's real and genuine caring, and no bunch of flowers can compensate for that.

Finally, I urge you to try for your own sake, you will be a better person for it, and that's priceless, whether you succeed in your marriage.

PS...and please do consider switching from that "colorful dressing" to something more elegant...it's seldom becoming for men at any age beyond their teens. Believe me, your wife only has your best interest at heart when she proposed that to you.

Oh I see. Have you lived with someone who has little or next to NO respect for you or your opinions - day in day out, week after week, month after month and year after year? I have and I am still trying to regain that respect and yet every silly little mistake I make its back to square one.

Want to know what a silly mistake looks like? I put the biscuits in the biscuits tin incorrectly the other week... Yep re-read that last sentence. Apparently they have to go in biscuit packet type order. Like - who gives a [censored]? Its ok - I picked myself up from that one pretty quick.

I've listened to what I have to change and I am and have been making changes - I make sure every morning that I am first up at weekends so she can have a break from the children, washed and shaved and dressed in a lovely sensible way.... I've bought new nice plain clothes and shoes.My hair is cut routinely every two weeks - I no longer exercise so as to fit in with my family commitments - apparently my blood pressure is [censored].

And you know what - it feels like I am [censored] DEAD.

I get to the end of the weekend utterly drained from the effort of living like a person I am not. I don't relax, I am not at ease. I have my self respect ripped apart not just by her but by her family also. There is little or nothing that I do that they see good at in me. I mean in my job I just sit and play with a keyboard daily....how hard can that be for a job its not a REAL mans job is it - no not like her family they are REAL men - OH YEAH! I put up with their condescending eyes, their curt comments, the quietness of the room as I enter and yet you know what I am FIGHTING to try and keep the marriage going.

And you have the utter contempt of me to write what you have above?

I have lent 6 figures sums of money to the family and been told I am 'tight'. I have ensured that there is ALWAYS money for our family and yet I am still told that I am not good enough and that I should do more. Have you ever done that?

It is no wonder that suicide rates for middle aged men is high when there are pressures on them such that I am dealing with and feel.

You think that I use a bunch of flowers to be the panacea that will magically resolve the situation? Give me the credit of the IQ that I posses - yeah I did just blow my own trumpet. Do you really think I am that low and thick? About the times that I have gone without any emotional feed back after trying to be all spontaneous and full of energy after a 70+ hour work week? I'm 40 - not [censored] 20. You haven't a clue the effort that I have put into think of new things for US to do - or to help her with her ailing lack of self confidence. The research I have done into college courses, tooth repair, jewellery, holidays I have organised or suggested, talking to her family to make them aware of her state of mind, taking her shopping and helping her to choose clothes that would suit her, to help her when she has made mistakes that cost us money and just tell her not to worry, asking her is she has had a good day only to be ignored because you know what "i dont mean it", researching hormonal treatments, supporting her at the Dr's , thinking of holidays for us as a family to enjoy?????

Have you ever dealt with depression - that black dog on your shoulder who just drags you down and yet you smile your way through the day with your colleagues and be fun to be around when all the while you are dead in side and just want someone to put their arms around you and say "I love you". No - I doubt you have - I really utterly doubt that you have a taste of the dead feeling I have inside right now and for the last few months.

My family know I am falling apart and I am seeing it now also. Its starting to hurt again with a pain I know leads to a nasty place - all because I haven't grown the balls to end this situation.

I'm done.

Go for it trolls - do you worst - I won't be back here any way. I've evaluated my behaviour and you know what I'm a decent person who wants to be cared and loved and who hasn't had that for a number of years now and I'm sick of it.

Then do it, file for divorce.

Nobody thinks you are thick, but you are a very condescending person and unless you are willing to take some responsibility for that attitude, nobody can help you beyond pointing out a divorce lawyer and praying for whatever poor woman next crosses your path. God help her.

Clearly, you want your ego stroked. Correct, it won't happen here. Feel free to call troll to anyone who doesnt kiss your butt.

Do not expect your marriage to get better until you get help for your anger.

Dr. Harley on anger:

Also, check out this thread:

Anger Management 101

Of course a bunch of flowers won't resolve the situation.

Nothing less than 15 hours UA time will make a woman fall back in love with you. In fact if the UA time has been neglected for many years it's difficult to get a wife to go on any kind of a date.

Your other problem is you expect her to put in as much effort as you do and it simply ain't gonna happen like that. Dr H says husbands always have a great deal more success if they lead the way. Women fall victim to depression and a complete lack of sexual desire if they are expected to do the heavy lifting.

So if you expect your wife to meet you half way - just get divorced. When she stopped having sex and started making Dr appointments that was your dead canary right there. Time to lead the way out of the mine.

You would have success (and complete adoration) if you did this and it is NEVER too late. Look at her dad. After years of neglect, he gave her his time -and boom - he's a hero.

Stop handing over cash and sacrifices - it won't get you hero status because it is worthless. Give her your time and be prepared to wait for her to come round.

I really truly don't see what your job, lending money and being a good person has to do with being in love.

Your job is for your boss to congratulate you on (unless you spend hours talking with your wife on UA time she won't be able to know about your job much less admire it)

Money lending - I assume you don't need anything but the money back as agreed.

Being a good person is something I assume which is something you want to be...

Shopping with your wife... Just don't do it. Unless it's fun for you and you are connecting as people and talking about your lives it's a waste of time.

Being a good person on the quiet and impressive at your job in a place she can't see... Great but it doesn't get the job done.

UA time. Fun, romantic time where your wife is your 'outside interest' away from work and your only 'option'. Not rocket science.

Completely ridiculous!

You are giving away the farm my friend.

You are working to pay for a life that you don't live in. You are making yourself a stranger to your wife and family - of course they don't smother you with love at the end of the week! They barely recognize you.

You are working really hard at a JOB. Not your marriage. A job which can make you redundant at any time.

You're working so you can loan six figure sums to other families? Pure foolishness.

All you're doing is working towards paying for the inevitable divorce.

I don't know why you are so angry that you aren't being rewarded for making such a foolish decision.

My goodness, I don't even know you, I honestly don't have any "utter contempt", you are but a stranger to me, a stranger who was asking for opinions and views about his marriage and I replied. I placed in caps "GREAT" because I wanted to emphasize that it is truly good and fortunate that you embarked on this journey.

It seems that you are unable to see yourself - we are pointing out the behavior, attitude, views that are revealed in your posts to reflect your true image back to yourself, an image that you might be blind to.

I'm a complete stranger and already you regard my honest opinion as "contempt" for you, and others' here as "trolls" even as they are helpfully pointing out some issues with your attitude towards your wife.

You go on and on about what in your opinion are great things you have done for your wife, but these are obviously not what she believes should be done to save the marriage.

I bet when she starts to tell you what she needs and how you could meet them you take it as "disrespect", "contempt", judging you "low and thick", etc.

You even remembered the "putting the biscuits into the right container" "insult"....your poor wife probably didn't even think it was an insult, she has a way of managing and arranging the household and is merely offering the "instructions" so she could save herself the trouble of rearranging the biscuits. For me, it's not biscuits, it's toothbrushes, but you get my drift.

It's not a big deal at all but you went ballistic about such a matter and held it against her.

We're only strangers and already, we're at the receiving end of a full deluge of your rage.

If you are serious about saving the marriage, and willing to obtain advice and to follow through, then you probably wouldn't react this way to objective observations from others.

If I see my husband picking up a copy of "His Needs Her Needs", I won't even be judging if he were "cherrypicking" the parts that suit him, that would mean I'm acting like a complete j.....

I would be elated that he is finally making a move that could lead to conciliation, and a door and opportunity towards a better marriage.


I echo the views of the others here, you really should seek therapy, understand why you are such an angry person who hears and sees "disrespect", "contempt", "insults", etc. when none were meant.