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Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Originally Posted by JBD
I cant thank you enough for addressing this Brightside. When I first started here, I am more quiet by nature, and when I had questions, rather than finding my voice (as I am now, a bit), I would wait, and read what others post, and when I would find someone who I agreed with, I would either do whatever they had posted, or ask to contact them directly, as it seemed, idk, less...painful to rehash i guess. Anyway, there was a post by someone a while back, and that member mentioned doing exactly that! That members motives were totally different than what I think your husbands seem to be, but the action was the same anyways. I actually talked to that person and asked if that followed the spirit of the program. The answer was that as part of the NC rule, the WS had to hand over the phone, the computer, etc., to the BS for their inspection. This was when the BS started communicating with the OP. While that was NOT for discovery purposes, it was for the purpose of knowing what the OP was doing, and to intentionally inflame the situation and attitude between the WS and the OP. I was shocked. They told me that if left to the WS that they werent confident that the NC would be done. I agreed, at first. Point is, I think there have to be some limits. Not written down ones, as intentions may be different. Your situation is just a bit more unique by the fact that you watch him doing it. You can understand Im sure why he thought it was a good idea at first, of course. However, if it is a few weeks later, and you have been honest (and as open as he has requested), then in the interest in total honesty, he should stop. All that will be accomplished is more undue paranoia (assuming you HAVE been honest), and probably an almost obsessive mania in him. You can not make progress this way. If you have to, to avoid breaking a NC agreement, cancel your email/skype account completely, as that is NOT a violation, and that should do it. Either that, or the idea of the joint message, is the only way you can truly heal. The member I mentioned before was the one who made me see that, as I was in that exact compulsive/manic state myself, and yerned to chat with the OP as my spouse. 3 weeks after I had spoken in private to the other MB member, I was contacted by him again, and he told me that while he did feel it was helpful, at first, his intent was only to hurt and cause pain to the OM, and had been successful, but didnt know when to stop. There was a backlash, and after some soul searching my MB mentor said, he looked in the mirror and knew he had taken it too far. To keep it from coming back on his family any further, he just let the accounts fade away. That wasnt what i wanted to hear, but I believe it to be the right thing.

Sorry all. Now you see why I am more the quiet type. Why I do get going, and care of what I speak, I tend to be like longfellow. Thank you again for bring up some of the odd and unpleasant realities, that occur when healing. Too bad it cant be as easy as a pen stroke, huh?
How did you have off board conversation with another board member?

Do you have another posting name?


There was no off board conversation with another board member.

JBD's post is fabricated.


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I have read ALMOST every thread here. The READ ONLY ARCHIVES are taking a long time however. There are 2 or 3 threads that I have seen (I admit, I have only been here a month, but am trying to learn before my own situation falls apart), but is it NOT ok for them to have posted their contact info? In fairness, it was only there till I contacted him. He edited the post after that. Wait, I was told, well, it was implied to me that that is ok, and not uncommon. Have I broken the rules? I will not say which threads the info is/was posted. And I would prefer not to get them in trouble. I am sorry. I had no clue that was an issue. I was just, embarrassed. Well, embarrassed, unsure, confused, angry, in over my head, etc.

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Originally Posted by JBD
I have read ALMOST every thread here. The READ ONLY ARCHIVES are taking a long time however. There are 2 or 3 threads that I have seen (I admit, I have only been here a month, but am trying to learn before my own situation falls apart), but is it NOT ok for them to have posted their contact info? In fairness, it was only there till I contacted him. He edited the post after that. Wait, I was told, well, it was implied to me that that is ok, and not uncommon. Have I broken the rules? I will not say which threads the info is/was posted. And I would prefer not to get them in trouble. I am sorry. I had no clue that was an issue. I was just, embarrassed. Well, embarrassed, unsure, confused, angry, in over my head, etc.

Then you've read enough to know that this forum does not tolerate trolls.

The most likely reason you are masking your IP address and using a proxy server is that you are either Brightside or Mr. Brightside.

If you were truly masking to be more private you would not be emailing some old member off the forum.

I have not been contacted by any old members to remove their email address from an old post. They would no longer have the ability to edit it themselves.



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Sorry I have no idea who JBD is. I also don't fully understand the way this thread as gone.

But going back on topic. As I have answered before we went through the checklist and did all the steps. My husband has all my accounts. He has changed the passwords to some so I need to ask him to put in the password so I can get in. My computer and phone are keylogged and tracked. Every where I go my phone GPS verifies my location. Even this posting he is fully aware of.

I talked to my husband about taking a polygraph. Ultimately the conclusion was that it wouldn't help. I've told him the truth about the affair and I am not hiding anything. He believes me in that respect. He wants details and the a polygraph won't bring out details.

It was mention that I watched him do it. I didn't. I only found out after the fact. I sent an email when the affair was discovered saying things were over. My husband has since backtracked that in his latest communications with the OM.

My husband told me that I was obsessing about the NC thing. He said that me bringing it up, posting here (he knows everything I do) and wanting NC means that I am protecting the OM, that I still care for the OM and that I don't support my husband.

I told him he was completely wrong that NC was so our relationship could heal and move on. It makes no sense to me that wanting NC with the OM means I don't care about us. To me wanting contact with the OM means I don't care about our relationship. I told him that his reasoning as described above was total manipulation of the truth in order to justify his actions. He does not want NC.

He told me that I don't understand his need to know exactly word for word what was said.

Further I am the one who is not in a position to make demands. It is clear that I am a cheater so everything I say and do is untrustworthy. I get that but when I explain the situation either to you guys or the therapist and they side with me, it is seen by him as using them as tools to further my untrustworthy agenda.

As a result, I said if the OM ever established contact with me. I would expose my husband and re-establish the point of NC with the OM.

(The last point I'm conflicted. I don't want to break NC myself but if the OM is getting a different message from my husband. I want to make it known that it isn't me that is wanting to continue the affair and that I don't want contact. I have no idea how long my husband can keep up the charade but if he keeps it up I do feel obligated to stop the contact myself.)

Last edited by Brightside; 04/05/15 09:26 AM.
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Originally Posted by JBD
All that will be accomplished is more undue paranoia (assuming you HAVE been honest), and probably an almost obsessive mania in him.

We have discussed this in therapy. The therapist talked to my husband about breaking the loop of the obsessive behavior and thought. We were making a lot of progress in his depression, his obsessing, etc. This contact and communication with the OM, I feel is a huge step backward.

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Your husband needs to stop contacting your affair partner. His behavior is not helpful AT ALL. It keeps you both triggered.

Sounds like he won't listen to you or anyone else on this matter. Hopefully he's reading this. He's the troll, right?

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And DO NOT contact your OM to explain this bizarre situation. NEVER have contact again. You certainly don't need to explain yourself to the scum bag who soiled your marriage. Who cares?

(are you looking for an excuse to make contact?)

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Originally Posted by zibbles
(are you looking for an excuse to make contact?)
No not at all. I don't want contact and when my husband told me he talked to him, I felt myself have a physical reaction to the news.

I think that is a good point about the triggers. I said that I don't want this guy to be a part of our lives. He reply was you should of thought of that before you had the affair.

I said he will be a part of our history but not a part of our day to day lives. My husband has a fear I won't face the affair and that I won't help fix the problems that lead to it.

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Originally Posted by zibbles
He's the troll, right?
I don't know. I don't think so but he is reading cause I do show him the thread.

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Since he is contacting your OM as you....he is most likely the troll here.

Mr. Brightside,
You need to stop. You are crossing lines of decency even though you are dealing with being betrayed.







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Mr Brightside,

get a grip here. You are giving dutch people a bad name.
Doe effe normaal joh!
Either work it out with your wife and start having a good marriage, or file for divorce.
If you keep bringing the affair up and making your wife miserable this will end up in divorce anyway. Take your antidepressants and contact Dr. Harley. You cannot change the past, you don't have that power. But you have the power to make the future miserable, by keeping the affair on the front burner.
Start making the future better if you want to keep your family together. Paranoia about the past is not your friend. Make the present so good, that you and her forget about this, ehm, what was that again?


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And being a pothead, will make you a boring (and stinking btw) husband with no drive to make your marriage exhillarating. You know that. Besides, have you ever considered how much legal trouble this can bring, when you are not residing in the Netherlands? Not worth it man.


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Originally Posted by happyheart
Mr Brightside,

get a grip here. You are giving dutch people a bad name.
Doe effe normaal joh!
Either work it out with your wife and start having a good marriage, or file for divorce.
If you keep bringing the affair up and making your wife miserable this will end up in divorce anyway. Take your antidepressants and contact Dr. Harley. You cannot change the past, you don't have that power. But you have the power to make the future miserable, by keeping the affair on the front burner.
Start making the future better if you want to keep your family together. Paranoia about the past is not your friend. Make the present so good, that you and her forget about this, ehm, what was that again?

Where did you get your information? I'm the his husband in question and my wife, brightside, showed me this cause she was concerned.. Are you someone we know?

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Originally Posted by Malfurion
Originally Posted by happyheart
Mr Brightside,

get a grip here. You are giving dutch people a bad name.
Doe effe normaal joh!
Either work it out with your wife and start having a good marriage, or file for divorce.
If you keep bringing the affair up and making your wife miserable this will end up in divorce anyway. Take your antidepressants and contact Dr. Harley. You cannot change the past, you don't have that power. But you have the power to make the future miserable, by keeping the affair on the front burner.
Start making the future better if you want to keep your family together. Paranoia about the past is not your friend. Make the present so good, that you and her forget about this, ehm, what was that again?

Where did you get your information? I'm the his husband in question and my wife, brightside, showed me this cause she was concerned.. Are you someone we know?

Sir, can you please start your own thread for advice?
By using the methods prescribed by Dr. Harley and detailed in his book Surviving An Affair, you can build an affair proof, romantic marriage.

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I'm not asking for advice. I'd like to know how happyheart obtained information that was never revealed...

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What information?

We are trying to help your marriage here.
Do you want help to make your marriage better than it ever was and to put this affair in the past?
We totally understand that this thing has hurt you like nothing else. If you want, you can overcome the hurt and not only recover, but be blissfully happy. You have a little child, so I gather it is important for you to keep your family together. This place offers a lot of information to surviving an affair.

But you can only have the marriage you want, if you start to actually follow the program. Nobody can make that choice for you, but yourself.


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Alright, maybe I read into it too much. Sorry about that.

I know what I did was wrong and counter productive, but as often is the case, the heart doesn't always agree with the mind. I guess my biggest fear is that the OM was my last chance for concrete evidence (my plan was to con him out of his Skype logs) that she didn't sleep with him. She has told me that she told him on Skype she was sorry she didn't have sex with him when they met. Without those Skype logs, all I have to go by is her word.

When I first started checking her email I was telling myself I was crazy. Until I found something. I know I can't change the past, and I really want to be able to forgive her, but it feels sometimes like I can't say I'm 100% sure what I'm forgiving her for. I want to believe her, but hard evidence would be so much easier to accept than just going by what she tells me happened.

And that's all.

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Originally Posted by Malfurion
.

I know what I did was wrong and counter productive, but as often is the case, the heart doesn't always agree with the mind. .


You don't have the luxury of thoughtlessness with your spouse's feelings. If you think thats OK then just file for divorce so as to protect your wife from your heart breaking blunders.

Constantly resuming her biggest mistake is done by you ON PURPOSE and is a deal breaker. Get your head in the game.

Mrs Brightside, I doubt Dr H would agree to counsel the two of you while there is an addiction. He always says to treat the addiction before trying to heal the marriage. It's just the same as how the ending of an affair comes before healing.

Healing the marriage includes a short period of truth gathering (perhaps using a poly) and then the affair is never mentioned again.

That isn't what your H wants because it puts focus on him.

Your husband is currently incapable of recovering the marriage. His pot smoking makes him unpredictable, paranoid and reactionary. He also puts it ahead of your dates - and marriage.

Your counsellor is a joke, because you are discussing the A over and over and the addiction isn't being tackled. This is a great way to stay in counselling for the rest of your lives.

You'd get much further if you implemented a separation until your H agreed to quit smoking and keep NC. Any future breaches of NC should see him kicked out again.

That's how serious you must be about NC with OM.


Originally Posted by Malfurion
. I want to believe her, but hard evidence would be so much easier to accept than just going by what she tells me happened..


Nonsense, there is no evidence to be had from a liar's lips and you ignore real evidence gathering like a poly so you can chat to a lying OM.

All BSs want evidence but it is highly unusual to see a BH go out of his way to collude with a liar who destroyed his marriage. Most of us would get physically ill if we spoke to the OP.

It has nothing to do with evidence - it is just mischief making and keeping your wife's mistakes alive to detract attention from your own failings.

Mrs Brightside I am deeply concerned about your H using your affair as something kind of bargaining chip to hold onto his addiction. To the point of trolling this thread.

He may improve with rehabilitation, but I'd be doubtful if I were you.


Last edited by indiegirl; 04/06/15 08:27 AM.

What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Originally Posted by Malfurion
Alright, maybe I read into it too much. Sorry about that.

I know what I did was wrong and counter productive, but as often is the case, the heart doesn't always agree with the mind. I guess my biggest fear is that the OM was my last chance for concrete evidence (my plan was to con him out of his Skype logs) that she didn't sleep with him. She has told me that she told him on Skype she was sorry she didn't have sex with him when they met. Without those Skype logs, all I have to go by is her word.

Another way to get this evidence is have her take a polygraph.

Quote
I know I can't change the past, and I really want to be able to forgive her, but it feels sometimes like I can't say I'm 100% sure what I'm forgiving her for. I want to believe her, but hard evidence would be so much easier to accept than just going by what she tells me happened.

I understand your dilemma now. I would not worry about forgiveness, but would focus on getting all the facts once and for all so you can move on. You won't forget [saying "IforgiveIforgiveIforgive" will not help you forget and is counterproductive] but the pain will fade into the past if you create a GREAT MARRIAGE in the present.

check this out: Can't We Just Forgive and Forget?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Thanks guys.. I'm sorry some of you feel the need for animosity, but I guess we're here to deal with our problems, so the negatives take center stage.

Since the discovery we have made great strides in rekindling or relationship. We have had a lot of good days lately, and I do make a very concerted effort to not let the affair trump our daily lives. Dr Harleys blog has helped a lot with this. Though I wish we could deal with everything in one go, we still have to deal with our day to day lives, work and the baby. Sometimes it feels like we take too much time off of talking about our problems though, and that's when I get stupid stuff in my head like contacting the OM.

I am absolutely aware of my part in the deterioration of our relationship before the affair, and I own up to the mistakes I have made after. I have tried to change everything about myself that made her feel she needed that escape.

I'm still dealing with this every day, and even in therapy a lot of the focus is on what I need to do. It can be very frustrating, especially since I feel like I try so much.

If there are any specific questions about our relationship, about my wife or myself, please feel free to ask and we'll try to answer as best we can, but please stop making assumptions.

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