Getting angry does not cause affairs to happen unless one is looking for them. Is it your goal to just avoid making her angry? If so, you will have a gun pointed to your head until it happens again. And it will happen again because she actively seeks out affairs.

Davy, it's easy to see what you posted before. Just click on a poster's name, and choose 'view posts' from the drop-down menu. I saw what you posted a while ago about counselling. How else do you think I was able to know about it?

I think you were (rightfully) very unhappy with her independent behaviour in 2010, and that is why you jumped into someone else's thread to complain about it.

I think you are whitewashing that history now, on this thread. You were obviously unhappy about aspects of your marriage quite early on, and in fact, on this thread somewhere you said that you and she have some very serious problems.


So it isn't just a blow-up that happened over her drinking once; there have been more problems for quite a long time, and she was also drinking and going out in her previous marriage. If she has been going out with the girls, against your wishes, almost from the start of your marriage, and if she loves a drink, it is not unlikely that she has been flirting with other men much more than you know.

I think you are refusing to be realistic about just how free-spirited and independent your wife really is. She does not seem to value marriage very much, and she does not take steps to protect it from her own unfaithful tendencies. She also has a problem with alcohol, and needs to stop drinking.

If you could put a stop to her affair, that wouldn't, by itself, change all this. If she is saying that her value-system is now one where she does not want to be moral and well-behaved, and she wants to change her lifestyle and be a bad girl, you can't make her be faithful and caring towards you and the kids in the long term.

I would not hide her beer in different containers.
Kids should learn the source of her insane behaviors as the alcohol.
They need to know it can cause insanity.

You bring up some good points. I had forgotten about the posts in 2010. I think that's part of the problem. As the BS I remember only the good stuff, and the WW only remembers the bad stuff. I think the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

There was a 2-3 year time period where she was living a Godly life and things were great. She is now in full swing the other direction. I don't know if she will ever swing back and if she doesn't then I have very little faith that it will work out.

One problem is that when she was living a Godly life and I saw her stray I called her out on it. She doesn't like when anyone does that. Then she rebels, I call her out, she rebels further.........etc.

I don't know how to stop the cycle other than to not say anything. But isn't that like condoning the behavior?

I like that approach.

Well there are several ways of viewing your question and each would have a different answer. We could look at conditioning behavior, psycho therapy and church rules to name a few.
However, this forum is to practice Dr. Harleys methods and its important to remember that all of his program revolves around the Policy of Joint Agreement: Never do anything without enthusiastic agreement between you and your spouse.
In your case, when your wife does something you disagree with, like going out partying, she is showing disregard for your feelings. She is not following the POJA.
Thats as far as we need to go because thats all that matters. She is showing she does not care about your feelings on the matter.

Now, regarding your "calling her out" on backsliding: That can be very disrespectful. You arent the Pope or the local preacher.

So if she breaks the POJA then what is the result? I say nothing and accept it? Not sarcasm, just a real question.

No. Silence is not the response. Dr. Harley would encourage you to say something like "It bothers me when you do XYZ" or "I feel hurt when you go partying"

Yea, I've tried that in the past with no results (several times). Boy we have a loooong way to go before there is a light at the end of this tunnel.

How do I contact Dr. Harley? I emailed his wife's radio show with questions, but can you contact him directly?

You contact him through the radio show, mbradio@marriagebuilders.com. That is the best way.

Let us know when you hear back from him.

I will for sure. As of now WW is still in A and mad as ever. She is away from home tonight because she is busy at "work". She is still very mad about E and if it wasn't for the kids she said she would have already left the area. It seems like things are going worse rather than better right now. I'll keep you all posted. Thanks to everyone for the advise so far.

WW has not left because OM will not provide a house and will not move in with her. This is the real reason why WW is mad. Your exposure made OM have to man up for WW and he is not doing so.

So Davy,
What is your plan? Seems like you have taken some steps to end the affair, but what is your ultimate goal? What are willing to do to achieve your goal? What are you GOING to do? Seems like you are kind of letting everything be determined by your WW. Why don't you take control of this situation?

I would like to work this out if we can, but I know realize that we have a lot of things to work out. Currently WW is still in the fog. We are separating our finances and she is beginning to see how difficult it is to stay within a budget and still maintain a single and married life. I'm hoping that as she calms down reality will set in and she will be willing to fix the marriage. I told her last night that even if the A ended tomorrow we would still have a long way to go before we can try to work this thing out. Either for me or for her.

So are you Plan A'ing? The reason I ask is...

You probably want to avoid educating her.


I can't tell if this is educating her or a threat, either way it probably won't lure her back.


Hope is not a plan, what's your plan?

This might sound a little harsh, but if you do not plan and execute you will likely fail. I encourage you to stop hoping and start planning.

Good Luck!

Here is an update: Dr. Harley answered my question on the radio. It is on today's show. It begins around 40min. Take a listen and let me know what you think.

I am working Plan A, but unsure of how effective it will be.