Did you read this?

Did you read these?

I did not make a demand.. I did not imply any punishment.. I simply asked that we watch something else. When she refused, I still did not make any threat.

What I did do was take an action to not enable it.. it's my house too, I am paying the bill, so I should not enable?

How should I have handled it as to not be an enabler?

Basically... I get the sense that everything I do is wrong in some way...

not showing emotion-> wrong.. means I don't care
showing emotion-> wrong.. it's an angry outburst
not setting limits-> wrong... I lose respect and she walks all over me
setting limits-> wrong...it's an angry outburst, or a fight, or not plan A
staying with her when she is doing something wrong -> wrong it's enabling
walking away when she does something wrong-> wrong.. it's an angry outburst
staying put-> wrong... it's capitulating


Can you see my options? I'm always choosing between evils...

The point is, when I chose something that is potentially wrong, and I err on the side of standing up for my marriage, I do feel better about that decision.

The question... what should / could I do differently?

Quit telling us that everything you did was okay and asking how you could have handled it differently. Start listening to what we are posting so that you'll know how to handle it differently.

The problem with angry outbursts is that they make it impossible for you to see your options. Even if we tell you what they are you won't be able to see them because of the angry outbursts.

She didn't need to get upset. You shot yourself in the foot by having a temper tantrum. The only person who thinks they win by having an AO is the person doing it. Everybody else just sees it for what it is.

Get educated on what Dr. Harley says about Angry Outbursts. What DOES he say?

Get educated on what Dr. Harley says a demand is. You obviously don't know how to identify one.

Get educated on Disrespectful Judgements. It's obvious you still haven't done that.

Get educated on how to properly do a Plan A. It's obvious you still haven't done that, though we've been telling you for quite some time to do so.

You are making up your own plan as you go, and justifying it, and debating with anybody who tells you anything different. You haven't been following the plan, and you STILL aren't.

You played right into her hands and justified her divorcing you. That's why she was not upset. It's exactly what she wanted.

Have you read what the Bible says about anger? [/quote]

http://biblehub.com/galatians/5-20.htm
http://biblehub.com/colossians/3-8.htm
http://biblehub.com/ephesians/4-31.htm
http://biblehub.com/james/1-19.htm
http://biblehub.com/james/1-20.htm
[/quote]

Did you read these? [/quote]




YES... and as much as we try, we all have times when we get angry and we all sin... I want to continue to work on eliminating anger. I want to continue to work on eliminating sin of all kinds, but I am a sinner just like everyone else on here. the reality is that we are all human and we will all have some time that we sin in some way. I pray for God's help, forgiveness, and grace every day. I also understand that I must forgive others to be forgiven myself.

The reason for my post is that part of me was feeling VERY guilty for what I did, but another part of me was feeling GOOD for standing up for my marriage.

I have done a lot of work to eliminate anger... but there is one HOT button that I still have.. .that is hurting my kids or my family. I struggle the most with eliminating anger when my kids are abused or my family is threatened. I love them so much and feel a strong sense to protect them. When I get angry about these things.. I get this mixed emotion.. .extreme guilt for having anger but also a feeling that I am protecting my kids. I basically never yell at my kids... but when one is about to step into the street with oncoming traffic, I YELL! Part of me feels some guilt for yelling and part feels that I did it to protect them.

When Marriage killing trash is beaming into my house.. I got the same instinctual feeling... stop it, protect my family, and stand up for my marriage.

You just proved you aren't learning Marriage Builders at all.

This is like saying "we all have affairs, we all sin." It's called "minimizing."

The Marriage Builders plan works if you learn it and follow it, but it's becoming clear to me you are just writing to justify yourself to us rather than to learn this plan.

I'm here to help people learn the plan, so...

And you're PROUD OF IT!!!!

I think you are right... I think she is even trying to push my buttons and figure out where she can be successful and she found one.

I know that my behavior was wrong..I'm not going to debate. I don't need to re-read the 5 books from Dr Harley that I have already read. None of Dr Harely's suggestions on marital negotiation is going to work with her. She is not interested in POJA. She is not interested in having a safe environment for negotiation... it just won't work with her now.

I am with her all the time that I am at home and I cannot get away from her. For each time that I have slipped on something, there are 100 times that I did not.

I do think that my stress level from all of this is too high at this point.

I guess that I need to try to avoid her for a bit before we can separate or go on AD's. I'm not sure which route I should take.

Her constant barrage of me is taking it's toll on the kids and they are really getting upset. I cannot begin to tell you the things the kids are expressing and how hurt they are by this. They know full well what mom is doing and they are really sad.. they feel sad for me, and that is too much to put on them.

It's really a tough decision right now. I know you all feel that I have not done enough for plan A.. but I have been doing it for 12 months now. Of course I have made many mistakes along the way. My WW has about 10 AO's / day and I have about 1 every couple months, and it's not throwing things, yelling, etc..like her, it's usually just walking away, rolling eyes, being a little passive /aggressive.. something like that. I still want to eliminate it completely and I have a little more work to do.

I am really wondering if I should call it quits on plan A at this point for me and for the kids????

The part about standing up for my marriage YES!!!! the part about being angry NO!!!!

As I think about it... I think being angry was OK, but expressing it was not OK. The part about stopping cable, I actually think was OK (it was not to punish her, it was not about being angry, it was about limits and not enabling)

I thought of it this way... if I were watching porn in the family living room and my wife wife walked in an unplugged the TV, what would you be saying??? that is actually the way I thought about it... it was that immoral in my eyes.

The part that I am NOT proud of, is the way that I walked out. She may not have even noticed it, but I "felt" angry when I walked out to take a walk.

You haven't done Plan A. You have capitulated and been a conflict avoider and called it Plan A, but it's not Plan A.

You were not standing up for your marriage. You were abusing your wife, and justifying it.

And there's really not much more we can do to help you because you believe that AOs are sometimes justified (as long as you call it "standing up for your marriage).

This was one of the first things we worked on in marriage counseling over a year ago. We basically were following Dr. Harley's suggestions. Basically, if we felt any negotiation was getting too emotional, we both had the right to a 20 min time out. My wife really likes having her AO's. I had AO's too, but was working hard to eliminate them. She seemed to get upset with me for not having AO's. It seemed that the less I had them, the more she would have them. She seemed to want to get a "rise" out of me... she would get really angry with me for staying calm.

YES! Plan A is much harder than I ever thought. #1 avoid love busters #2 meet needs... both of these are easy to do with both spouses working on it, but I completely underestimated how hard it is with the other spouse working so hard against you and with raising children at the same time.

I posted a provocative post about my AO because I wanted to learn, not start a debate.


I am still trying to think of other options and I am struggling...

a) I could have tried a thoughtful request... I did try that first. I even suggested a movie title that I through we would both enjoy that she previously said that she was interested in.
b) I could have talked to her more about how what she was doing made me feel, but still let her do it.
c) I could have tried negotiation or POJA... but she did not agree to it
d) I could have simply left the room
e) I could have done nothing, but cancelled the cable the next day
f) I could have sat with her

I brainstormed all these options last night.. but I thought that showing some emotion for the sake of the marriage was the best... I see that you don't agree. I get it... but I do seriously struggle with the other options.

Would any of my other options have been better.. to me they all felt like capitulation? Was there an option that I did not consider?

Again, I posted this to learn something.

Another option... I could have walked out.. bought her flowers and returned to again ask her to stop. Thinking about it, that might also feel like enabling by rewarding bad behavior.

Dr Harley says to avoid fights at all costs in plan A... that means be a conflict avoider right? He basically told me to try to prove that I care for her by giving her whatever she wants but just "don't give away the store"... he said that my wife needs to be given whatever she wants in order to feel cared for. So.. yes, this is why Ii have been capitulating and avoiding conflict. Did I understand it wrong?

You were not just "showing emotion." You became abusive and had an AO. There's a difference. Stop minimizing.