The above comes from http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2737456&page=7

I don't know if this is the correct spot - it isn't related in anyway to my situation - other than from an academic point of view. But it could be interesting (possibly helpful) and I haven't stumbled across it anywhere else. In the notable posts section there is the 15 steps / stages to adultery. What about the stages of love - the Romantic love, caring love... is this discussed somewhere?
Thank you

Hi, Allen,

There are some common ideas of "stages of love" or "stages of marriage," but Dr. Harley is critical of this idea the way it is usually presented.

Typically the "stages of marriage" are depicted as
1. an idealized stage full of romantic love
2. a disillusionment stage where the couple becomes unhappy with each other and romantic love ceases
3. a conflict stage where the couple struggle for control
4. an "enlightenment" stage where the couple mature and learn that romantic love doesn't last forever and learn how to coexist and be more independent of each other rather than relying on each other to meet their needs

As you can see, those stages are pretty much the opposite of what Marriage Builders teaches: that love can last for a lifetime if you learn to meet each other's most important emotional needs effectively and learn to avoid love busters. Using this particular version of "stages," Dr. Harley and his wife Joyce have been at stage 1 for about 53 years and have never made it to stage 2!

Unfortunately a lot of counselors teach that romantic love cannot last forever and that trying to seek romantic love in marriage is dangerous and unrealistic.

Perfect, this is the kind of discussion I wanted to open (again, I totally get that this might be the wrong forum).
So to paraphrase - the stages as described by you - and elsewhere, are the (lets call them) "classic" stages. MB is all about saying lets stay in stage one - here is how.

If (like me) you don't learn about MB until it is too late than programs like SAA are about saying, here - lets get back to stage 1, and stay there.

Am I getting this correctly?
In short, MB is about hijacking the progression through the stages by teaching couples how to stay in stage one.

So the best is if this is a pre-marriage course. I did read that concept in HNHN where a mother gave her son and DIL sessions with Dr. Harley as either a wedding gift or as an anniversary gift (it has been a few weeks now).
Thank you.

From Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders. Freeloader is unwilling to put much effort into the care of his or her partner in a romantic relationship. He or she does only what comes naturally and expects only what comes naturally. It's like a person who tries to live in a house without paying rent or doing anything to improve it unless the person is in the mood to do so.

Renter is willing to provide limited care as long as it's in his or her best interest. The romantic relationship is considered tentative, so the care is viewed as short-term. It's like a person who rents a house and is willing to stay as long as the conditions seem fair, or until he or she finds something better. The person is willing to pay reasonable rent and keep the house clean but is not willing to make repairs or improvements. It's the landlord's job to keep the place attractive enough for the renter to stay and continue paying rent.


These are the stages of slum ownership for home owners who refuse to perform upkeep on their homes:


1. an idealized stage full of happiness in the brand new shiny home
2. a disillusionment stage where the homeowner becomes unhappy because the lack of upkeep is beginning to show, paint is starting to peel, weeds are growing in the garden, windows are getting grimy
3. a stage where the garbage starts to pile up and the house stinks to high heaven
4. an "enlightenment" stage where the homeowner learns that a house doesn't stay nice forever. He must learn how to coexist in a crumbling house until something better comes along
5. a new house is built close by which is beautiful and appealing. Time to leave this dump of a house!!

In short, romantic love crumbles just as a house crumbles if there is no upkeep.

Have you read this and listened to the radio clips in it?
Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders

ML, This makes perfect sense, I guess without realizing it there is info here on this.

BH - Yes, I think you (I would need to check) or someone else provided me with that link on my thread. It was eye opening to me - I was a renter for far too long.

Again, this was meant only as an academic thread based on what I read in an old, old thread.

Thank you.

MB is about the idea that even though 80% of marriages go through these stages, they are the stages of a DYING marriage, not healthy normal stages. MB is about the idea that 20% of couples don't go through these stages and that Dr. Harley studied what these couples do so the rest of us can do what those couples do and not go through those stages either.

Nobody should have to go through the stages of a dying marriage!

Marriage Builders is basically a way to transplant yourself from one culture to another - we have two cultures living side by side, and one has terrible marriages and one has great marriages.

Markos,
If you don't mind, that was beautifully written.

I confess, I am a very visual person - infographics speak clearly to me (if well done), I am working on a one page graphic that has something like these five stages, the 15 STEPS TO INFIDELITY, and the concept from MB that the goal is to stop a marriage moving past stage 1. That it is possible, with a summary of how based on the concepts from here. It won't be anywhere near as good as the books, the radio show, and this forum, but it is mostly for me. Presenting information this way is how I learn best.
It will be something I can refer to quickly to remember, to re-center and help for practicing going forward.
Thank you.

Allan, I think this is a great idea. Could you post your infographics when they are complete? I would love to see them!

I will, it will be a slow process, and will be looking for feedback. I hope all is going well with you.