I am trying to understand what my H is feeling right now and trying to find the strenght to go on. Your posts have made me feel much better about my chances, but what if you are one in a million. (Can I tell you wife how lucky she is?) <P>I would like to ask you some questions if you don't mind. How long did your A last before your wife found out? Do you feel the fog is real? How long before you called your W after you left? <P>My H's A lasted about 18 months before I found out 3 months ago. We talked for the first two months about things until I found out he was still seeing her. I started Plan B after he stated he wanted her forever and have been in Plan B for three weeks. I wonder if he truely loves her and will stay with her or if he is in the fog and will come back. I know three weeks is not long, but it seems like an eternity not talking to or seeing the person I talked to every day for nine years.<P>Any insight would be greatly appreciated and you should be very proud of yourself for your strides to recovery.

Let's see here.<P>My affair was started about a month before my wife found out. I continued my affair for probably 3 months after she allready knew.<P>These dates and times, i'm sure are messed up. It's very difficult for me to recount all the lost time, of what I did and when I did it. So don't quote me here, and well get to that at the bottom, which is something I noticed was interesting in your post "Seems like eternity"<P>I moved out about a week after she knew, during those 3 months I hardly ever spoke with her. I want to say about 2 months passed before I contacted her. She would know better then I would, time is a blur for me during this phase of not talking with my wife.<P>The fog is very much real. I saw fog myself. It's very difficult to get out of the affair, it seems it's easy to create, and more difficult to leave. You get fog from both sides. I always wondered what my wife was up to. Wondering what evil she was planning. I also had some fog of my own in regards to (OW) and I. I wouldn't tell anyone where I was or what I was doing. I would try to be as vague as possible when answering questions to friends, or giving them details about where I was hiding out, and what I had been up to.<P>I thought at one time I was truely in love with (OW) I thought, wow I'm so lucky to have met her, and she's everything I wanted in a woman, she's everything I saw. Everything I had to say about her was postive. I found I even said these things directly to my wife. That I believed (OW) was the perfect person for me.<P>I was definately in the fog myself, it's so damn hard to leave. Once you get there, your so happy and in love with the idea of finding this perfect person, you believe everything is true about her, and you can't understand what you ever saw in your wife. Because this (OP) is so perfect, never doesn't anything wrong, and just loves you. While on the other hand, in my case my wife had hurt me in the past, and I was very unhappy with our marriage.<P>So the fog grows, you re-write history of your own. I re-wrote so many things its scary. I look at them now, and i'm asking what the hell was I thinking? But its just that, more lies you tell yourself, to make things happy. To make yourself happy, and to make (OP) happy.<P>You cannot build on a foundation of lies. So you can't lie to make yourself happy. You after all know the truth, and if you change a story here and there. You still know the truth. So you can lie all you like, but the memories don't change. Even if you picture the memories diffrent, they have a tendancy to resurface correctly.<P>I will say, walking around in the fog myself, is very confusing. You have no idea whats going on, who's doing what, and you don't want to believe that (OP) could possibly just be manipulating you. You spend so much effort convincing yourself that your relationship with (OP) is the best thing that ever happened. You don't have time and effort to look at it objectively.<P>I did that a lot. I spent a lot of time convincing myself, what I was doing, was the right thing. Because I loved this (OW) and she had shown me nothing but love in return. So I continued wandering around in the fog, continued convincing myself that things with her and I would work out, and I would be getting a divorce soon.<P>Out of site and out of mind. If I don't have to look at my wife, and I don't have to see her, I don't have to talk to her, and I spend my days talking to (OW) then the fog grows. For me getting out of that fog, was a lot of question asking of myself. I had to ask what I wanted. I had to listen to what I wanted.<P>Often I said, I don't know what I want. Or I said I wanted (OW). Just more fog again, because I had spent all that time convincing myself I wanted (OW) and not my wife. I dont like to be wrong. That old saying goes, if you believe a lie, it becomes truth. Well that has its merits in the fog. You start to believe things the longer you convince yourself of things.<P>You mentioned it seems like eternity, not talking or seeing the person i talked to every day for nine years. Thats very much how I feel right now, like its been decades since I talked with my wife. It's very interesting, how I've lost track of months, days, weeks, in all of this. I wasn't aware of that at the time of my affair either. So many things happening so fast. Now, I have an opportunity to stop and catch my breath. I stopped running finally. And let myself catch up.<P>Ask any questions you'd like. I'll try and stay as on the subject as I can. I'm more then happy to tell my story.<P><P>------------------<BR>H.<P>My advice is my advice. Take the good, disgard the bad. Do whats right for you. Not because I said it worked for me.

Thank you so much for your reply. I think that my husband could be in much deeper than you were. He was in the affair for 18 months before d-day and that was three months ago. Two years is a long time to live in a lie. Some think that is to my advantage because the truth will hit harder and faster and some think it is a disadvantage because he is in so deep. <P>I don't know what to think. I just want my H back and I want the OW gone. There is no way to know that she will do things to drive him away and there is no way to know if he will miss me enough to want to come back.<P>This is the hardest thing I have ever gone through and he doesn't even care right now. The bad part is he may never care.<P>Thanks again for your reply. It helps to know there are good people out there.

Two years is a long time to live a lie. However I don't believe anyone enjoys a complicated life of lying and making things much more difficult. He might be deep in the fog, but it's just that Fog. Fog moves slowly, and it takes time to get out of it. Even I struggled at first getting out. When I left (OW) it was because I finally saw something she didn't want me to see. I finally saw the truth and reality of the situation, not the fairy tale we were building. <P>So I came to these realizations even on an up cycle with (OW) and myself. We had been talking, having a good time, and living life, and I still came out of the fog. So you don't nessicarily have to wait for her to drive you away, just have to be strong, and look through the fog. Which is something I didn't want to do, I didn't want to doubt what we had. I did so anyway. I doubt i'm one in a million. I'm not the most intelligent person, not the dumbest. We all walk, run, and live in the fog during those times. We just have to have a want to see something else.<P>My want to see out of the fog was this deep down feeling, that I knew even if I didn't stay with my wife. That I needed to get out of the situation with everyone. I knew that I couldn't start another relationship on the foundation of an affair. It's when I started taking that time for me, that time to really think, it started to click for me. It was a lot of things, but I still wanted to believe that (OW) and I would live happily ever after.<P>It's a tough place to be, it can be so confusing, and I had no idea I was even there in the first place. Many of us don't even see how clouded our judgement is, how confused we are. We just end up saying. I dont know anything anymore. Or I don't know what I want.<P><P>------------------<BR>H.<P>My advice is my advice. Take the good, disgard the bad. Do whats right for you. Not because I said it worked for me.

We give away a lot of things, giving up (OP) we give up our friendship we started out with originally. So it's not an easy thing to say. Well I've gotta give something up to again be with my husband or wife. I realized I was giving up very little in the big picture. I was giving up one person for a life of happiness, growth, and love.<P>When we give up our wives, or husbands for the other person it's because they are meeting our needs, emotional, and physically. I see that. I hung on ever word of (OW) I believed everything she told me, I believed we'd eventually even get married. I believed a lot of things then. That was just more fairy tale bs.<P>No one likes to be alone. So we give it all away just to have somewhere to go to. Give a lot of things up to have someone to come home to. I never felt like I was giving up a lot when it came to my wife in the beginning. Since I was getting (OW) this perfect person for me it seemed. I just took me a while to realize I was giving up way more then I wanted to. I was giving up a lot of things for a lie, and an affair which was a mistake.<P>So I had to stop continuing to make the mistake. Ego kicks in. Well i'm [H]! I don't make Farking mistakes. I'm never wrong, and this and that.<P>Yeah... well I am definately [H] I made some huge mistakes, I made a lot of mistakes. I'm human, and I'm weak, and I make mistakes, and I'm happy to say, this is one I didn't continue to make untill it was to late.<P>And if my wife happens to read this. Thank you for your support my love, thank you for everything you gave to us. Thank you for being a wonderful inspiration to me. Thank you so much for everything. Thank you for being patient. Thank you for being understanding. Thank you for continuing to believe in me. Thank you for all the times you still had hope in us ("Even when I told you not to have hope in us. That I wanted a divorce.") I love you.<P>I have problems with punctuation, and getting out what I mean. I apologize if anyone interpreted my lines wrong above. So I edit my stuff a lot. :P<P>H.<p>[This message has been edited by [H] (edited June 12, 2001).]

You will vener know how much help you have been to me the past two days and how much pain you have eased in my heart. I know that I can not look at your story and say that the same will happen for my H and myself, but there is always that hope that things will work out and when you read a story like yours it adds to the hope greatly. <P>Thank you soooo much for being there for those of us that need that hope right now. There are mornings when the only thing that gets me out of bed is the fact that there is still hope. <P>Thanks again and good luck on your continued journey of recovery. May it be a happy one. You and your W deserve this.

Glad to help SF.<P>Glad to do what I can to help give back support. Support both my wife and myself got from this forum here. Also showing things can and do get better as a result of hopes, wants, and desires. "Keep the faith" no reason not to. Even if your H tells you. How many times do I have to tell you this or that. I too said those things. I too used the standard (WS) scripts. I'm glad to help give some hope back to the people here. These people were there when my wife needed them, and they too gave her hope when it seemed there shouldn't be any.<P>Thank you for your praises and good wishes on my marriage. I appreciate it, and I know my wife does as well. I wish you well on your own marriage, I hope he catches a glimpse of what it was I saw that allowed me to get out of that fog and into that intital stage of wondering what I was doing.<P>Keep praying, keep the faith, keep hoping. Theres plenty of people who will help you in the time of need. I'm more then happy to give my time back to a community of good people who helped my wife, my marriage, and myself. Who will also continue to do so in this recovery stage.<P>------------------<BR>[H] / Aeon Blue<P>My advice is my advice. Take the good, disgard the bad. Do whats right for you. Not because I said it worked for me.<p>[This message has been edited by [H] (edited June 13, 2001).]

H - Your story is inspirational! I'm 3 months in plan A and my wife tells my she will not end her affair right now. She says she's confused. She tried to stop seeing OM, even sent him a letter a few weeks ago to him telling him she was committed to our marriage and to stop calling. But she went back to him last Friday, and sleeps over his place.<P>I'm just trying to be patient. NO LB's. We have an appponitment with Steve H. in 2 weeks and my wife says she will complete the EN and LB questionnaires for me this weeks. She says she will spend time with me and our kids this Father's Day.<P>Somtimes I think I'm a fool for remaining hopeful, that I'm just deluding myself. To make matters worse I'm curently unemployed, money is running out, she doesn't work, and my wife seems to be happy in some kind of fantasy (FOG). My job prospects seem likely to require us to relocate, which I would welcome, and my wife says she will move. I told her I could not leave our family behind, and she says that she will move too and not break-up our family. But at this time I'm so afraid that her FOG has made her completely irrational, so I don't believe her.<P>I had a job interview this week for a position In Florida and she said she would relocate and we even discussed it in front of our young boys. But I think she would even mislead them.<P>The OM she is seeing is practically penniless, self employed handy man, and has little going for him. But now he has my wife and is meeting her emotional need that I did not. I love her still and want her back!<P>Any advise? Should I just give her space, privacy, not pry? and just let her work this through on her own? I told hew I want to help and to be here for her...to try to meet her emotional needs. Please share. You sound so insightful.<P>Never say die!

I am interested and I have a question relating to this line... My wife's D-Day was June 1. Since then the OM has been in CA and not due back till 6/20. Wife is going through all the classic withdrawal - anger at me, guilt, pushing incredible expectations for me to reach. All of which is no problem since I am going to counseling as well as her. Also friends and family support is strong. The question is this:<BR>Since she has evolved this past 13 days, she went from hating me to today saying that she loves me but is not in love with me. Says that the OM fulfills the in love part of it. How does this progress away from this? She has spoken with him on the phone a few times, but not from our house as I requested this from her. What can I do to help push him gently away from her in her mind and move towards me. I am fully supporting her in all her decisions, told her that I cannot and will not attempt to control her or give her demands.<P>She is at a very weak and vulnerable spot and I want to know what is my next move. She understands that she cannot see him and will need to make a clean break from him. As I said, he comes bsck in 6 days and I want to have her more leaning more out of the fog.<P>Thanks!

Never say die!, also Hubby for her. Hope this helps both of you.<P>Well.. I told all my friends my wife was a fool to hope we'd ever get back together. I was dead set on making anything and everything work with (OW) and myself.<BR>Confusion is the first sign of the fog lifting. You start to doubt your choices with (OP) You start doubting a lot of things. Wondering what the hell your doing at times.<P>At times I thought I was dead set on things. This is what I was going to do, and no one was going to stop me. No one had to stop me. The confusion set in, you begin to wonder what the hell your doing. I often said, ("I'm so confused, I dont know what I want anymore, who I want, what I want to do, where I will be, who I will be with") This was strange for me. This is normal, its the first sign of doubt. The choices aren't so clear anymore.<P>Your not delusional, for remaining hopeful. I had to have something to come back to. If my wife was a complete pychopath, was nasty the entire time, wasn't supporting of me, wasn't caring, wasn't understanding, wasn't loving. Theres no way I would have come back. It only reenforces what I was allready thinking. She showed me the opposite.<P>She too remained hopeful, and I have said many times in many posts. I never gave her a reason to be that hopeful. I kept telling her. Don't have hope for us, and give up. She remained hopeful, caring, loving, supportive. She was being the friend I could talk with at times.<P>Market is tough right now, Economy is hard. It's that way for all of us. That will change. Be strong there too Take care of the things you need to take care of. Be strong and independant as well. I was happy in the fog, living the life I thought I wanted. The fog is a happy place at times because it hides the truth. It hides a lot of things. Your perception of things is distorted.<P>She will move too? Then move my friend First thing that popped in my head when I saw your sentence ("that she will move too and not break-up our family") Help... <P>Sounds to me she wants some help, she's confused. Not sure what to do. Perhaps asking you to make the choice for her. To make the choice of leaving (OP) easier.<P>I too wanted something similar. I wanted my wife to help make it easier for me at times. I wanted her to say, look this is what your going to do. Like it or not. I was confused after all. I wasn't sure what I wanted. So I looked to other people for help. I never saw clear answers, those came from talking with my friend one day. Everything I had been saying, and writing to him added up. Less confusion.<P>She needs help, and support. She's asking for it. Thats my take on that. Not sure what you should do, your situation may change, it also may change by the minute. I had my own cries for help as well. We all do.<P>The (OM) Doesn't have your wife. He only thinks he does. She doesn't belong to him. She isn't property. It's her choice. It's her choice to be with him. This choice is influenced, and can be greatly influenced.<P>She's reaching out for help, she's wondering if she's doing the right thing. (OM) is telling her yes, and things will be okay. She's second-guessing that. Good. Confusion rocks.. It works in your advantage. It allows for uncertainty, then you start doubting, when you start doubting things, you look at all sides of it. Not just what one person (OP) is telling you. I did.<P>Show love, show understanding, show caring. These are things we need. (OP) can't show that. They can only say these things. They can only say negative things about our wives or husbands to make themselves look better. They can't and don't know that things will be okay. They too are in the fog. Wanting to believe this is the best thing. Wanting to believe a lot of things. You on the other hand. Aren't in the fog. This is an advantage. You see with clarity the reality of the situation.<P>I said this to my friend:<BR>(Me)<BR>She's hurt me pretty bad in the past, and she's showing me so much love and compassion lately, and all I do is hurt her, and that worries me. She's changed a lot, it makes me second guess a lot of things..<BR>(Me)<BR>Like what the hell am I doing?<P>I saw the changes in her. I saw these things, even if I didn't want to see them. I saw that she was this caring, loving woman. Strong, Independant, Taking care of things, Doing things for herself, and the good of our family.<P>Theres a lot you can do. You'll wonder how? I feel so powerless because I can't directly step in the way, and change things.<P>Well the change doesn't have to be direct. It can be indirect like my wife showed me. I checked up on her. As many of us (WS's) do. We check up for fear of "Whats coming next" Paranoid, we also check up on this person. Because we still love her / him.<P>It's when I was checking up on my wife, I noticed changes. Serious changes. I asked what the hell happened to the woman who said I was her rock. Who couldn't seem to function without me. I've shown her nothing but hate. She continues to love me. I've been nasty. She's been nice. I've done everything to litterally crush her for eternity. She still loves me and cares for me.<P>These changes are noticed. I was deep in the fog, running away from everything. I still saw these things. No way I couldn't see them. It may take time to see them, but I don't see how you couldn't.<P>Hope this helps. This was from my perspective here. Trying to jump back in the frame of mind, stop and recall all the things that happened, and now put them into words.<P>------------------<BR>[H] / Aeon Blue<P>My advice is my advice. Take the good, disgard the bad. Do whats right for you. Not because I said it worked for me.<p>[This message has been edited by [H] (edited June 14, 2001).]

Thanks for the inspiration! She went to my counselor today as hers is a goof! Glad that she is seeing a Christian based. <P>Not saying that I have been the most attentive or best Hubby. I understand my role in all this and can only work to right myself and get well with anger and control issues. <P>Just continue down my path of support, caring and love. No demands, no LBs.<P>Any suggestions on when OM comes back on June 20? What should I do? Should I be home or go out to visit customers?<BR>I need some insight, please!<P>Thanks!

Well I dont know what to suggest really. In my case I had seen my wife was busy. She was out doing things, fun things, and I to wanted to go do fun things.<P>So at first it was difficult to contact her. It seemed she was so busy. Out a ball games with friends, or out to dinner, or out with her family, just doing things. I however did get a chance to contact her. She did leave me ways to get in touch with her. So that made me feel "Safe" that she wasn't totally avoiding me, and that I did have an opportunity to talk with her.<P>So I would say. Go about your buisness as usual. Take care of the things that you need to do. Don't sit around waiting for a phone call you may or may not get. However leave an open way of communication.<P>Reason I say this is like so.<P>When I got done talking with my friend one night. I wanted so much to talk with her, I wanted so much to talk with her. It seemed eternity was passing before she got off work. I was happy (OW) did not call or try and contact me during this time period. I think my plan was to dodge the phone call. I never opened my email box during this time either. I was scared to talk with (OW) fearing, that I just stumbled upon fixing my marriage, and that things were gonna fall right back the way they were. So I needed to talk to my wife, I needed her to tell me things would be okay between us. That I hadn't hurt her beyond repair. Beyond her love for me.<P>So it was a very frightening time for me. As i also knew the last time (OW) and I had a huge fight we fell right back into that quicksand after we talked. So I was afraid that I was going to hurt my wife again. I was scared so much I didn't even want to answer the phone. Or open my email. I didn't want to contact or think about (OW) I was on my way out of the fog, and it was getting clearer by the minute.<P>Point i'm trying to make is this "She was unavailable at times, but available when I needed her the most"<P>------------------<BR>[H] / Aeon Blue<P>My advice is my advice. Take the good, disgard the bad. Do whats right for you. Not because I said it worked for me.

[H],<BR> How long have you been married? <P> Does anyone think it makes a difference how long you've been marred in how hard a couple tries to make their marriage work during/after an A?<P>Not in our case. We are married 20 years, so I'm NOT ABOUT to throw that in the garbage!<P>Lupo

[H],<P>I haven't been to this board in several weeks (since my W "told" me she had filed for divorce). I came back here a day or so ago and started reading your posts. I remember you from the Aeon Blue days. I too, like the others have responded, am extremely encouraged and heartfelt by your postings (under the [H] penname). Thank you for sharing your perspective on things, I know it must be hard.<P>Now I have some questions for someone with such tremendous insight. Did you ever get to a point at which you told your W that you were considering reconciling, but were not sure? If so, how long did it take for you to be sure? Did your W do anything to help the decision? If so, what was it? I'm sorry about the questions, but my W told me two weeks ago that she is reconsidering reconciling, but is not sure at this point. She did go to counseling yesterday with me - first time since she told me she had filed for divorce a month ago (which btw she still hasn't done - she's drawn up paperwork and has given her attorney a retainer, but has not proceeded. She's gives me a bunch of reasons like her attorney dropped the ball and that he is still working on it etc)<P>I think my W is starting to show signs of coming out of the fog - would you agree? I am hoping you can give me insight if there is anything that the spouse can or cannot do when the WS is at this point.<P>thank you again<BR>S&C<p>[This message has been edited by sadandconfused (edited June 15, 2001).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lupolady:<BR><B>[H],<BR> How long have you been married? <P> Does anyone think it makes a difference how long you've been marred in how hard a couple tries to make their marriage work during/after an A?<P>Not in our case. We are married 20 years, so I'm NOT ABOUT to throw that in the garbage!<P>Lupo</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Lupo,<P>I'll answer this part for [H]. We've been married a little over 3 and a half years. We've been together for 5 almost 6 years. <P>My thoughts on if how long you've been married defines your willingness to work on the marriage are its does not matter how long you've been married. But this is just my state of mind. When I married [H] I said until death do us part and you know what, I'm sure NOT dead!!! <P>I'll come back later and make more comments. I'm at work and I'm supposed to be working. Shhhh <P>K/LostNco/DSN<BR>[H]'s wife <P>

Hey {H} since you're answering questions thought I'd throw one out to you too.<P>I have been reading your postings and have gotten quite a lot of valuable insight from them. I don't believe I have read any WS's reflections that better convey to the BS what is going on in the "fog".<P>My question is "How important was it during your struggle that your wife remain constant and loving and do you think that had an influence on your decision?". There seems to be a thin line between being supportive and being taken advantage of. In your fog did you realize that you had no reason to ask for support after what you had done....or to expect it either? I have a tendency to think everything that WS does he does with the knowledge that it will effect me in some way...good or bad. Is the fog so thick that effects are obscured? Or can I say to myself "He's not meaning to hurt me...or even, this shouldn't hurt me...because it has little to do with me." I think if I could firmly believe this it would help me to be more supportive.<P>This has been going on a long time for me...and I am just now seeing some lifting of the fog...but still have problems overreacting to what is going on...because I think I read motives into my WS actions that are not always there....in a way I hurt myself. Crazy, isn't it.<P>Anyway, thank you for taking the time to delve into your feelings during all this...you don't know how valuable it has been...even for old timers like me.<P>Faye <p>[This message has been edited by buffy (edited June 15, 2001).]

I need answers to those same questions. My wife is certainly in the fog. I saw signs of it lifting past two days, but today she is alof and cold. Really quiet. I have been working around the house, tending to the kids needs (we have three boys 12, 9 and 7) She just seems to not want to be part of even their lives. Is this normal for WS to be depressed one day, cold and aloof the next. I know she's communicating with him. She told me that he's confused about what he'll do when he returns from CA on June 20. I wonder if he'll really tell his wife - he's living a charmed life. His wife makes $130K, he dosen't work (he has a problem with authority) he takes care of the house and kids, but if you saw the squalor they live in and the behaviors of their children, you'd see that he can't even do that! At any rate, if he dosen't come clean with his wife, he can have the best of both worlds. I'm just afraid that my wife will still be seduced by his fulfilling her needs. I know that I can't stop this from happening, that I just need to be there and love, support and comfort, but I'm needing insight as well.<P>What are the signs that she is pulling out of the fog? I tell her that I love her and she replies "I know you do." Is this a sign? Does she see the extra efforts I'm doing around the house? Since I never made efforts to do laundry, sort socks or put away cloths in the past, is this filling the bank account for me? I just need some insight. I'm feeling burned and she's continuing to put me down and tell me all the things I've done or said in the past - and I just tellher that I'm working on me, changing the behaviors of the past to have a future.<P>I am just feeling depressed. Any insights?

Buffy,<P>This is a difficult question. I will see if I can give my perspective again on this.<P>Most important thing. I had to have a want to leave the fog. I had to have reason to see things diffrently.<P>So while I was in the fog, and my wife remained caring, loving, and supportive. I never really spoke to her during that time period I moved out. During what I consider the height of the (A) I still saw those things, and I still told her to move on without me. It seemed as I was moving on without her after all.<P>It's was very important to me and my situation that she remained loving towards me. This very much influenced my decision. Not directly at first, but indirectly. I reached a point where I said I was tired of hurting "Everyone". I was mainly upset with myself, for hurting a woman who loved me so much. I started to see things diffrently as well. I didn't want to hurt her anymore. She had learned so much, grown so much, changed a lot.<P>This below again is from my chat logs, prior to recovery, and prior to talking with my wife about fixing our marriage.<P>(Me)<BR>Knewjie hurt me pretty bad in the past friend, and she's showing me so much love and compassion lately, and all I do is hurt her, and that bothere me. She's changed a lot friend, and its from her reading, learning, and growing.. it makes me second guess a lot of things..<BR>(Me)<BR>Like what the hell am I doing?<BR>(Friend)<BR>It's not to late to change direction.<P>This is an important piece for me. I didn't want to continue to hurt her. I recognized that. I started second guessing myself, and my choices during my (A)<P>Now as for the second piece of your question. "Did I realize I had no reason to ask for support?"<P>Yep.. Very much so, in fact I thought I wanted the opposite. I couldn't understand why this woman still loved me. In fact I didn't contact her much, but when I did. She was always so wonderful to me. It left lasting impressions. She didn't blow up at me for everything I was doing. She didn't freak out even when I was being irrational. She talked with me as a friend, was very calm, very caring of me. Asking me how I was doing, if I was eating.<P>She let me do the talking, she listened. Was non-confrontational about everything. Even when I was attacking her one night. I told her how our marriage was screwed up because of her. I was blaming her. She owned the blame, and said yes. Well I have been working on myself, I have been learning, and I see things diffrently now. I see all these things I did to you, and I am sorry. She then listed off things that she had done in our marriage that hurt me. She apologized to me a lot that day.<P>Me looking back on that now. I cannot believe what an "A-hole" I was blaming her for all these things, and the downfall of our marriage. I made mistakes too, and I was the one who had the (A). None the less, she took responcibily for the things I said she had done. For the things she know's she did. I guess those parts of me came out rational. I don't think I blamed her for things that weren't true, or just made up things to blame on her.<P>There is a thin line of support and being taken advantage of. I think, you know when your being taken advantage of. I'm sure my situation isn't much diffrent from many out there. Where your husbands or wives don't contact you much during the affair. It's when they do, you can be supportive, can be loving, give them a reason to see you've changed and things will be diffrent.<P>Don't give us a reason to justify our actions. By saying "Your having an (A)!!!!" That only add's to it.<P>So I think by my wife not blaming me at the time helped me to see things diffrently, it helped me to defend her in the long run and tell myself. "She's not the only one who's at fault here. Look what I am doing to her." Which is demonstrated above in my chat with my friend.<P>I never expected support from my wife. In fact I was expecting the opposite. I was expecting her to flip out and do as much damage to me as she could. Taking our money, hiring lawyers to jerk me around, calling friends and family telling them what I was doing. Giving me every reason to hate her that much more. Don't add fuel to the fire...<P>At times I did stop and do what I thought was good for both of us. There are some negatives and postives associated with that. <P>I left my wife with most of our property, I wanted to be fair in our bills. I wanted to make sure that I wasn't going to put us both into debt. I also said I didn't want to get to a point where we had lawyers involved and fighting for us. I thought we could be friends after all of this was done. So I did try and do things I thought were for the good of both of us.<P>Hope this helps some.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers, Hugs, and Strength from both of us. Things do and can get better. Keep hoping, learning, and growing. Take care of yourself.<P>[H] and Knewjie<p>[This message has been edited by [H] (edited June 15, 2001).]

Hubby for her,<P>("I tell her that I love her and she replies "I know you do."")<P>Said that exact same thing many times Word for word. Standard script acknowledgment of love. We do see it. We know its there. We may not say it ourselves. Check out my post above this one (Specifically for) how I blamed my wife, and put her down as well.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers, Hugs, and Strength from both of us. Things do and can get better. Keep hoping, learning, and growing. Take care of yourself.<P>[H] and Knewjie

Thanks [H} You gave me the answer I needed. <P>You are a lucky man you know. Not many women are capable of dealing with all this with as much compassion and understanding as your wife did. You really should thank God that he thought you were worth having been given this woman for a lifetime...because you probably will never realize what she has done for you. And I will try to follow her excellent example in deal with my WS. <P>I wonder why so few WS are as candid or willing to discuss their A as you are. I have gotten so much out of reading your posts. Only a few of us have ever had the experience of being on the other side...so we're unable to really explain even to ourselves what is going on in the mind of the WS. At least you given us a clue. Thanks again...and please know that I consider you an answer to my prayers tonight. That puts you in pretty good company.<P>Faye<P>