You know, you people are great. I am so impressed by the way you talk to each other and try to help. It's really amazing. <BR>So now that I've tried to flatter everyone here's my vent. I sent my WS packing because a) she refused, explicitly to do anything to work on our marriage; b) the level of tension in our house was at the breaking point and it seemed really out of my control; c) she would not break off all contact with the OM, she works with him and although she intimated that the affair was not going on, she never actually said the words. When I asked her, that would be a cause for her to get very angry and leave for a few hours, punishing both me and the kids. And I couldn't keep plan Aing under those circumstances, I was beginning to not like her at all.<P>So she's moved out, got her own apartment, started a new life, and now, it seems to me, is somehow taking our kids away from me. Let me explain. We have two boys 18 and 17, and a girl 14. I've always thought I've had a good relationship with all my kids. My wife even told her sister, while she was trying to convince her sister that her A was "true love" that I was a good dad and she'd never do anything to hurt that relationship. But suddenly, now, it seems my kids are spending alot more time over at "her place." and they've become very secretive about what goes on over there. They don't tell me a thing about it. Just yesterday my daughter spent the night and when it got to be 1:00 the next day, I was getting worried about her, so I called, no answer. I went out looking, and ran into them. Well they had been garage saleing for "mom's apartment"<P>It's like my W walked away, leaving me with all the responsibility, and now my kids are all going over there like it's some kind of "party pad" and I'm left alone to pay bills, keep up the house, do everyone's laundry, etc.<P>This hurts like hell. I don't want to do anything to disassociate them from their mom, and I feel like a real [censored] for thinking, "wait a minute, she left them, they shouldn't be trying to make her feel good." But that is the way I feel. In some ways, it's kind of like my kids are sabotaging my Plan B. And on the surface, they seem so "ok" with the whole thing. My second son, "j" said to me, "well dad, it's like this, mom is just in a different directory now. It's harder to get to, but it's there." He's really into computers - it's one of the many things we have in common.<P>Am I an [censored]***e to think they should feel this more? I'm beginning to thing I really am the main problem. She seems so happy and getting on with her life and I'm sitting here, just trying to keep things together.<P>Ok, shoot me guys, I think I need it.<P>Ishmael

Hi there-<P>You don't need to be shot Maybe a cyber hug to help you through another day?<P>{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{ishmael}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}<BR>Way back when I was 3 years old my parents seperated and then divorced. Kids never know what to do or what to think or feel when this happens. <P>Your kids are older but might I say they are still kids! They don't want to lose mom-there is a connection between moms and kids. Of course there is a connection between dads and kids too-but both are different!<P>In the end of all this let me tell you that the kids will have to most respect for the parent who acts the most like a parent should act. They will go where the stability is, where the love is, where "home" is.<P>I think as long as you continue to be the good dad I know you are they will come around to "see the light".<P>I am sure right now they are as confused as you are.<P>Take care and hug a kid <P>------------------<BR>*heartache*<P>"Life's A Dance<BR>You Learn As You Go.<BR>Sometimes You Lead<BR>Sometimes You Follow!<BR>Don't worry 'Bout What You Don't Know<BR>LIfe's A Dance <BR>You Learn As You Go."

I,<P>My take on yoursituation is this: your kids are very sure of your love and role int heir lives. You are the stable person in their life and they know they can count on you. However, their Mom left. She is not the stable force in their lives. I think they probably feel the need to reach out to her - maybe for fear of losing her and her love.<P>It is easy to understand how you feel. We all have felt that way on some level. You get stuck with reality, and she runs off to live the fantasy. It hardly seems fair. You know, all I can say is this. I have seen other men and women in your shoes. In the long run, the kids know and rememer who was there day in and day out. They grow up closer to the one who was there for them.<P>Take heart and remember that all you do now will be repaid to you one thousand times over through the love of your kids back to you. Allow them to love their Mom, too, as it is separate form their love for you. You are doing well to love and care so much for your children.<P>Desiree <P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Ishy - simply stated, she's the one who needs mental floss (in one ear and out the other), not you.<P>I can identify with your feelings very well. My 12 yo son believes his Mom's denial of an affair and it's so obvious she's hiding reality from him just as much as she hides it from herself.<P>Ditto heartache and Desiree. Try to look beyond this period at the long term. Do what you know is right and your kids will respect you for it. They're old enough to identify your wife's fog - which may be the silver lining in this cloud. Sit back and wait for them to describe to you some of her actions and statements that they can't believe.<P>WAT

Thanks everyone.<P>I know this stuff. I know it. But the emotions just don't listen to the mind very well sometimes.<P>BTW worthatry, I've been reading some of your posts and you seem to me to be a man of uncommon patience. Well, most people here do, but you seem to have been phenomenal. You were very encouraging to me with your "success story" you posted under another thread. Thanks very much.

Ishy - you are too generous. Rick 37, sing, and hurtinginil get my patience awards.<P>In a way, I've been "cheating" (pun intended).<P>You see, my wife's behavior, I believe, has been driven primarily by her unresolved grief over the death of our younger son (almost two years ago now). This does NOT mean I think I had no contribution in creating the environment for the affair to happen. But because of this life crisis, I have a better understanding of why we find ourselves in this mess and I feel an obligation to be supportive to my wife despite her betrayal of me. Maybe others would say I'm too understanding or foolish or co-dependent, but it feels like the right thing to do.<P>WAT

I think this is a normal response for the kids- like some one further up said- they still are trying to make that connection..<P>Mine (ages 12, 9 and almost 4) think dad is the good guy!!! Oh, they know he is the one that cheated on me- and that he is the one that did this to our family- they are mad at him but also- they love him and are confused!!<P>Infact, NOW they see him trying to love me and show me love- and I am the bad guy because I am saying it is over!!<P>I don't take it too personally- but it does make me mad- because they just don't get it- My oldest said- "well- just don't think about it everyday mom- what he has done isn't that big of a deal if you don't think about it!" HA! Of course, coming from a 12 year old- well.....he didn't see all of the dynamics- so- you know!!! <P>They are also very worried about him- like- "where is he going to live now" "does he need to take our tv so he has one"- you know- WORRIED ABOUT HIM!! I keep telling them that they need to not worry about HIM- that it's his job to worry about THEM..it doesn't stop them though.<P>My daughter (the three year old) also tells me I'm not her best friend any more and she asks for him all the time....<P>It saddens me, but I think this is common- some day your kids will realize what they have in you- and that you represent the strength and stability and reasoning for them....at least- I say that in HOPES that it's true- because that is what I'm hanging onto as I make this decision ya know?! LOL<P>Will your wife come to an agreement with you in regard to what is acceptable and not acceptable in terms of behaviour, discipline, responsiblity, gifts, etc....Kids will try to play you against eachother- cause although they are innocent and sweet- they also aren't DUMB <P>Good luck to you!!<P>TLFM

too late:<P>Thanks for the post. I really appreciate it.<P>I thought I'd share this with you. My 14 year old daughter is the caretaker type. Not too swift when it comes to housework (I wish :0), but emotionally. So she thinks it's her job to make sure "mom and you" are happy. It's so sweet, and I want to kick her butt at the same time. Ok, when I'm 90 I'll take that, but for now, that's my job, ok?<P>The other thing is that you are right, they are trying to keep that connection going and in order to do that, they do try to minimize what happened. But I've noticed something kind of interesting about my kids. We watch a lot of movies together. These days, when there's one that has adultery in the plot, they hate the movie if the adulterous character is painted sympathetically. They see it much more seriously than they used to. I just think that's kind of interesting.<P>Take care, best of luck to you, and thanks again.<P>Ish