Well we did it. We sat down and talked about M yesterday. First we made mad passionate love and it was GREAT!! Sorry just needed to tell someone. H actually opened up to me and told me of his fears about our M about how he is not coming home until he feels he can commit to it and at this point he doesn't know if he has it in him to try again. He loves me, cares about me said it really hurts him and makes him feel bad when I cry and am upset. He came from a family where his parents fought, alot of abuse they eventually divorced, got remarried, and divorced again. He said he will not go through that or put his kids through that.We talked about how we got to this point in our M about his "friendship" with OW. He told me that he does think about coming home and has alot of doubts as far as if he does how long will it be before we end up back to this point again. I tried to tell him that there are no guarantees and that I am willing to do whatever I need to to make things right on my part. He said he's afarid that the first time that we get into an argument that I will throw everything in his face. I can see that he is struggling within himself. Is this a good sign? We went out last night with the kids to a fair and we had a pretty good time. This is wierd, I ran into my cousin at the fair, we are not very close and she said I thought the two of you were separated? I ask her how she knew and she said that she and my other cousin had gone to a psychic(I don't believe in them) and the first question they were asked is if they knew someone by my name and they said yes that they had a cousin, the psychic preceded to tell them that my H was cheating on me and that he was very controlling and they were suppose to give me a message that everything would be okay. Isn't that strange? We came home and he came in for a few minutes gave me a couple kisses and said he'd call me tomorrow. He called at 9:00 this morning and we talked for a little bit he had a few things to do and I ask if he wanted to do anything later today he said we'll see I'll call you. I don't want to push because he also told me that when I push him and give him ultimatums it pushes him further away. Any WS who would like to comment your thoughts would be greatly appreciated. <BR>cybil

Well, Cybil, I'm not exactly a WS, but you commented on my thread last night, and I got great comfort from your words, so I will try to help you out!<P>First of all, the simple fact that he is willing to talk about your M is a good sign! You know that. He admitted feelings for you, THAT is a good sign. He "thinks" about coming home, and that is a very good sign!<P>I think you are on the right track. Please just be patient, listen to everything he says. I don't even think reassuring him of all his fears at this point is necessary. I think he just needs to verbalize it, and hear your reaction to it, and convince himself that what you are saying is truly going to happen. He WANTS to believe you are right in saying you won't hold it over him, but that is every WS's fears, I think. Of course! It's human nature. THEY feel THEY would "hold it over" us if the shoe were on the other foot. But, of course, that's where they are wrong.....just like the people who always try to convince us to "divorce them, get on with your life..." It's the "way of the world" and the way most people initially think. So they just want to believe it's the ONLY way. It's not. You know that.<P>More conversations with him and more "showing" him the new you (without crying if possible) is the only thing that will nudge him off the fence. You know what you need to do. Reassure him of your love (you did that for sure!! ) and just be patient and Plan A....<P>I think it's doing fine!! Congratulations!<P>lupo

Cybil-<BR>I wanted to share some of my story- not to dampen your spirits, but I certainly would have handled things differently than I did.<P>My H was saying the same things to me about a month ago. He had not yet ended his A and I was having a real hard time with that and trying to negotiate the ending of the A. As it turns out, when he tried to end it, she put him on a guilt trip and we are now back to where we started.<P>So, knowing this, if I could have done it differently, I would have put no pressure on him. He was saying that he didn't know if he could make me happy- I kept trying to convince him that he could if he wanted to. Bottom line for me, we should not have discussed all the details of what I would want him to do, the changes that we would need to make, etc. He was not in a place to discuss this stuff until the A was ended. Also, let him end it his way- no pressure. I learned this the hard way too. <P>Good luck to you. I know how exciting this new turn can be- just don't go overboard. Continue to be patient.

Hi Cybil,<P>Glad to hear you had a nice time. Has your H given you hope? I know you'd like to feel that way and so would we. He is in a state of confusion right now and it can go either way. <P>Why do the Ws's have such a fear of returning to their families? Is it just a pat excuse that they teach at WS course on how to leave your family? No. But many repeat that fear so we know it is real. <P>Now we respond is important. Pay attention but don't look anxious. When you speak, wait for a response, don't try to speak for him. Even listen to the silence. That's a hard one for me. A few times, I have said that I will take your silence as a yes or no. You know what? When I was having a major anxiety attack, that is the same technique H used on me? I did not want to talk, so he used the same logic on me. ....ah ..... now I know that he knows what he is doing by not answering. Will he do this again? Now that he knows what it feels like? I am not sure. But it might have been a way to help the confict avoider face his issues better. <P>So, help your H enjoy being with his family. That is something the OW can not do. Be glad of that.... the rest will come later. Us Bs's are just a bit anxious dontcha think? I know I am. ....LOL!!!! <P>Take care,<BR>L.<P>

Cybil:<P>Your H sounds like My W did a few months ago. This is some of what she said:<P>1. I love you<P>2. I can't come home until I know I can commit to relationship<P>3. I feel bad to see you feel so bad and the hurt I caused <P>4. I am afraid you can't let go of this (A) and that ever time we have an argument it will be thrown back at me.<P>What I did to get past this is to try to listen and validate her concerns about commitment...basically I told her I didn't want her to come home until she was committed to us. She is now home.<P>I tried to assure her that this was not going to be tossed back at her for the rsst of our lives. In reality it couldn't because then I would have to carry all of it with me for the rest of my life and could not/would not do that. It would cause ME too much pain.<P>I finally learned that she didn't want to come home to someone who moped around and felt sad...so when we were together I tried to be upbeat and when we were apart I tried my best to work on myself...<P>When we were together I tried not to push her but to let her get to where she needed to be on her own. This is very important. You must be patient. Don't push, don't demand. I know this was very important to my W. I hear some of the same things you are sayng about your H.<P>I think it sounds like you are doing good and making progress, but progress is two steps forward and one step back. It is slow, but I think it is better that way. <P>Keep in touch with your H but don't push him. Be patient and be strong and have faith.<P>All of that is hard but then no one said any of this would be easy.<P>Best of luck <P>E<BR> <P><BR>