At this point in time, my W is wanting a seperation/divorse. I dont know what to do. I know i am the root of most of the problems in our relatioship. I now realise that I was in the fog for so many years. I cant convince her to try and work on our problems, she said, she tried for year to do that with me and I didnt listen... and now i dont know if it's too late<P>------------------<BR>

Ump,<P>You done good!!!! You have your own thread. Now if you could please give a little background. My brief search could not find your whole story. <P>You mentioned a previous A a long time ago. The reason I ask for this info, is that it is helpful for us to know how to support you. <P>Have you ever been introduced to the basic concepts or given a welcome package here? <P>Don't worry, support is on it's way...... <P>L.<BR>

Orchid <BR>Yes, I had an A over 15 yrs ago, and she has never gotten past that and then in the past year got involved on the internet.<P>No I havent been introduced to the basic concepts or given a welcome package here? <BR><P>------------------<BR>

Orchid,<P>And now she doesnt want to work on anything, all she keeps saying is she wants a seperation/divorse.<BR><P>------------------<BR>

First of all, it's never too late. You just have to start on it, now. I noticed from your earlier replies that you resisted her attempts to get you to work on things.<P>You've said that communication is the problem. You've also already found one means of reopening communication -- EMAIL. Try conversing with her that way. The nice thing is that it's hard to reject email.<P>Do you have your own counselor yet? (that might show her that you're serious)<P>It's going to take a long, steady effort to convince her you're serious about changing. It sounds like she's angry (almost like reaction to an affair) so you're going to SHOW her that you want to work on things, even if she's says it's too late.<P>Probably right now, you don't want to be discussing your relationship (if it's going to lead to the "too late" statement). Make your conversation about other things. <P>My W said I was smothering her with too much affection and attention (after I noticed her online activities). So, there is a downside to changing too much, all at once. But, she did notice and she did like it.<P>Jeffers<P> <BR>

Jeffers,<P>Yes i do have a C, but she feels the only reason i have one is because she had said, she wanted the seperation/divorce.<P>------------------<BR>

Ump,<P>Ok making progress here, is there a current A going on and if yes, by who? <P>Here is the welcome package it is filled with information regarding, questionnaires that help identify our emotional needs for both spouses, books such as his needs/her needs, suriving an affair, givers/takers, phone counseling sessions with the Harley's (Steve or Jennifer). They are a brother and sister team and their father is the author of the books. They are the administrators of the marriage builders website.<P> <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000553.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000553.html</A> <P><BR>This is the acronyms for all those funny letters and symbols use see in our posts like: : eek : = <BR> <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000557.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000557.html</A> <P>This will require a bit of time to read. You will find it useful. If your W sounds like she wants to give up. Read here and if you can direct her here. There are many of us both men and women on both sides of the proverbial fence. Bs (betrayed spouse) and WS (wayward spouse) and some with experience on both sides. This collection of people pretty much here for the same reasons (learn and understand about themselves, their mate and their marriage) learn a lot from each other. Learning and proper application of the basic concepts here (plan a and plan b) is important in understanding some of the responses. <P>15 years, that is a long time. You and your W have history together, not something easily thrown away. Learn to work with the tools here. Don't throw in the towel yet. <P>Post as much of your story as you can, be a bit patient (there are a lot of new ones here) and don't worry, support will come........ <P>L. <BR>

She said, I have 15 yrs to work on the problems and i refused or buried my head in the sand. And now she said, it's too late to start now.

She said, I have 15 yrs to work on the problems and i refused or buried my head in the sand. And now she said, it's too late to start now.<P>------------------<BR>

Mrs. Ump, <P>If your H ever shares this with you, please come here and share your side with us. There are several couples that post here not all pleasant but progressive. <P>Many wives put up with a lot for a long time. If you ask that question here you may find that 15 years is about mid way some have been dealing with problems a lot longer and still are trying hard to be optimistic. You know what? Some of that patience is paying off. <P>In fact if some of us could have our spouses indicate that effort now, we would be estatic. Jeffers, myself and others that have responded to your H would love for our spouses to show more intiative. Yet we keep applying the principles we have learned here and other places in our lives and hope our spouses come around. <P>Your situation is not hopeless but it can be helped here and if you both put effort into it you may enjoy the recovery that some show here. There is even a recovery site where some of the posts are in good recovery and others are in various (sometimes painful stages of recovery but recovery nonetheless).<P>Take care and hope to see you here. <BR>L. <BR>

Of course she's going to say that and maybe she's even right. Sometimes it takes a slap to the head to motivate people. My W could have made the same statement -- because I WAS reacting to what she was doing. <P>I should have been proactive and fixed things earlier, but I didn't. Didn't think I needed to do anything ... didn't know how ... was unhappy myself ... blamed her. Sound familiar? <P>We have been in recovery for about 2.5 months. D-day was 5 months ago. That is lightning fast by MB standards. She hadn't travelled too far down the internet romance road.<P>The important thing about counselors is that they can help you communicate. She doesn't want you to see her counselor, but that doesn't prevent your counselor from seeing you both together. <P>Jeffers<P><BR>

Orchid,<P>NO current A going on, just alot of chatting on the internet. I have read the survey's and filled them in, but cant get my W to even look at then and even talk about it.<BR><P>------------------<BR>

Jeffers,<BR>We were both seeing the counselor, and I couldnt get several appointments and then she decided the hell with me and continued to see the counselor without me.<P>------------------<BR>

Ump,<P>Yes, that's how she ended up with "her" counselor. I got the impression that was before you were interested in working on things and now she doesn't want you going to her counselor. So, you're sort of starting fresh here.<P>If she won't do the surveys, then you should do them from her point of view as best you can. The whole point is to identify her needs so you can start meeting them. It may even come down to trial and error on your part.<P>Just realize, there is no quick fix.<P>Jeffers

Well Ump,<P>That is how my H's EA/PA got started. I worked long long hours, then did double duty at home. H allowed even encouraged me to enable him.... hm..... so I did for years and years. He got comfortable and even though I was struggling he thought I did not love him anymore and went out. Not once but several times in the course of 2 years. The final one was the killer. EA/PA. This internet stuff is dangerous. Very very dangerous. It becomes a consuming thing on one's life. Everything and everyone else goes by the wayside. Don't underestimate the power of chat rooms or even so called personal adds. <P>OW started out by saying she needed a friend to talk with. Talk turned sexual in less than 1 month and the EA went PA shortly after that. The pain I personally have been subjected to were bad enough for me. I would not wish it on my worst enemy but that is who did it to me. My worst enemy, someone I have never met but my H slept with..... I can tell you stories and so can many others. <P>The point is Ump, if your M is important to you, tell your W. Acknowledge your downfalls, ask her to work with you. She may not want to and her reasons may be valid. You both need to rebuild trust in each other. <P>Are there children involved? Can you two get away and spend quality time together? Court each other? This A 15 years ago, is it new info for her? If not, why is it surfacing now? Sorry for the questions, trying to see how to help.<P>Too much giver in me....(LOL!!!!). I will back off for now..<P>L. <BR>

Orchid,<P>Yes, it was very consuming thing on my life. I dont understand it either. <P>Yes, there are two small boys 11 & 8. I dont want them to suffer or be involved like I was when growing up. I would love to get away and spend quality time together, but dont think that will happen right now. The A isnt new to her, the problem is i didnt communicate many if any details about the A at the time except that it happened, she is still wanting answers as to why and i'm not sure how or why it happened.<P>Another problem is that i'm always sad, dont know why. I'm dealing with that in counseling.<P>------------------<BR>

Orchid,<P>Yes, it was very consuming thing on my life. I dont understand it either. <P>Yes, there are two small boys 11 & 8. I dont want them to suffer or be involved like I was when growing up. I would love to get away and spend quality time together, but dont think that will happen right now. The A isnt new to her, the problem is i didnt communicate many if any details about the A at the time except that it happened, she is still wanting answers as to why and i'm not sure how or why it happened.<P>Another problem is that i'm always sad, dont know why. I'm dealing with that in counseling.<P>------------------<BR>

Orchid,<P>Yes, it was very consuming thing on my life. I dont understand it either. <P>Yes, there are two small boys 11 & 8. I dont want them to suffer or be involved like I was when growing up. I would love to get away and spend quality time together, but dont think that will happen right now. The A isnt new to her, the problem is i didnt communicate many if any details about the A at the time except that it happened, she is still wanting answers as to why and i'm not sure how or why it happened.<P>Another problem is that i'm always sad, dont know why. I'm dealing with that in counseling.<P>------------------<BR>

Orchid,<P>Yes, it was very consuming thing on my life. I dont understand it either. <P>Yes, there are two small boys 11 & 8. I dont want them to suffer or be involved like I was when growing up. I would love to get away and spend quality time together, but dont think that will happen right now. The A isnt new to her, the problem is i didnt communicate many if any details about the A at the time except that it happened, she is still wanting answers as to why and i'm not sure how or why it happened.<P>Another problem is that i'm always sad, dont know why. I'm dealing with that in counseling.<P>------------------<BR>

Orchid,<P>Yes, it was very consuming thing on my life. I dont understand it either. <P>Yes, there are two small boys 11 & 8. I dont want them to suffer or be involved like I was when growing up. I would love to get away and spend quality time together, but dont think that will happen right now. The A isnt new to her, the problem is i didnt communicate many if any details about the A at the time except that it happened, she is still wanting answers as to why and i'm not sure how or why it happened.<P>Another problem is that i'm always sad, dont know why. I'm dealing with that in counseling.<P>------------------<BR>