H comes over, complains about the dishwasher not being emptied, complains about the mess in the toy room and then continues to mumble about how much he doesn't miss my bad "habits". I work FULL time with a 3-hour commute time daily. I have a two-year old D that I am trying to keep HAPPY every night when her father may not be around. I'm exhausted EVERY night. I just blew up and said, "I'm alone and can only do so much. You know our D goes to bed at 9:30 leaving me very little time to do the laundry, iron, clean up the kitchen, the toy room and GET my D's things ready for the next morning. (Forgot to mention that he blew his stack in the morning when I hadn't left her hairbrush and hair ties out for him to easily find.) Is this all expected behaviour of a WS? He's certainly not REPENTANT!!!<P>I was so upset that I broke down and just asked him how he could kiss anyone else and feel good? He had always told me that he loved my lips...well, don't have to tell you that he wasn't happy to hear about any of this. <P>Oh well...

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Terrified:<BR><STRONG> Is this all expected behaviour of a WS? He's certainly not REPENTANT!!!<P>Oh well...</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Absolutely nothing out of the ordinary. There was a 2 week time span when H was sort of here (some night and not others) before he officially took his trash bag of clothes and "moved out". He was grasping at straws to find things to fault me for. One morning he started screaming because he got a single dog hair on his suit. Another morning he found a window that was open a tiny crack when the heat was on and flew into a rage about me wasting heat. It's all about desperately trying to make himself feel justified in his terrible actions. Much later (as the fog started to clear) he apologized for acting like a nutcase and said he knew it was abnormal behavior, even though he never would have admitted it at the time.

Tell him that right now he's not living there, so he's only responsible for how HIS apartment looks. You don't owe him any explanation for how things are going at your house. Hugs to you. Keep up your strength and remember it's HIS problem, not yours. Just be the best you that you can be. Someday he'll (hopefully) realize what an AS*hole he's being, and if he doesn't, you're better off with him at the apartment.

Hi FD & MOM, Good to hear from both of you. FD, Did he decide to take all of his clothes and finally move out completely or did you push it? Right now, my H is here sometimes and sleeps at his apt the remainder of the time. Most of his clothes and belongings are still with me and he hasn't made any attempt to change that right now. <P>MOM, He's definitely being an A**hole right now. It's just that I miss the old nice guy and it's hard to stand up to him.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Terrified:<BR><STRONG>Hi FD & MOM, Good to hear from both of you. FD, Did he decide to take all of his clothes and finally move out completely or did you push it? <BR></STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Mine never did take anythingn but clothes, and the majority of his clothes remained here. He'd take a bagful, then usually bring them back here to wash them. ( times out of 10 my little Plan A self insisted on washing them for him. Then I'd put them back away in his drawers and his closet. So he really never had more than a week's worth of clothes with him at any given time, and none of his othr stuff. I wanted THIS to feel like home for him, not some bimbo's grungy apartment (or the non existent apartment he claimed to be living in all alone).

Hi FD, I was going to ask about laundry since the only friend of mine that knows recommended that I do not do any of his laundry so that he can really know what being alone is all about but you say, Plan A is doing laundry so I don't feel so bad! (I have been doing some (whatever is thrown in there when he's around).<P>Oh well...

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Terrified:<BR><STRONG>Hi FD, I was going to ask about laundry since the only friend of mine that knows recommended that I do not do any of his laundry so that he can really know what being alone is all about but you say, Plan A is doing laundry so I don't feel so bad! (I have been doing some (whatever is thrown in there when he's around).<P>Oh well...</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I don't know if doing his laundry was "proper" Plan A or not. Probably not. But I wanted to do it, and like I said, once it was done his clothes went back in the drawers and closet, not in his trash bag to take away. So every time he wanted more clothes he had to go into thse drawers and pack up again. But there were plenty of other things that weren't being done for him that he definitely missed. Evidently OW didn't cook, and I am an excellent cook. He definitely missed that! Living on Taco Bell started to wear thin pretty fast lol. So it's up to you whether you want to do it or not. He always argued for me not to do it (he felt guilty) but I always insisted. He did always thank me. If he'd expected me to do it I wouldn't have touched it.

Hi FD, Since NO ONE knows about our separation, I assume that's why he hasn't taken ALL his clothes. We had once agreed to tell his parents after their 40th anniversary on the 28th of October but he's hesitating about even that date now...he's accusing me of pushing...

Terrified, is he ashamed that the marriage has a "kink" in it? What are the reasons for his hesitation to speak the truth regarding his marital woes? Why the hell can't he talk the walk? Are you comfortable with enabling him and his uncertainties? His fear of being open about the "separation" tends to smell like guilt and more guilt.

Hi GL, Thanks for responding. Is guilt a good thing? Sometimes I think it's his fear. He can talk a great story about telling everyone but when it comes down to it, he's scared, I think?<P>If he was so sure, would he be hesitating?

Hi T,<P>Ok another comment. Me? I stopped doing H's laundry. He moved out and said he could do it all himself. I agreed. I hurt and wondered a lot but hey, I was busy. <P>When we finally went to help H move back (1 of the 3 times), my son did not want to step foot into his room because it was so cluttered (not dirty) just cluttered with his stuff (paperwork, clothes, etc). Our son said, 'mom doesn't let our house look like this.' Big blow for the man on his own. <P>Hm.... now mind you, H is still one who clutters, but likes his drawers neat. Go figure. I am trying to stay about his mess. The house was much easier to take care of when H was NOT at home. <P>However, now that he had his outing, he is definitely more appreciative and is learning to put his things away. Just need to work on the consistency. <P>Boy this is hard!!! :rollingeyes:<P>L.

Hi O, Good to hear from you. You sound better...hope my instincts are right.<P>How long was your H out the first time? God, what an ordeal "once" is...imagine three times!!! God bless you girl!<P>H has not brought his laundry home which is a good thing, I guess. It's kind of sad too. It's hard to think of that one positively. Although MOST of his clothes are home, his daily suits AREN't. How do you get past that feeling of losing the day to day despite his negative comments?

Hi T,<P>In response to your first question, I am doing better. I have a massive sinus headache today and a bunch of other little aches and pains. Other than that, ok. Thanks for asking!!! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]<P>As for the negative remarks, that's hard. Since I listened to every word, phrase, conversation, body movement,etc. Pratically had most of it memorized. H is amazed how I retained so much of the conversations. Hm..... <P>Anyway, I recorded H's rude messages. Kept them for posterity sake. Informed him of that later when he was having a sane moment and feeling bad that he hurt me. <P>You see, at first they don't want to hurt the OW. That is hard for the BS to understand but then you gotta realize that they have a relationship with the OW and we don't. Knowing that made me understand and I would even say, I know you don't want to (yuck) hurt her and so why are you continuing to hurt me? Oops, I let that slip. He was so focused on her that I had to gently remind him that he was hurting me. He needed to be shown that a hurt OW would recover even better than a hurt BS/W/Mother. Hm...... wow what a revelation to the WS. Eventually they see an admit it, just a bit hard for them. OW may present herself as a delicate wall flower when really she is one hormonorly raging bull (cow?!??). In my case that is what she turned out to be. <P>Gotta take it slow. The fact that this is more of an EA in your WSs case, makes it harder. They fantasize more in the EA stage. <P>Why? Because once it is PA, what else PA wise is there to hide? Kinda burst the bubble. But the EA builds anticipation to no end. Fantasy is all they think about. No one could possibly be better until they PA and see that the OW has wrinkles, fat rolls, gray hair, etc. <P>Gotta go, but I think you get the picture. <P>L.

My H has gotten mysteriously concerned over the 'mess' in the house...this from a man who could walk over and through stuff before this???<P>My MIL said that it is the mess in his head and mind and heart that he wants to clean up but he projects it onto the mess in the house...which is 'easier' to blame on the kids or me...<P>She's a pearl, my MIL.<P>Cali

<B>Gotta take it slow. The fact that this is more of an EA in your WSs case, makes it harder. They fantasize more in the EA stage. </B><BR><B>Why? Because once it is PA, what else PA wise is there to hide? Kinda burst the bubble. But the EA builds anticipation to no end. Fantasy is all they think about. No one could possibly be better until they PA and see that the OW has wrinkles, fat rolls, gray hair, etc. </B><P>Wow, Orchid, cool insight. <BR>My WH had an EA that, although there was making out in the OW's minivan (yes, I'm sorry - I think it's hysterical and can't stop mentioning it), never made it to a PA (they had an "attempt" less than a week before I found out, but chickened out when it came to "where to go/meet" - it was the unopened condoms from this aborted attempt that I found on d-day!!)<BR>Anyways, at first, he had a rough time getting over it...in fact we had a second d-day 2 weeks later, that almost ended our nine-year marriage. THANKFULLY, OW began to show her true colors, and, surprise, surprise, they didn't mesh with the fantasy he had of her...hehehe...a serious mistake. I was still kind of wondering about his thoughts on her - if he still considered himself attracted to her...so, I asked him. Right now he feels so pissed off at her he doesn't seem to have any other thoughts....hope it stays that way! <BR>Anyways....I'm guessing if your spouse needs a fantasy life, you should be there to provide it! I've become a shopper at goodvibes.com and I'm surprising the hell out of my WH and MYSELF - and having fun!!<BR>LLL [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img]