Hi all,<p>Recently WW (who’s still living at home) mentioned that she might want to move to the city she works in (about 50 miles away) because the “commute is getting to her” – she’d stay there during the week and come “home” on the weekends to be with me.<p>This is just getting to be too much for me. I’ve crafted a response to her and wanted to run it by everyone for feedback. I don’t want to LB, but at this point, I find it hard to give a S***. And I'm loving listening to Dobson [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] . It’s actually been an interesting past few days – if I get time I’ll post an update.<p>
Dear (W),<p>Hi! Again I’ll keep it short. I’d like to respond to your idea about moving to ---. Although you initially classified it as a convenience thing because of the commute, (W), what I found more interesting was the fact that you did admit also it was to see your friends more. Since (OM) is among your friends currently (?! Got to assume), I have to wonder about that. Indeed, it’s well within your right to do so – I’ve never “stopped you” from much of anything to be truthful. But the message I get out of this request personally is “I have little interest in being with you or making an effort” – so if you want to move, but all means, but maybe in that case it should be full and permanent. I don’t say that because I don’t care about you, but because it does cross my boundaries of acceptability. I don’t want that to sound bitter, negative or hurtful – it’s just my boundaries.<p>Of course, another option would be for me to look for a job in ---, allowing us both to have a better commute, share more friends, etc. Well, the later looks out regardless, but the former could be possible. Of course, it would require “us” to be in a different place than we are currently. But it’s possible – I’m a flexible guy – anything’s possible for me, for us.<p>Anyhow, this probably isn’t what you wanted to hear – sorry – try not to think I’m the devil for it, okay?

Eh. It kind of sounded like you were trying to pick a fight to me.<p>I don't have time to write now - will try again later.<p>Make sure and use I statements, tell her how it makes you feel. Say you are flexible and willing to think of alternatives such as moving with her.<p>Don't mention OM, it is accusing.<p>HbH

I agree. I think it sounds a little confrontational. Some good points but you might want to try and rephrase some things. Good luck!

Thanks, yes, it is a bit confrontational - some by design, some likely because I was seething as I wrote it.<p>Anyhow, I DO want to convey a strong message - stronger than I have been. I think she respects strength, and as a Plan A doormat, she hasn't been seeing that enough. That's where a more Dobson-esque approach came to mind - looking at an example from him - boy, this seems tame! But I agree, some of it can be rephrased without losing the forcefulness. The main points are: I have boundaries, this crosses my boundaries, there are other options I'd love to discuss.<p>As an interesting side note. Last night I was looking at some of my letters (Plan B actually!), shut the computer down and let out a sigh (unconscious). Well, when I got into bed, I was peppered with questions about "why the sigh?" My goodness she was distraught - many accusations and assumptions - I let her know "it's nothing to worry about" etc. - but she even said "Do you want me to come home tomorrow? If you do, you better tell me!" (do I hear a fog horn?). I was able to skirt this without major LB, but still keeping things to myself.<p>So it appears that it bugs her to no end to think that I have some cards that she can't see now. Up to now we've been playing cards with all my cards face-up on the table. This was an analogy in "Love Must Be Tough" - I just didn't think I'd find a way to get there so easily!

Almost sounds like you are trying to manipulate her by using Dobson's stuff...<p>As long as you take a nice hard look and make sure that's not what you're doing, guess it's all right.<p>You are right to focus on those main points, the stuff about OM can go altogether.<p>And I wouldn't give her the note until you are done "seething", in a relatively good mood towards each other, and she is really serious about moving out (not just talking - looking for apartments, etc.).<p>Don't play games, overanalyze, or try to be the first one to make a move.<p>HbH

HbH,<p>>>> Almost sounds like you are trying to manipulate her by using Dobson's stuff... <<<<p>Not explicitly, but some of what's happened on its own would seem to be consistent with it. I've seen plenty of debates here - whether Dobson's stuff is actually consistent with MB - and I have to say, there is some value from what I can see - where it intersects. I suppose one could debate whether Plan A / B is really a manipulation after all too. (There isn't supposed to be an end-goal in saving the marriage - it's about the self - but hey, who are we kidding - reading between the lines it's on a lot of people's minds.)<p>>>> You are right to focus on those main points, the stuff about OM can go altogether. <<<<p>Agreed.<p>>>> And I wouldn't give her the note until you are done "seething", in a relatively good mood towards each other, and she is really serious about moving out (not just talking - looking for apartments, etc.). <<<<p>She will be asking again, probably today. I may just stall and let her talk to our counselor about it tomorrow - hopefully she'll cool her heels a bit - usually tries to anyway.<p>>>> Don't play games, overanalyze, or try to be the first one to make a move. <<<<p>Games, no, but there are some clear themes that I can see and am beginning to believe I can address through approaches that might seem like manipulation, but are really just "directed offensives". Okay, sounds like a game. But as I said, patterns are evolving. I rarely take the first move in this mess. Our counselor has helped a lot, but we took a week off, and now it seems outwardly like all hell's broken loose. Of course, that may be just my interpretation.<p>Oh well, another day, another ulcer [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

J.R.<p> I thought your letter was OK depending on what your intent really is. I think before I would give her anything in writing, I might talk to her about the move in such a way that the EMA had nothing to do with it. Just to see what the reaction is. <p>Something like&#8230; <p>I know it's a long haul and I should have been more sensitive to the stress that causes you. I'm sorry. I'll take the burden of the long commute for a while. Now that I've had a little time to think about it, I think we could have a lot of fun together with a place in the city. I've wanted to be able to hang out with you and your friends. Can I go look for a place with you?<p>*****<p>This is Plan A all the way. You're being supportive and compassionate to her needs. It also will let you know what her real intentions are. If it is solely the commute.. then you&#8217;re a great guy and you'll have to work out the details. If the commute is just a seemingly convenient cover story&#8230; Then you'll likely see the deer in the headlights look or the start of a discussion on why you shouldn't be there with her.<p>Good luck,
HI

HI,<p>I love it... I'll give it a try, then let our counselor hammer her on it tomorrow too, if she even dares bring it up with her. (I sent the counselor an e-mail about it, so she at least knows.)

How can y'all be saying this is too confrontational after JR's W, by his sig, has done all THAT to him? My god, and she's all
"Do you want me to come home tomorrow?" What a manipulative b****(sorry JR, but it kinda hits home sometimes)<p>I went through all that kind of crap years ago
with girlfriends. I'd have been so gone by now, JR. I'd have left and never looked back. <p>Considering what she's done, I think that is a very staid letter.