Hi guys,<p>Well, we had a very drama filled week last week. Found out my WH is going on a ski trip with group from work that will include OW, see my post "Plan A failure" for details. Then had a drunken conversation Sat night. Never good. Well today is his IC appt, and he ALWAYS wants to talk afterwords.<p>I am trying very hard to accept that he is going on this trip despite my feelings. He has tried to re-assure me by telling me he is sharing a room w/another guy from the office, same thing when in Denver for sales meeting. But I am extremely nervous over all of this. I swear I am getting an ulcer. BTW, he assures me that the A is over, "for the sake of his job".<p>So he will want to talk tonight, how do I keep my cool. I have said everything I have to say about the trip. I do not want to LB anymore than I already have, but it is so hard when my emotions are so raw. <p>And you know, I may try to trust him, but I do not trust her at all. She is going thru a D and I am sure she wants to get her claws back into my H. I even asked my H if he had thought at all about the bad position he has put himself in. There will be drinking, she is emotional, she could easily say or do something that someone else will pick up on and then rumors will just start to fly. Such a bad decision on his part.<p>Part of me actually hopes she does something really stupid so that he can wake up a little and see what kind of person she really is. But, I really don't want him to lose his job, not like this. Financial support is definatly one of my needs right now.<p>Ugh, all of this has just made me ill. Physically ill, just like after D-Day. I have never been a person to keep my thoughts and emotions to myself. That's probably why Plan A is so hard for me. I just feel like I see things so clearly and how can he not get it. Then I feel like I just need to explain it to him better. I keep trying to force him to see things the way I do, and I feel like it is so important that he understands that I just keep talking and get more and more emotional. Not providing a very safe loving environment for him am I.<p>Anyway, any words of wisdom would really help me tonight. I know what I need to do, but am having alot of trouble doing it.

Hi Needing. Wow, you sound alot like me at the end of the last post. Did you get to see my post on Saturday about the letter from OW and how I nearly freaked out?<p>My MB friends here really did a good job at calming me down, but most of all, making me realize WHY and HOW I was not going to LB that night. It seemed inevitable.<p>First off, if you feel like you cannot avoid an LB, then don't talk. Simply tell him that you are too emotional right now, you don't want to start a fight, and you'd like a time-out for a while.<p>You absolutely should NOT trust him about this trip. Yes, you have to accept that he is going, try to keep busy and not LB or harass him about it while he is away (good luck, hun), but you do not have to trust him or her for that matter, nor should you.<p>If you feel as though you can talk without LBing, then make sure and use "I statements". Make it a point not to try and educate him. If he says "nothing will happen, don't worry", say "I understand what you are saying. I feel as though I cannot trust you or OW at this point." "I am hurt that you have made this decision." Do not say "but, what if, and you know she is going to try something, etc." <p>You can't educate him. You've said your peace, re-stating what you have already told him won't do you any good and will only be an LB.<p>I do highly suggest that you work in there somehow "I accept your decision even though I do not agree with it. Are you willing to do some things to help assure me that you are not with her during this time?"<p>If he won't do anything in this respect, needing, I think it's time for you to accept that he will BE with her on this trip and figure out what this means for you. Do not LB to him about it, but you do need to make some choices about how to deal with the inevitable.<p>I am sorry you are going through this. Try to be strong. You are in control of your emotions and what you say/do, remember that. <p>Hugz,
HbH

Oh HbH, Thank you. You really have been a huge help to me latley. And yes, I read your thread and was very proud of the way you handled to situation.<p>Your words make sense, and I really do want to try and behave this way. I am just praying for the courage to do so. I am not sure yet how I am going to handle this trip. I don't know how I will look at him when he comes home. I'm sure alot of that has to do with communication while he is gone.<p>I know what I need to do tonight, but I really just wanna bash his face in for being so thoughtless and cruel. Even if it is unintentional, this trip is cruel to me.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>
I just feel like I see things so clearly and how can he not get it. Then I feel like I just need to explain it to him better. I keep trying to force him to see things the way I do, and I feel like it is so important that he understands that I just keep talking and get more and more emotional. <hr></blockquote><p>Oh my...this could be me...or was me...REALLY...<p>I had to stop...once I stopped...BIG changes occurred between us...he will see this as controlling...<p>...so what do you do? The best book I have read so far to give me help in 'changing the way I say or do things' is Susan Page's How One of You Can Keep The Two of You Together . I will have to also say that reading don Miguel Ruiz's books, The Four Agreements and The Mastery of Love gave me the WHY...Page's book is the HOW....<p>Further...you have to focus on YOU...not on H. Your H is gonna do what he's gonna do. The only person you can control and educate IS YOU. What your H does is about him and what you do is about you. That is Lesson One.<p>Lesson Two is finding the strength. I found it in my Belief and Faith. (Secrets of the Vine was a big help on this one.)...This is such a hard thing, but as HurtbyHubby said...it can be done and we are here to support you...<p>[ December 03, 2001: Message edited by: TryingAgain ]</p>

Hi Trying,<p>First off, thanks for your reply. <p>I have noticed you mention these books alot, I am going to definatly have to check them out.<p>Everything you say makes sense to my head. I just can't get my heart to stop doing the talking. I know it's counter productive, I know it seems like I am just beating him over the head with the same stuff all the time.<p>I read something in a post fron lostva yesterday that I am trying to take up as a mantra at this point, when we start to get into a "conversation" I will just say, I love you and want you to be happy. <p>When he asks me why I am still here and want our marriage to work, I will just say that I have already answered all of these questions the best I can. It boils down to the fact that I love him. <p>Every morning now I start my day with 3 questions. Do I Love my husband...yes. Do I want my M back, not the way it was, but better. Am I willing to do the work...YES.<p>All of this is of course so much easier said than done. I seem to always let myself get sucked into these talks and end up feeling like I JUST HAVE TO MAKE HIM UNDERSTAND.<p>Anyway, thanks again for the input, everything and anything is helpfull right now.

needing,
Why can't you go on the ski trip? <p>Not invited--if so ask if you can go. Is there no one from his work taking a "date"?<p>Or is it that can't manage it...work, other obligatons? If it is this one...GO if at all possible.<p>If he still goes without you...your marriage can survive that--no matter what happens--but his insensitivity is one more thing to forgive.

Hi needing, <p>It just amazes me how much similarity there is in the stories you read about WS's on this site. My WW was the same way. No matter how much I tried to tell her how clear the cause to our marital problems were she "just can't get past the negative issues" or "isn't sure why she doesn't want to work on the marriage" etc. etc. etc.<p>Plan A is definitive in it's purpose but extremely difficult to stick to, especially when your emotions are being stomped all over. I too had several instances where I lost control and LB'd but for the most part I have really made a lot of progress with myself within Plan A. This is something that you have to focus on.<p>It is possible to tell your H that this ski trip makes you extremely anxious and you are very concerned about him going. Just do it in a respectful manner. If he is still seeing OW on a daily basis as you say then he probably will maintain the position that he will be with a male coworker etc. I hate to say this, but there really is nothing more you can do. While they are in the FOG, reality, logic and memory of the past are all but completely gone. The "FOG" is the only way they can justify their actions. <p>Ask your husband to help ease your mind, somehow. I found my WW would sometimes do things to assure me she was not seeing OP. It's when these things stop you should start being very suspicious. Keep posting and reading and working on yourself.<p>I wish you the best of luck.

Stop focusing on the trip. Focus on tonight and what you are going to do to make sure you don't LB.<p>The trip is in the future. Worry about it when it comes.<p>TA also had some good advice. It is tough to learn these things, especially when it is right in front of our H's faces and they are blind.<p>Get a punching bag (or pillow) and pretend it's your H's face, at least something will get the pummeling he deserves.<p>Your H is being mean and selfish. But YOU will survive and get through this. You are a strong woman and we will be here for you while he is away.<p>HbH

Lor,<p>No I can't go. It is just an overnight before a sales meeting in Denver and no spouses or significants are going. (Well except for the fact that the XOW is an unknown significant, esp to ME)<p>I keep trying to tell myself I can survive this, that our M can survive.(With the help of God and Pepcid.)<p>Not to mention the fact that my H is doing everything in his power to keep the OW and I as far apart as possible.

Needing,
I'm really not trying to frustrate you, but though money or obligations is a reason, <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>No I can't go. It is just an overnight before a sales meeting in Denver and no spouses or significants are going<hr></blockquote>
is no reason at all. <p>So what if they aren't? Can you?<p>Buy your own plane ticket or drive your own car (if it is car, even less of a problem, you & he can go together), share his room--or pay for one.<p>If your H would do this, wouldn't it be a big dump into your lovebank?<p>I can say this because my H did it in Aug., he's military--and though they have gotten better the last decade, they used to say if they wanted a soldier to have a family, they'd be issued one. He had a 4 day conference in Washington DC, one rep from each state. Our daughters & I flew separately stayed in his room, we goofed off during the day and touristed with him at night. He also procured an invitation for me to attend the opening mixer--I was the only spouse in a room of 70 military/federal employees--my H could have easily said "no spouses" but he went an extra mile to make it happen.<p>My H's actions were "How can we make this happen" not "you can't go".<p>And...generally if the WS is trying to keep the OW & spouse apart, it is not to protect the spouse, it is to keep their house of cards/deception from falling. It is what my H always did, until he finally had his change of heart. I spent yesterday at a work Xmas party where the OW was. And I didn't set her on fire or anything [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] , but I was clearly HIS WIFE.<p>And...I don't want you to nag your H. It's just that sometimes there is something other than he's-going-I-hate-it and he's-not-going-but-says-I'm-controlling.<p>Try to think outside the box--even if your H quashes this idea--what if it just hadn't occured to him, and he likes it? If he says no, you've got a little more info than you did before and are no worse off when he goes.

Lor,<p>I will ask him, but I already know he will say no way.<p>His reason for keeping us apart is that it would be way to uncomfortable for him. I am not alowed to stop by his office or attend any functions she might be at. He says its not that he thinks I would do something, just that he could would be to uncomfortable. And he really does not care about my lovebank right now.<p>I could not go for the full trip because of my work obligations anyway.

Needing,
It would likely be uncomfortable for him. My H was horribly uncomfortable last year at the first Xmas party he invited me to in about 3 years. This year he was better. My stomach is still upset from yesterday--sheer acid pouring in for 2 hours. <p>Even if you can't actually go, I think a cheerful "hey how about this" is worth a try. You're prepared for the good god no. I probably became very devious at some point and just liked to see my H's expression when I proposed "good ideas" that were going to interfere with his plans. Like I said, an expression is also a bit of information.<p>And if he says "I told you OW would be there", slap you forehead "Oh I was so excited by the idea I forgot about that for a second".<p>I know...devious. Probably a bad day for me to try to give advice having had the OW in my line of sight at yesterday's dinner. [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Anyway, just an idea. Maybe for future use.