Okay...I have told my WS that i am now going to practise radical honesty with her in our marriage. She has still not given up the OM, even though things have gotten very good between us again...which she will admit. I have been in Plan "A" since D-Day (21 weeks ago) and we are better than we have been in our entire marriage. <p>My question is this...i can't take the OM still being in this picture and have setup an appointment with an attorney on Wednesday to explore what my options are. Should i disclose this to her...THAT'S radical honesty....but doesn't it kinda blow my cover of that or should it be covered up ??? <p>What has anyone else done in this regard ? I can see pros and cons about telling or not telling.

This comes up periodically, radical honesty...except, _______ (fill in the blank)....this is akin to a little bit pregnant, or maybe we aren't lovers, we are just friends. YES, it is a LIE, a lie of ommission, and no different than any other lie. Your being the BS is irrelevant. You say you are committed to the marriage, but now you judge your w behaviour as maybe unacceptable (so maybe it is)....and seek to do something secretive behind her back......sound familiar SD?<p>Do not go down that slippery slope, and remember temptation comes in many guises. Set her down, tell her your HONEST feelings, as radical honesty requires, and what you are contemplating as some of your options, and ask for her input. OTHERWISE you have proven your recovery is not only a lie form her actions, but now yours, and incidently proved her right, you are only in it for your benefit (what all we ws think for the most part). Ya know SD all the tough stuff in life is easy when it is easy, radical honesty is really great when it works to your benefit, but kinda sucks when it puts you at risk....ya know? And what do you think seperates the men from the boys?<p>Tactically? Yep, might be a disaster tipping your hand, that is the risk you take when you subscribe to principles. So are you more concerned with "protecting" yourself, or knowing that no matter who is your partner in life they can trust your honesty? You are at a moment of truth SD, where you will find out what you are made of. Good luck.

Thanks for the Reply S_N_L !! <p>I fully intended to tell her tonight, I scheduled the appt. last week, but didn't want to ruin our weekend (her families Christmas party). I know which side of the men/boys fence i am on now however. I disclose everything to her...no MATTER who it benefits and/or sometimes hurts. I am honest with her...although she isn't always with me...she is trying to do better i believe. <p>
I was more curious how anyone else handled this...because i know it is a big step. I hope my WS sees this for what it is...MY CHOICE not to put up with WS in our lives anymore. Things are really great between us, but he can't be a friend and she can't talk to him and keep me. I won't hound her to do no-contact....it's her choice to keep contact....my choice to do something else. She can only have her cake and eat it too for so long !! <p>It's unfortunate, but in the end...the equation is pretty simple. <p>Will i feel terrible about destroying my 3 boys lives...YES.
Will it be my fault.. NO.
Will it make me feel any better about it.... NO Is it what i "wanted" to do... NO <p>THANKS SNL !!

I should probably clarify something re radical honesty. IMO this applies to a marital type relationship. I do not think it applies to anything else so absolutely. I think honesty and ethics involve a whole lot of other potential issues too, where the guiding principle is more about not taking unfair advantage of someone. Clearly business people do not disclose all to customers, or vendors, etc, is not how economic activity works. But you don't misrepresent yourself or your goods either. <p>Likewise in our social interactions, we may have to work with, or be neighbors with someone we do not approve of, we are under no obligation to reveal that, or actions we might take re such people. But neither should we act in a way that is "unfair". Marital type relationships the principle is pure, you tell all, without fear for repercussions on you or spouse. What you do do, is try to tell difficult stuff in a compassionate manner. Even with immediate or extended family you do not have to tell all, (but you should be careful, family secrets are not usually good things). Uncle Fester who you only see a couple times a year, does not need to be told you really don't approve of whatever...ya know. Even your mom does not necessarily need to know you are feeling grumpy towards her, cause you know it will pass. But your other half needs to be a part of you, and know all, and trust you to conceal nothing. To the degree we are willing to do that with someone, we are revealing the depth of our bond. Many "married" people keep most stuff to themselves, and IMO in so doing are hardly married at all, is another one of those fitting issues. <p>In general I do agree honesty is the best policy, but by no means always.....however with your mate, it is the only policy.<p>[ December 17, 2001: Message edited by: sad_n_lonely ]</p>

S_N_L, <p>Would you tell her before you talked to the attorney or after you have done so ? Would you tell them exactly WHO the attorney is or simply that you talked to one and what your conversations were about ?

That is a tough one, but I think the deal is radical honesty is about emotions as well as deeds. So the fact that you are contemplating divorce (no one sees an attorney unless that is possible) is important, and should be communicated. However, seeing an attorney is a defensive act, and in opppsition to being married. So having voiced your feelings, and intent, then disclosing when you act on it, I don't think you have to reveal the nature of the discussion with attorney....it is the beginning of a seperate life, and radical honesty is somewhat abridged. By revealing your feelings, and the actions taken, you have provided her with the info she needs to make her own decisions, and that is the purpose of radical honesty.

Sad Daddy,<p>Harley states that even a divorce should be POJA'd. That is his definition of radical honesty, and it isn't at odds with what SnL is telling you.<p>Tell you W how you feel and where you feel you need to go. No ultimatums, no disrespectful judgements, simply you feel that with OM in the picture, there is no future for you in the marriage. She clearly has the right to make decisions and so must you, so you are seeking out the advice of a lawyer about your options.<p>You should solicit comments or advice from her. In fact ask her if she has any alternative ideas that the two of you may try. It is in the spirit of honesty that the two of you may come to understand where the other stands and receive help from them.<p>As you state, she has choices and so do you, but sometimes choices take on different means with more data.<p>Be honest with her, but ask her advice and help.<p>God Bless,<p>JL

yep, what jl said too, and as much as possible I agree that a divorce should be poja'd, as well as reconcilliation. For sure radical honesty needs to be delivered in a thoughtful, cooperative, caring manner....not as a threat, ultimatum, put down...etc. (like many do, and then smile sweetly and say they were just being honest). To me the whole point of relationships in general, is to at the very least be respectful and caring, whether your spouse is or not. But if they are, even a divorce should be a lot less traumatic, if everyones needs are being considered and met.

Sad daddy - Sorry to hear you're at this point. My thoughts are with you...

Hi Marissa, <p>How the heck are you ?? Been a long time since i have seen a post from you. <p>Please don't be sad that I am in this situation...our marriage is the best now that it's been in a long long time. She is really starting to get THOSE feelings back for me and i can tell it. It's just that she hasn't given up the OM yet. Her friend and then her Dad said that maybe we should seperate just to let her miss what she has got and to realize it before it's too late. <p>So I am going to talk to a lawyer and see what should be done IF we ever decide to go that route. I don't think that we will, but we may have to but i have made it VERY CLEAR to her that it is the last thing that i want. <p>How are you doing ? Are things better for you and your hubby ? I hope so.