I am going to try again to recover my M. I have taken a long hard look at my situation and I am not ready to lose my W thru divorce, I dont feel like I have tried enough. I know many of you think I have but I am going to see if we can rebuild what we are losing.

I spoke briefly and with tears to my W yesterday, she doesn't want dv, i don't want it but we need to figure out a way to try and get over all the hurt that has been caused by both of us. It feels like its gone beyond hurting about the A, that's no longer there. The hurt of the loss of her is what is painful and I hope that is something that I can repair.

I have suggested that we try and date for awhile, and with small steps try and rebuild. I hope that she will consider and do this so that in time we might get somewhere. This also seems a sensible approach as we are both scared for different reasons, me for being hurt and her for her well being. I am hopeful that we can get support and MC help which was so lacking when she came out of hospital last year.

I am drained mentally, physically and emotionally, so much so that I feel I could sleep for months. This separation is taking a heavy toll on me, the girls and my W. We have no forum at present in which to talk just Text Messages which is no way to try a relationship rebuild.

I have asked her to consider it, but don't know what her response is as yet.

Best wishes, Neil.

Neil

I don't know what to say - as ever, not many words of advice, but plenty of support. Your situation is somewhat different and I have wondered for a time if you felt that you needed to try reconciliation one last time. Dv has not sat easily with you (I'm sure it doesn't with anyone), but it felt that this was really about protecting yourself and your children rather than realising you had no future - it always seemed like you wanted to try again and again.

Whatever you decide to do, know that we are all here wishing you the very best of everything. I hope that your W and you can work out some boundaries that sit comfortably with both of you and allow you to feel safe and secure with any form of relationship you try to develop. I think this is particularly important for her wellbeing and your sanity.

As ever, wishing you well and thinking of you in sunny, very very cold North London.

Lisa

Dear Porsche 911,

I am no guru but offer you my humble opinion. It seems to me that you owe it to yourself to do whatever you can to save your marriage. After all you have a long history and 3 children together. Unless it is your W's clear wish to divorce I think there is every reason to try again. When do you stop trying? For me,the answer would be, when I know in my heart that I have done everything I could to save the M. When I can look back and say it is over,and feel there was no stone left unturned. That I can accept that despite my best efforts it cannot be saved. That point is different for everyone but you clearly have not reached it yet. I think it is about your instincts really.
JMVHO!

I seem to be becoming a cliche queen, but here is a favorite of mine...a journey of a thousand miles starts with one small step.

I wish you well. As a relatively new MBer I am aware that I do not know your whole story so I hope my input is not out of place

Regards
Deluded

Well I had a long talk with WS at our home today and it's clear that she wants the divorce. She says that there is way to much hurt and resentment on her part towards me to come home or to work on the M.

She is not interested in doing anything towards a recovery, feeling that she is the hurt party, and that there is too much to recover. She wants the divorce to progress as it is.

I have been very very sick today with a bug going around, so this feels even more like a hammerblow. It's me trying to extend the olive branch each time only to get hurt. She constantly throws at me what I write here, its like I am not allowed to have any feelings. Its weird. In the way she acts you would have thought it was me who had the A's.

I followed the advice of my MC last night to try and see a way forward with my W but the door is firmly closed as far as she is concerned.

I really don't have the energy for plan a's or b's or trying to keep going towards a reconciliation. I am a nervous wreck right now its as though I've gone completely backward these past few weeks. My Mum is of the view now that I should just try and get thru the dv and move as painlessly as possible, that my W has no interest in recovery or therefore in me. Thoughts?

Neil.

Niel,

I think you are going to have to face something that clearly you have avoided facing. Your W is very very sick. The MB approaches are unlikely to have any lasting affect on her. Until she gets the sort of medical help she needs, there is no chance for your marriage. Go read CoffeeMan's story.

I think for you and your children it is best that you let this marriage go. I know you love her, but the her you love isn't the one you are dealing with. She is changing daily and will continue to until she seeks help.

The cutting, and the other issues are clear signs she is a sick woman. Your children really shouldn't be spending much time around her, until she gets the help she needs.

Niel, I think it is time for you to move on. You know and I know that there is hope for your marriage, but only if your W faces her issues first. That isn't happening. We are all flawed, but hers seem to be much deeper. Hopefully, something or someone will enter her life, and it will cause her to seek the help she needs. It appears that you are not the person that can help her. I am sorry. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

God Bless,

JL

Dear P 911

I think JL's comments are very valuable. It sounds that maybe you have done everything you can,and that if it is her clear wish to Dv,partic with her problems,can you accept that there is nothing else that YOU can do?

You sound very weary and low. Look after you and your children. Your bucket of resources is close to empty so you have nothing more to give and need to focus on you to refill it.

PLease call on whatever resources you have to help. Are you on antidepressants?

My thoughts are with you.I have read your story now.

Deluded

Neil -

Wow! I was surprised & only a little surprised at her reaction.You went into the divorce pretty fast but that was for very GOOD reasons. You are justified either way. I don't know what more YOU can do though.

She is sick. Even if she wanted to do the dating thing - and if you stall the divorce she might come around on that - she would need to be working hard on her own personal recovery. Is she in abuse counseling?

I was going to shoot you a question to see if it gets better once you separate but I guess I know the answer now! I'm going through my own crisis now & am ready to leave. If you get a chance, please check out my thread in recovery.

Oh Neil, I'm so sorry to hear you are sick and that your W has rejected your olive branch.

I think JL, as ever, is a very wise sage and his words make alot of sense. You can't help your W until she helps herself. I am sorry that she is not in that place where she wants to do that. I guess recovery can't work when people are in different places - this is what my H said to me "Lisa, I'm in a different place from you".

Thinking of you and hope you feel better soon.

Lisa

Hi NB, will check your thread straight after this one.

My W is not in Abuse Counselling, since she left in Sept I do not know if she has attended or not, she has said that she has gone, but has also said that she cannot afford it so has not been for many weeks so I am assuming that she is not going.

Indeed the Abuse when she talks is no longer the issue, she didn't even mention it. The issue is me, and the many years of her being unhappy with me. In some respects it's as though there has been no illness, no affairs and i am some uncaring "sleeping with the enemy" husband.

Neil.

Hey sounds just like my Hubby!

Just a few weeks ago he had all of his female co-workers on his lap at a Christmas party but my inadequacies as a wife are his excuse for not loving me.

What in God's name do we do with these people?

We both have three children to think of.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by nursebetty:
<strong>Just a few weeks ago he had all of his female co-workers on his lap at a Christmas party but my inadequacies as a wife are his excuse for not loving me.

What in God's name do we do with these people?

We both have three children to think of.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">NB I know, its all irrelevant to this talk of how things were. There needs to be a way of moving forward, that is what SH and MC told me. My W is not going to work on M so that is the way forward.

What do we do with these people? We give them what they want. My W wants DV, she sees me as the problem, she wont try. Hence we move forward as best we can based on that. Strangely she has said its never about her, but I have never been able to make a choice in anything, she chose the A's, chose to leave and now chose to not recover. Neil.

<small>[ February 05, 2005, 09:41 PM: Message edited by: hanora ]</small>

Neil,
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> It's me trying to extend the olive branch each time only to get hurt. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Dont you see, by doing this you are engaging the cycle of abuse, security and love = abuse to a pre-survivor.
That was how they were brought up, only through abuse they were shown love, and because you do not abuse her she does not recognize your love, so she thinks you are the problem.

You know, some ONE told me these same thing's a while back, you have no control over your W, if she does not want to recognize the issue's that surround her she will never have the life she deserve's, and this my friend will keep you from having the life you deserve. As my IC has told me it is time to disengage from these issue's.

I know it is not easy, that is why I am on MB, I come to vent and learn, my marriage has a very low chance of surviving, but my W is taking the enitiative to want heal, for herself, I will not allow her to do it for me, our marriage will have no chance of surviving if my W feel's she was forced.

Yep I agree with JL, your ww sounds A LOT like my xww and it wasn't until AFTER me and our daughters moved on, that she crashed and burned, in large part, because she did not have us to blame for her wretched existence. Without us to 'control' (don't you just love this favorite WS word?) her, she could not keep denying reality for much longer and the emotional meltdown she experienced, predictable. I somehow get the feeling that your stbxww will probably reach a similar fate as my xww and if she doesn't do herself in (like my xww almost did) she will have to face the hell she created.

You've got to be strong not only for yourself but for your daughters as well.

Peace be with you Neil.

Thanks all, I have been struggling immensely these last two days what with the talk yesterday and the vomitting that I just can't seem to shake.

To cap it all the date for the first part of my divorce arrived by post today, January 22nd 2003. This is called the Decree Nisi. It it the first stage of the divorce. It's arrival made me feel sick to the stomach, if there was anything left in my stomach that is.

6 Weeks 1 Day after Jan 22nd the Divorce will be final.

Dred you are right and I do know those words, but as you know saying them and acting on them are two different things.

JL, Hanora, CoffeeM, I know what you are saying but it is such the hardest thing. I struggled through all of last year seeing things that no one should have to, coping with things that no one should have too only to lose her at the end of the day. That is a truly bitter pill to swallow.

Neil.

Neil

It will get better - I am sorry you are feeling so ill, because that can't help at all.

Thinking of you in snowy north London.

Lisa

It's bizarre, she has just had a go at me for not being the guarantor on the house she wants to move into "thanks for nothing" she said.

How am I supposed to be OK being involved with her when she wants a divorce? It's nothing she says well if its nothing how come they need one?

Her needs on me are weird. Neil

Neil

If the DV is going ahead etc. and you know your W does not want reconciliation, is it perhaps time to go back to Plan B to protect yourself and your girls? Just a thought, as you know I'm not too good at this!

Lisa

Yes LIsa, that is what I have to do. I love my wife with my heart and have tried everything I know using every route I know to make this work but I have to distance myself or I will collapse.

I have got the children into some morning care so I only have to pick them up from W's in the evening. A true Plan B is very hard when you have no local family and you have children arrangements to take care of.

Neil.

I understand very well that it is a hard thing to do to move on but sometimes you do not have choice in the matter, but like Lisa said to you, it will get better with time (trust me, it will). One thing that helped me emotionally to accept the death of my M was realizing that the woman I married was not the woman I divorced to the point that it became a mantra to me. She looked identical to her but she was a totally very different person and a very undesirable one at that. I beleive that it would also benefit you if you took the same view I did and help put you on the road of emotional healing.

Peace be with you Neil.