"-So bring it on, I'm ready!! "

Go ahead and go girl! This sort of can do attitude will serve you very well in the months to come. It's so easy to get caught up in that cycle of self pity as a BS (believe me I know) so you're ahead of the game when you realize all the things you have going for you. IMO, you're to be commended for putting forth the effort to keep your family together. Good luck and god bless!

Just wanted to pile on a particular side and say that you sound like you're doing great given the circumstances and that your strength in the face of such craziness is admirable.

My only addition is that I hope you don't end up taking him back too early (so simple, but not easy, eh?). It looks like he needs to hit rock bottom and come to realize some things before you can start a decent recovery.

I definately agree!! Everyone seems to think that I would take him back tomorrow, in a heartbeat.
Well that was true at one time. But too much has happened now, and it's gone a little too far for that.
First, I would have to start to see something recognizable as the man I once knew and loved.
Also, he would have to be able to tell me what he plans to do to make this right, what can he offer the M, how does he plan to make amends, that type of thing.

I'm willing to take a chance on Recovery, but I also need some assurances that me & kids won't be hurt again, of course I realize no guarantees.
I see months before I'd be ready for anything. Providing it even gets to that point.

learnin, the bottom line is you and your children
should not have to lose home, do without heat, etc. The essentials of living! So let him have his dolly and wear it out,but in meantime, you need to take action where he pays for support!
In fact, court ordered so it comes right off the top of his paycheck directly to you!
Shall we worry about taking him back while the kids freeze, go hungry, or you lose your home?
Damage is damage, to emotional feelings , etc, but when it starts taking the security for you children and you from you,then he is low on the priority list as far as I can see.
OW has $$$? Then let her support him! And he can support his family in meantime.
Mine can go screw the world, but not take one dime again to do so! if he should decide to go again, he'll be walking!
Never again will our joint assets pay for some slut to lay up in a 5 star hotel and sleep with my H in the bargain.
I would sue the pants off him and her for return of my share of assets! And win too!
Just take care of you and the children in a way that none you suffer more than necessary. you're already dealing with enough pain!Some legal is needed here to freeze assets until an agreement is in writing and notarized or court ordered!
LouLou

Learnin,

Ark is right on (as usual - <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ). The person you want back is NOT the Ws but your H. Remember that. That is important. The other one is a fako. Don't let him back into your home. Tell him to go and get your real H.

Protect yourself. You will know when it is time to let go.

JMHO,
L.

Today is a tough day for me, very nervous.
WH is expected in town, says he has an appt. w/lawyer and for me to sign the tax forms.
I'm at work, and my stomach is in knots not knowing what to expect. I haven't talked to him since tues. when he was spewing his garbage after I stirred things up w/phone calls to OW & her H.

Also, I have decided to kick my 18-yr-old son out. Have threatened it before, but I've reached the end of my rope. I told him last night and Just phoned him again, told him I'm bringing home some boxes for his clothes.

Will tell WH to take him with him when he leaves or drop him off at a friends, I don't care where he goes at this point.

Here's the final straw:
S's junk car broke down on sunday. Not worth repairing, he was supposed to be saving for a better one this past year, but instead has nothing to show for the $15,000 he made last year!! Living at home with minimal expenses, not consistent with even giving me $$ for car ins., etc.

Now he is laid off, until construction picks up in a few weeks.
So no $$ in his pocket, not even concerned w/getting unemployment papers in on time so that he can collect a check.

Now he wants to borrow my van. I let him take it the first night to a friends. He was good, home on time, didn't use much gas.

Last night, roads were icy, I couldn't even get up my drive, and I said NO he could not take it.
I get the usual angry crap. "I'm taking it anyways, I'm not sitting here all F'n night, slamming doors etc. like a 2-yr-old!

Later, 9pm still demanding to take van, standing at the end of my bed while i'm reading his 4 yr.old sister a bed time story. He yells downstairs to one of his brothers, "DON'T touch that TV or I'll slit your f'n throat!! What????
(This is typical behavior for him, and without a car he is home more so we get the brunt of it)

I said "Enough" you are out of here! He says, well it's not like I'd really do it!

I always wanted the boys to stick around so that their little sister would know them and have siblings to grow up with for as long as possible, but at this point I realize it is causing more harm than good.

I have no "Dad" home to back me up when these things happen, so I don't always carry through.
But I'm feeling strong these days, I'm sticking to it this time!

I have to consider the other kids.
I have enough on my plate as it is.

Despite a recent heart-to-heart with S, about helping out around house,(he never does anything!, I'm just the maid!) being respectful, especially during this time, etc. I can see that it had no affect and his promises don't mean a thing. (Following WH's footsteps!)

I think this will be a good wake up call for him.

"Sorry you don't have a car, sorry no job, You should have thought of that and been kisssing my butt!!! I would have done anything for to help you out..."

Support would be nice on a day like today!!

A little tough love going on there .I don't have teens so don't know , but was one myself and husband had that kind of attitude with his mom sometimes .(till I got in picture)

If you don't through him out theres another wake up call .

No laundry, no dinner can't eat the food unless you pay for it .

Give him a dead line after that starts and amount of rent to pay .

If he wants food oe use of car work around house for it . Shovel snow , take garbage out and so on .

Or well you are out of here . I know dealing with this on top of everything else what a ...B!TCH

But he to is going through this and is probbly angry and no they don't derect it to the PARENT who deserves the attitude .

Remeber breath in and out LOL ...............

YOGA or KICK BOXING I here is the 2 top things to do when going through this . I did TYBO (close to kick boxing ) It does relive some stress .(that and a beer now and again LOL)

Sorry trying to get a <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> out of you .

I know the thought of calm before the storm thing in your stomach is kicking your a$$ right now just expect worsed and it can only be better then that <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Got to run It is snowing like nuts and these are bad days for me when it snows also PMS like crazy LOL never good for LB'ing .

BE STRONG WOMEN , YOU ARE THE BETTER PERSON !!!!

<small>[ March 06, 2003, 12:51 PM: Message edited by: 3isacrowd ]</small>

WH just stopped by work for me to sign the tax forms.
Isn't sticking around to see the kids. (Weather excuse).
Says he'll see them next week at his mother's 80th B-day party. 5 hrs away.
I've been invited and plan on taking the kids.
His family has been very supportive of me, especially his cousin who is giving the party.
Says he is going to see a lawyer now,(I asked if he had been yet), so don't know if he really is or
not.
It was a very short encounter in his car, he said thanks for signing, I said no problem, and he waved when he drove by me.
My stomach is still in knots, don't expect to hear from him in the near future.
Let things settle down, sink in for him, he said some pretty nasty stuff over the past few days.
I'm gonna sit tight and be patient, not much else I can do.
I'm glad I didn't tell the kids he was coming up, because once again they would be disappointed.
I feel so bad for my kids. Including the oldest, he has obviously suffered from his absence and lack of discipline.

Just checking in your on my mind and want you to always know someone will be listening , how did things go with your son the other day?

Boxes or did you change your mind? well check in later . COURAGE ......... and a GOAL !!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for thinking of me.

I told him I was serious, so he did some laundry and packed his stuff, made some phone calls and I dropped him off at the apt of 2 friends he knows. (I don't know them).

He accused me of purposely waiting until his car broke down and he had no money(due to layoff) to do this.

My reply: "For someone with no wheels or $$, you should have been kissing my butt. You know I always help you out, but you stepped over the line one time too many times. Sorry the timing wasn't better for you!"

I felt sad, I told him I loved him when I dropped him off(no response), and that if he wanted to come home and could abide by my rules, then he could ask. He just gave me a tel# to call when his tax refund check comes "so I can eat".

I cried afterwards, but stopped and had a beer with a friend, got some support for my decision(she's been there, and is pretty strict about that stuff)so that helped.

4-yr.old D had questions this morning, Did S leave last night? Puzzled that his car still there, etc. I just said that he is really big boy now and needs to live in his own house now, but that we'll still see him. What else can I say? I don't want her to be insecure about misbehaving, I might tell her she has to leave?!

UUgh,Sigh, I just feel like my great little family that I've worked so hard to take care of for 20 yrs, is falling apart piece by piece, day by day.

I have to hang on to what I have left and do the best I can. I can't give up on any of them. Including WH and S.

I just hope they don't give up on me.
Crying...

Need advice:

After such a banner week I'm not sure if WH will be calling anytime soon.

Problem:
I Was planning on taking 3 of the kids 5 hrs. away for MIL's 80th B-day on the 15th.
Apparantly WH is going also(was hoping he would suggest driving together, but after this week...?)

Now I realize 12 yr.old's semi formal dance is that same day, and he has had his date for a month.

Do I:
-See if he can stay with a friend and go to the dance(he'll also be able to go to his B-ball tourn,that we thought he'd be missing for the party)
-Stay home to do his stuff, and ask WH if he wants to take the other 2 kids(I'm sure he would),but not sure if 16 yr. old will want to go w/him.
-Do I call him to make these alternate plans, or wait for him to call me. If he doesn't call to inquire about us/kids, then should I feel bad if the kids don't make it to Nanie's party(she'd be dissapointed) AND would my not calling him be manipulative LB on my part?

I really wanted to go to party, to make a statement: I'm still in the loop, I was invited, I'm wanted here, I'm not uncomfortable here(is he?)! You won't keep me away from the people I've know and loved for 20 yrs. (His cousin is throwing the party, and has been super supportive of me, has always been a good friend.)

What to do? Any suggestions!
I also don't want 12 yr.old to feel like I'm ditching him. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

The 12 year old will probbly want to be with friends anyway LOL , your not diching him.

Is OW going to party? I would wait awhile to see if WH calls if not make sure you go and look well wonderful darling LOL .

You are there family and if they love you and you them it has nothing to do with him and that should be made clear . 20 yrs is along time and they mean alot to you , don't deniy yourself that .

JMVHO - Stand strong head held high and show evryone what your made of .

GO FOR NANA she would want you there and your only 80 once !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't expect OW to be there, as a matter of fact I think their little fantasy world is crumbling as we speak, since my exposing A to OW'S H on tues.

I'm feeling pretty good, looking great since I've lost over 20 lbs since Christmas, and I want to show off with my new attitude.

12 yr.old did say tonight that he wants to stay with friends. So I won't feel guilty.

Anyone have regrets about letting family know too much about day to day dealings with WS?

My family has been supportive, but they can be pretty opinionated as well(I am too!).

TOday my brother was pretty explicit about what I need to do, should do, shouldn't do, picking apart WH's actions over the past few years(re:working on the road so much)accusing him of not being a good father during that time etc.

I do want to have to defend WH's past actions, he has only been unrecognizable for the past few months. Before that he was a loving & caring father & husband.

Family cannot understand that the pre-A H is the man I am waiting this out for. I don't want the WH back!! And if I never see the pre-A H again then, I move on.

I feel I owe my children that. Brother seems to feel otherwise. After another bumpy week I was feeling overall good, strong, focused and then Brother's hour long call. UUGGH!

I'll get over it. Just tired of defending my actions lately.

Learnin -
When it rains it pours. You've got a lot to deal with, I hope you have some time for YOU. That beer with a friend sounded good! I can relate to the trials of teenagers. My 2 "kids" are 24 and 22. I spent more time up at nights with them as teenagers than I ever did when they were infants, talking, talking and talking some more. It's all about them learning that their actions have consequences, isn't it?

Speaking of actions and consequences, applies to WH's, too. You said you're waiting for your WH to return to the H you knew and loved, then he can come home. I agree, but I am also raising the bar with my WH - I want a new, improved WH, or at least one who is truly willing to become one. For me, this is the most important consequence to his action of having an A.

D-Day was not long ago (12/21/02?) for you, yet you have come very far in dealing with the A. I couldn't help cheering for you reading about your phone calls to OW, that took guts! It could take a lot more time before your WH is ready to come home, and you're ready to take him back. During that time you'll feel better if you do things for yourself, work on yourself, whatever areas of your life you want to work on. I know, with kids at home you probably don't have much time. If you can do some things for yourself then you're not just waiting for WH, you're growing as a person and it doesn't feel like you're wasting time. It's a great feeling to realize you've grown, isn't it?

Are you going to the family B-Day party? It's great that the ILs are supportive of you. Mine are, too, although I know I can only go so far. In anger I once asked MIL to never talk to her son (WH) again, it would teach him about consequences. Needless to say, I went too far, but she realized that I was upset and forgave me. My own brothers and parents have been supportive of whatever I've done. I'm sorry your brother is stressing you. Of course he's trying to protect you, some people think the only way to deal with an A is Dv. Do you think your brother would come to this site and read some of the MB info on affairs?

This winter has been BRUTAL!! I live in upstate NY, probably not as cold as you, but it just won't stop. I can't wait til spring. I wish you warmth, peace and long moments of calm.
Lablady

Me BS 47
WH 48
Married 24 yrs
Son 24, D 22
OW 44 widow/coworker
D-Day 7/02
WH goes back and forth btwn me and OW 8/02 - 12/02 I take him back 8 times after he promises NC each time
12/31/02 WH moves in w/OW
1/29/03 I get letter from WH saying he still loves me, wants to get own apartment to sort things out
2/10/03 I send WH Plan B letter
WH still has not moved into apartment, we'll see what's next.....

Missing Framed Photo???

Noticed last night that my favorite photo of WH and oldest S is missing from living room!! See description in 1st post of this thread.

Did S take it thurs. night when he moved out?

Did WH take it thurs. afternoon when he was here? (I was at work, S was here only)

Think he was in the file cabinet also. I have already removed most important stuff.

Time to change locks???

I've had 2 low key short phone conversations with WH, yesterday & today.

Discussed car lease options, I also asked if he had any objections to my selling some things for cash, upright freezer, tools etc. He doesn't. I also said I was packing some of his stuff for him, did he want books etc, or just yard sale it.
It was probably a LB, and I should combine with some Plan A stuff. I feel confused right now.

He seemed very humble, quiet, none of the garbage that he was spewing earlier this week.

I'm dying to know if the OW broke of the relationship, I highly suspect that she did.

Should I ask, let it go, write a Plan A letter, I'm at a crossroads here I feel.

Will be seeing WH at MIL's 80th B-Day on the 15th, need to be in the right frame of mind, strong.

Wondering if sending a letter this week to him will give him something to think about before then, or if I am pushing it. I also need to feel like I Plan A is still in effect.

At the end of phone conv. he quietly asked me to give the kids a hug & kiss, I said sure and he said thank you.

I know this man, now that the s@#t hat hit the fan, I know that the things he said this week and done have got to be bothering him.... Could the fog be lifting, a little bit even??

The suspense is killing me but I know I have to be patient...

Haven't heard from oldest son, I may give him a call to let him know I'm thinking of him.

HI I have time to write H over night with OW <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

anyway glad to here your staying focused , and need to comment on your brother .

Understand everyone will mean well but is CLUELESS on what your going through unless they walked in your shoes . (and that you wish on no one , except ow LOL)

Explain to family what you need is support and that there opions are welcome but....... to keep in mind not to spit in the air cause they do not know what they would do in that situation only assume .

And yes I know it will feel as if you are defending H to them and your confused cause at the same time you want to bash him yourself .DO NOT bash him to anyone cause they can't understand the difference of venting at this stage.

I don't know if this makes sense I tend to
ramble <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Got to go play game with kids , be back on later tonight .

Questions, questions ???,

How do I know if the relationship with WH & OW has met an untimely death? I highly suspect this, but can I ask, how do I ask?

I sent an unPlan A message on sunday when I told WH that I was packing up some of his stuff, how do I give him a Plan A message, to offset that and to keep the ball rolling regarding this past weeks events...?

Should I ask him if he wants to ride with me & the kids (4 1/2 hrs. + 2 hrs. for WH) to his mom's B-day Party?
How do I ask, so as not to feel rejected if he refuses?

He definately sounds like he has calmed down after the blow up earlier this week, but is it a ploy? I'm scared, hopeful, confused..

Advice anyone?

Bump