I posted this update on divorce board, as that is the appropriate place, but for those who wonder about where Sad n lonely is in his life with thinker...here is the link

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=34&t=008600

Note - The post linked here has been removed. Member was banned under a different user name.

<small>[ March 19, 2003, 12:05 AM: Message edited by: MBMagnolia ]</small>

Hi SNL, long time no read <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I'm not even sure you'll remember me but you kicked my butt a few times and helped me a lot and I've never forgotten. I've wondered how you were doing, having only been reading one side of the coin. I'm glad to know you're doing as well as can be expected. Peace and luck to you <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hey SNL,

Thanks for giving the other side to the story. I knew there was much more here than we were hearing about. I wish you the best and truly hope you find the happiness you deserve. And I really really mean that after seeing what you have endured.

Best regards,
Dana

SNL,

Well someone has been pulling a great con job on somewhere, ya know? Wonder who it is. I mean either you are or are not providing for your family (financially, mentally, emotionally, etc.). Either you are or are not taking care of your mom and her helping her get settled into the home you are suppose to finish renovating. Either you are or are not working with your W and lawyers to dissolve this M in as peaceful a way as humanly possible.

SNL, I have spoken to both of you, it is hard all the way from here to hear of the pain in both of you. It must be excruciating to be in the inner circle of your family.

Whether you are or are not doing as you say really isn't my place to say, I am just wondering. I know that as a BS most don't have the time, energy or the imagination to make up the circumstances that stare us in the face. Many a WS though have enough of an imagination to become fantasy writers.

IMHO, somewhere between both your stories lies the truth. You both know where that is.

If I read and took what you said word for word, I would almost begin to doubt that you even had an A. But you did right? Anger bouts? Happened, yes? Staunch demands? Well, most of us are not saints, not close to perfect. Most of us have issues. Certainly not enough to qualify for abandoning one's family.

A or no A, if it was 1/2 as bad as you say, then you should have peacefully left Faith4me a long time ago. All your procrastination did was lengthen the pain of your family.

Can you honestly say you have eliminated the source of pain from your family? Made it so that even though you are divorcing your W, at least your family won't have to suffer in any other way?

Isn't she telling you to go? Leave her in peace? Just meet your obligations? Is that unreasonable?

SNL, I asked someone on another thread:

15. How should one (ie: a BS) handle another (particularly a WS) if the WS says one thing and does another? I know this s/b an obvious answer but life often doesn't go in an obvious route.
Now this question is raised because in the case of the A there is (not opinion but fact), there is a lot of fluff, bluff and A stuff talk spewing out of the mouth of the WS. Most of which are quite foreign the family. Made up or dead issues are raised up as if they exist and are thriving today.

16. What do you think it would take for let's say someone of your character who may have picked up the bad habit of let's say blaming the world for not enabling the A, what would it take to get that type of character back to normalacy so that these character issues are not jeporadizing on the family's health, safety and security? In other words, if you were a WS and you jeporadized your family's health, safety and security, what should your spouse do?

17. To expand on #16, what should a spouse do when a WS is in such a hurtful state of mind and heart? I questions 16 & 17 are particularly important since many here are in various stages of that situation and don't know how to react. That being the case, some are actually enabling the A by trying to work with the WS and be nice. Why? Because they are trying (for whatever reason), trying to save their M or M and family. But it may be that in this case, the true plan A may not be pratical.

You know, Lurking never responded to those questions. Was wondering what your thoughts might be.

I don't post this to make you angry, just know that what you post as eloquently as you do still needs to ring true to the right persons. In your case that is primarily to you and your family. If your children read what you and Faith4me posted, which one would ring true?

Remember the rest of us are just observers sharing our opinion.

take care,
L.

Well hello there snl!

I would like to introduce myself--I am YetAgain and I have posted to Faith4me a number of times. I am mostly a lurker and am not qualified in the least to post about MB issues as I really really suck at applying MB principles but I'm working on it and am learning a lot about myself in the process. My posts to Faith4me are usually about other issues such as living with chronic pain and taking care of ourselves (and protecting ourselves) from someone we still love.

snl, I would like to give you my opinion--and it is just that, my opinion, nothing more and nothing less. My opinion is based mostly on my own experiences and situation (both past and present). Btw, you were/are a lot like my FWS and I was/am a lot like Faith4me--and I'm talking about both good and bad characteristics. If my sharing my opinion with you helps you in any way, then great! If it doesn't, then just ignore it ok?

Oops, before I continue I should let you know that the link to the post you referred to doesn't work so I have no idea what your post said except for the references to it from other posters in this thread.

snl, I have wondered for a while if you really want to continue in the direction you have been going, or if it's just that you don't know how to stop the trainwreck. snl, if you are entertaining any thoughts, desire, etc of wanting a better marriage on better terms for both you and Faith4me--I think it is entirely possible if BOTH of you are willing to do what it is necessary for EACH of you to do. I don't think it is possible for you two to do it on your own to start though--I think you both would need coaching from SH.

snl, I know from experience how hard it is to live with chronic pain. I also know how hard it is on the people around us (especially our kids) until we learn good ways to deal with it. I know the frustration and loneliness of it being ignored or denied by a spouse instead of dealt with in ways that take BOTH spouses' needs into consideration--and I know that anger that results from that (for BOTH spouses). I suspect that if you two could deal with the injury/chronic pain issues in ways that eliminate the LBs about it and meet some of the ENs about it (for BOTH of you) then you two could end up being one of the biggest success stories at MB.

snl, the biggest reason I have doubts as to whether you really want to end your marriage to Faith4me is that, from what her posts say, you don't seem to be happier divorcing or even experiencing relief. In fact, it seems that you like to be at her house a lot--even though you could eat meals and have visitation with your kids somewhere else.

snl, I believe that you have the right to make choices that you feel are best for you in your life. If you are having doubts about finalizing your divorce, I hope you will open yourself up to Faith4me and discuss (maybe with SH?) what changes you would each want from and for both of you and then form a plan for that to start happening. If you are not having doubts about finalizing your divorce, then I hope you will do your part in not making it any harder than it absolutely has to be. I believe that can be done by each of you fulfilling the responsibilities you are responsible for while continuing to eliminate LBs even though neither of you will be responsible for meeting ENs after divorce. snl, your kids and future grandkids will be the greatest benefactors of this--and I believe that you love your kids enough to do this for them and their future children.

It is not too late to make changes snl--whether those changes are for a better marriage or for a better divorce. And I believe you deserve better than what it is now, as does Faith4me and your kids.

Take care snl, I really mean that.

P.S.--I was angry about something Faith4me said that you said a while ago. If you really did say this--that the people here are not real and don't care--I want you to know that I AM a real person and I DID care. You couldn't have known that because I lurked. When you and Faith4me didn't post for months I thought about you both fairly often and included you in prayers. I still care snl, about both of you and your kids.

Hi YetAgain,

Don't mean to intrude, just wanted to let you know that SnL and Thinker (Faith4me) had counseled with Steve Harley for quite some time. It was actually Jen.

Jo