My wife, just recently told me that she is too tired to give any more to our marriage, and that she has been trying hard fo rthe past 5 1/2 years.

She recently broke me the news out of the blue, after I had thought we had been recently making some good progress.

We have had many tough times (but no physical abuse, or yelling), just not being able to communicate or meet each others needs.

We did just finish the His Needs/Her Needs class that was given at our church. This was really helping us a lot and at the conclusion of the class (May 13), she had said that this class really helped give her the tools, and the balance in my love bank balance had been restored. Throughout this time period, we would always hold hands in class, snuggle up to each other, and even the other people taking the class thought we acted like newlyweds.

Since then, we stopped working on this stuff, and things were progressively getting worse. Finally two weeks ago, she said that she had nothing more to give, and was so tired from trying that she thought it would be good if I moved out (since she is the only one who can afford the house payment.) When I asked her about a week later, "What's going to happen to us?",she said, "We'll probably end up getting divorced."

Anyway, I have tried so hard to still be kind, make myself scarce, and at the same time disctance myself emotionally from her. She still says that I would be a good friend, and still gived me a big hug before bed (she sleeps on the couch.)

How do you distance yourself emotionally (which seems to be getting a lot easier for me now), without losing the desire to want to work things out,if she ends up changing her mind and decided she wants to work on "us" again?

I'm afraid that if I completely distance myself emotionally, then there may be no turning back to me ever having a desire to get back together again (if that is ever a possibility)

Any thoughts on how to do this? It seems that by doing this, I actually am trying to make her love bank balance in her account with me go way down, inorder to give her what she needs now and to protect myself.

Is it good to let yourself get to this point if you truly want your spouse back?

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

The fact that your W broke the news out of the blue raises a huge red flag that there might be somebody else in the picture. To go from loving W to an emotionally cold woman in a short period of time is very typical of a woman having an A. While I hope that this may not be the case, please don't dismiss the possibility like so many people do and later find out that they were wrong. Do some snooping around because if she is having an A, there will be clues that she's going to leave behind which will eventually confirm it.

I don't know if it was quite so much out of the blue as I mentioned. I had recently told her that I appreciated that she was working on meeting some of my needs (like domestic support, affection-hugs when she got home from work, etc), but that it wasn't that important--these other needs (like domestic support), I just wanted to have fun together (recreational companionship) and be close (intimacy-sex), or it doesn't feel as much that she loves me.

She basically told me that she felt that she was doing this all for nothing; I tried to tell her that I really appreciated these other needs that she was meeting, but it was like she could never do anything right for me. And the fact that I told her that I was worried that she didn't really love me, that she was just trying to meet my needs out of obligation.

I looked at it as she feels that she has tried for so many times, and that this his needs/her needs class was kind of like one last chance in her mind. (Kind of like going through 99 job interviews, and not getting a jog, then still not getting a job after the 100th interview. Then after 100 failed attempts, you might be inclined to finally give up looking for a job.)

You still think an affair could be a possibility? She goes out and tells me where she is going and who she is going with, but today she didn't, but I thought that it was just so she didn't have to check in with me. She's always been a little elusive. But only about something like, "I'll be about 30 minutes late home from work today. I have to make a stop along the way." Only to find out that she just had to stop at the pharmacy and pick up a prescription, but maybe it was easier than going through the detail of explaining exactly what that stop would be.

If so, should I ask her if she is having an affair, or if there is someone else?

I was just concerned about how to distance myself emotionally and not completely shut out any feelings for her whatsoever. Maybe there is much more here (someone else)??

Thanks,

Gregg

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Finally two weeks ago, she said that she had nothing more to give, and was so tired from trying </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Gregg, I am not clear on what the problem is. She is tired of trying to do what? Why does she want to break up?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If so, should I ask her if she is having an affair, or if there is someone else?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If you do she'll probably deny it, and she'll just be more careful to avoid being careless in leaving clues for you to pick up. That's why it's better to avoid asking her that question until you have proof positive that she is having one.

GreggC

It sounds like you and I are in the same sinking boat! But you have a gut instinct--go with it it's probably right. I knew something was wrong with my H--just didn't know what. My greatest fear was an A. I thought no, he could never be capable of that. We really didn't have a bad realationship. No passion lately and tremendous stress, but no real fights. My H asked for a divorce after being out of town 4 month.

I figured out his e mail password and sure enough signs of an OW and an EA.

Like you I'm sick of being a doormat--but how do you not push the spouse further away maybe further into their arms. Atleast your still at home. My H left already for Iraq and expects me gone when he gets back--or he'll leave.

My H is afraid of the same thing your S seems to be and that is that it'll be ok for a little while and then fall apart again.

Take my advice with a grain of salt since we are in the same boat--- but I would keep trying to make deposits into the love bank and avoid LB. Read all the books if you haven't already. Best $60 you'll ever spend. In my opinion we have our whole lives to get divorced--why rush it. Why not make 110% sure that it's the right thing to do.

Good luck.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by T00MuchCoffeeMan:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If so, should I ask her if she is having an affair, or if there is someone else?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If you do she'll probably deny it, and she'll just be more careful to avoid being careless in leaving clues for you to pick up. That's why it's better to avoid asking her that question until you have proof positive that she is having one.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think this is such an important point! Confronting a spouse without evidence is nothing but a lovebuster. If they are innocent, you have insulted them, if they are guilty, they sure aren't likely to bust themselves and will just take steps to cover their tracks better!

Best to do a little detective work on your own and rule it in or out. You might find out you were wrong all along and can move forward without having caused the damage of a false accusation.

<small>[ June 28, 2003, 11:34 AM: Message edited by: MelodyLane ]</small>

Hi all,

There have been ongoing problems; we almost split up just over a year ago. Problems with ex-wife (since 12 year old son lives with us part of the time), which in her opinion totally ruined our vacation last summer.

She feels we have always had problems communicating, and has always felt manipulated and controlled by me. I know I am guilty of criticizing her and showing her a better way to do things. I have made her feel bad about not having sex very often. I have felt sad (and told her so) about this, because it doesn't make me feel that she loves me to want to be closer to me in this way. However, this has made her feel even more manipulated and controlled.

We tried 3 other counselors in the past couple of years, but never seemed to find one that addressed our issues very well, nor did we ever find productive ways to work on the strategies, nor know exactly what to do to work on these kinds of problems.

Anyway we had finally found a counselor that we both felt was good for us (I don't know if I did a very good job of telling her that I like him, nor did I know how to open up during counseling.) We also did Harley's "His Needs/Her needs" class. During this time we were also working with our marriage counselor (for about 3 months in all.)

This class ended May 13th, and our last counseling visit was about the same time (beginning of May). Since then (I didn't feel), we were working on some of the things that we had learned in the class. I was working on stopping love busters, she primarily on domestic support. However, I know that she was having a problem with me always getting depressed in counseling about how I missed her, since we weren't having sex.

Anyway, I tried to tell her a couple of weeks ago, that all I really wanted (even though I had been critical in the past about not having enough money to do things, and having a messy house) was to have fun together and be close (rec companionship and intimacy-sex.) I told her that I was sorry for pressuring her for these things and said I need to be more patient and find ways to stop doing this. I said I finally understand that I have some problems, and I need to work with a counselor to stop these behaviors. I have even started seeing a personal counselor (once last week and once the week before.)

Anyway she says she is now just too tired from trying and doesn't imagine how she could ever get past the "so many issues" that we have to ever feel romantic with me. She just needs her space, and can't imagine getting past all of these issues. I think that she thinks that I should have taken initiative a long time ago to work on my problems with a counselor, but now it is just too late. She says she needs some emotional distance before she could even be my friend again.

Anyway, I was wondering how to create (or is I should) love bank deposits (what kinds of things to do) if she wants emotional detachment. Lately, I have tried not to ask her anything about what she is doing, even if she says she is going somewhere. I have just tried to be polite and talk to her if she asks me something. I am making myself scarce, and look forward to finally moving out and in a few days to a place of my own.

Should I be opening up to her at all at this point, even though it is really hard? I have told her (a week or two ago) that I truly understand and can admit that I need some help, and would see a counselor every week for good, if that is what it takes. I told her I am truly sorry for not understanding or taking action on this in the past, and that I am sorry for putting my problems on her shoulders. She said that she is glad that I am taking care of myself, but is just too late for us.

It is becoming an uncomfortable environment at home lately, just because it is so weird. Today for example, I decided to get out, and she is going somewhere to go bike riding, because she asked me how to put the bike rack on her car. When I left we both simply told each other, have a good day. She smiled like she was happy, but may have been just a polite smile.

Anyway, should I still be looking for evidence of an A, and any advice on how I should be interacting with her? (Total avoidance, or just exactly as two roommates should act if they don’t know each other very well, or should I still be working hard at removing all LB, and leave it at that?)

Oops, I submitted twice

<small>[ June 28, 2003, 01:18 PM: Message edited by: GreggC ]</small>

Thanks, Dazed and Confused,

I think all of Harley's stuff is right on, an the concepts seem so simple that if you simply keep doing them long enough (both spouses) then any marriage should work. I think my wife got so overwhelmed by all of the information and thought that I would criticize her if each and every need wasn't being met all the time. I tried to tell her that these are all just requests, that these things are what I would like, but do not expect. It didn't seem to help though. I think she had made up her decision before we started Harley's class, and that the class may have been one last ditch effort.

Do you think that maybe your husband would be open to trying the class with you (or have you already) from someone that has been trained to do it in our area?

Just a thought.

Gregg

Gregg, I don't know what is really going on, but I can't imagine that she thought your marriage would be helped in any way by denying sex. That is hardly the behavior of someone who is trying to work on their marriage. I just sense that she is looking for reasons to exit the marriage and none of the reasons you gave add up.

If she were really concerned about the marriage, she wouldn't withhold sex, a top EN of most men. Her actions just don't match her words. A person who wants their marriage doesn't ask for detachment. That is irrational doublespeak that makes me think there is an OP in the wood pile.

Also, I would not leave if I were you. That is the WORST thing you can do. The person who wants the seperation should always be the one who leaves. Why should you lose your home because she wants to detach?If she wants to seperate, then she needs to face the consequences of that decision. Let her leave her nice, safe cozy home and venture out into a strange apartment alone. Protecting her from her decisions only delays the onset of reality and you surely don't want that.

Have you done any detective work to see if there is an affair going on here?

Hi Melody,

The main reason for me moving out is that she is the only one who could afford the mortgage payment on our house. She has also offered to take over all of our bills, except for my child support payment. Also, I don't know if I could stand to be there without her, because I think it would be depressing to me (it already is) being there.

I haven't had the opportunity to do any detective work. I was going to try this morning, but there was never an opportunity, since she was there the whold morning.

I have been told by many people that women just simply can't have sex without feeling bad about it, if they feel invalued, criticized (as I have done to her) until they can feel close through other MB's any reduction is LB's. Even our therapist says this. Even Harley (I thought) says that Love Busters need to go first, before there can be work on MB's (like sex)

I feel that since I have offered (maybe I shouldn't have offered in the first place), and since I have already found a place, that I need to follow through. I feel that I do not want to make her unhappy, and I want to give her the space that she needs at this time. At this point, I do not think it is a good option (not moving out)

I still don't understand why an affair would even be likely, but I will keep my eyes open. The only thing I did find of interest is a piece of paper in her wallet that had the name and the price for an attorney.

Thanks for your honesty.

Gregg

<small>[ June 28, 2003, 04:53 PM: Message edited by: GreggC ]</small>

Gregg, were your lovebusters really so severe? I really hate to see you move out because it just makes reconciliation all the more unlikely. Its much easier to work on a marriage when you are living together than apart. Are things really that bad?'

Also, is she on a computer much?

I think that she felt criticized and manipulated a lot during our marriage.

She has told me that we need to separate, and I have already promised her this. I figured at least she would have time to think (without me criticizing her and always being in her face (as I know I was.)

She doesn't seem to ever use the computer at home, but she would have a chance to a lot at work.

Gregg