I am not for this...
but seems that same sex marriage is ok in Canada
and now it is up for votes in the states how do you feel about that? for it or against it?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Lesbians and homosexuals have been around for all history. Always, they have been considered abnormally sexually oriented. But if you truly are a Christian then you will not judge the way of life. It is written in the Bible that you should not do it. It is also written in the Bible that it is better to be married than to sin (and burn), uh, so I have to say I just do not know.

What is right for one person is Not right for another necessarily.

I believe in peaceful harmony. And just like so many predjudices we hold near and dear to our hearts, when the light hits them, errr-they are UGLY!

If I could control the world, I would want everyone to be married to the opposite sex, and that they would never do anything to jeoperdize the marriage. I would want everyone to be healthy in body and mind and to have 2.3 children and that they would be perfect too in all they do.

What are the odds of that happening.

I'm not for it but as long as it does not affect me and is not rubbed in my face, they can do what they want.

However, if a government "okays" it and my tax dollars are going to support it in some way (benefits, insurance, whatever) then I will not look the other way.

Guys and Gals-

I was raised in a home with two moms. In my day, it was a big secret and everyone was taught to "lie" about who L was. The world knew her as my aunt. Imagine the shame a child learns because of secrets.

If you asked me if was better off in a home with mom and dad, my answer would be "no". See dad was abusive, alcoholic, sex offender, child molester.

My point in sharing this - people are people. It doesn't matter what their sex is. I personally feel that there is a biolgical difference that contibutes to same sex interest - yes I believe it's hereditary - my nephew is now "open".

I think that like with any other stigmata - race, religion, sex, orientation - the question is more about freedom of choice.

Yes I support it.

It is not something I would partake in myself, but who am I to judge whether or not it is right for someone else. I believe in the old adage "to each his own". I try not to judge people for their beliefs and lifestyles. I want people to respect that I make my own decisions based on my own decisions and what I know is right for me, and I want to give other people that same respect.

I am wholeheartedly against this. The Bible specifically tells us that homosexuality is a sin.

Lev 18:22 Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.

In the first chapter of Romans, Paul describes that homosexuality is a perversion.

When God tells us not to "judge" in the Bible, He means we are not to judge people's hearts or motives. When He specifically tells us what is sin, to identify that sin is not judgement.

We've become so indoctrinated in this country to not label anything as wrong that we've lost the ability to recognize what is right.

Adultery as homosexuality is a sin. Look how particpation in this sin destroys so many lives. God gives us these parameters for a reason...for our own good. He also gives His grace for all of us to escape whatever sin ensnares us-adultery as well as homosexuality.

Homosexuality has always been around as well as adultery. That doesn't mean I want either to be considered normal, tolerated or acceptable behavior.

Yes I support it. There have always been homosexuals and for the most part they have had to lie about it and in doing so caused grief for themselves and others.

Minutes ago I walked past a fairly elaborate wedding. Some VIP in the gay rights movement apparently came to Canada to get married. It is still a matter of choice to churches whether they perform such marriages.

Actually there is very little difference in practical terms now than there was before. Gay and lesbian partners had the same rights as common law partners.

That is a 2 part question.

1. Should same sex marriage enjoy the same societal benefits as heterosexual marriage.

No, the societal consequences are more negative than positive, making it a bad choice for all people (including gays, who also benefit by a healthy society). This is not the same as saying gays should be prosecuted, or the recipients of bigoted behaviour. It is a policy decision to promote a particular marital paradigm for the benefits derived therein.

2. The second part is my personal position as an individual without any societal concerns. Again in my case the answer is no. IMO the consequences of embracing a gay lifestyle are more negative than positive for the person doing so. IMO it is something someone who thinks/feels they have this orientation should resist.

As a general matter of policy I don't think one can legislate some kinds of feelings and behaviour. I am opposed to laws policies that criminalize gays, or target them for specific economic consequences. In the pursuit of (and my support of) freedom I am willing to accomodate non-criminal behaviour I personally may object to. Personally I am uncomfortable with gays, but am willing to give them the same chance I extend to most people to demonstrate they can be a good co-worker, associate, friend and so forth...but that they are gay will be a factor.....just like the fact that I am hetero will be a factor to them. This also applies to gender, race, national origen, religious beleifs, political beliefs etc...such is the nature of being human.

Whoever makes someone happy is good enough for me !! Be it male/male/ - female/female - male/female ---I mean as long as you are living your life the way you want to it be -- Then it should be no one else's business... I say to each their own.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I think it's WONDERFUL that the law was altered here in Canada, to include same sex marriages as legal. (it was not a new law that was passed... just an alteration of the wording of the previous law... I wish I could remember the "word" in question... but I can't).

Although for myself, I am not interested in being involved in a same sex sexual relationship, I have no problem with others choosing to do so. That is THEIR CHOICE.

When two people love each other, and care for each other, and respect each other... joining together in the sanctity of marriage is a joyous event. I'm proud that the laws of Canada have finally acknowledged that ALL humans should be treated equally and fairly. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Karen

right there with maw64 and topie. i think in the world we live there isnt enough love and understanding. go for it!!

WFLOWER SAID:
What is right for one person is Not right for another necessarily.

Perhaps that is true in what to eat for dinner, but I believe there are moral absolutes. I think if we accept that statement for things like - adultery, we get into trouble really fast.

I believe in moral absolutes. I believe that there really is a God. I think God has given us moral absolutes not to make us conform, but to spell out how we can be happy. I don't believe that people are genetically programmed to be one way or the other. If that was true, natural selection would strip that "gene" from the gene pool over time and it would all but disappear.

I don't think any one can say " God made me this way" any more than a thief could say that God made him to steal, or some one that commits adultery could say that "God made me an adulator" Don't people have the capacity to change themselves? Isn't that what we are on MB for?

Perhaps the best argument against the gay lifestyle is that if it was lived absolutely by 100 % of the population, the human race would disappear from the earth in one generation.

I do believe in moral absolutes, and for me that is no adultery, and also that same sex unions are wrong.

Kily brings up a good point, but I believe that choosing the lesser of two evils doesn't make evil into good. It is just the lessor of two evils. We do live in a world with freedom. We can choose to commit adultery, we can choose to be gay. I don't believe that either lifestyle will bring long term happiness even though the people in the middle of them think often think they are happy. For me it boils down to "Is there really a God. " If there is, and he tells us what will make us happy, then we are foolish if we think another way is just as good, but just different.

Well, I am just stating my point of view, and I believe it very strongly. I don't mean to offend anyone else.

SS

Frankly I'm puzzled that homosexuals would even want to marry considering how difficult it has been for us heterosexuals to remain married. I wonder what makes them think that they are going to beat the odds, if we hetero's, after so many centuries of history of trying, have yet to beat them ourselves.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by T00MuchCoffeeMan:
<strong>Frankly I'm puzzled that homosexuals would even want to marry considering how difficult it has been for us heterosexuals to remain married. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I suspect it's for the same reasons that hetrosexual people want to get married... they love each other and want to make a vow before God and their families.

And, of course, look how many hetrosexuals are still marrying...

As far as the 'choice' to be gay -- among the gay people I know, most wouldn't choose it for a million bucks. It is just who they are at their core.

I'm going to say something that at first glance will seem to have nothing to do with the subject, but bear with me, please. I am ADHD, and I have had big arguments with people who say there is no such thing. I tell these people that they need to live in my body and then tell me I can control some of the typically-ADHD behaviors (like lack of attention - just "listen better" I'm told). I find that insulting and uncaring, to say the least.

I would say the same about being gay... telling someone who is gay that they have a choice and to stop being attracted to the same sex would be just as impossible as it would be for me to stop being attracted to men.

No matter how many times well-meaning groups have tried to de-program gays, they fizzle out, because it is not something controllable.

Big time minority opinion here!!!

I am strongly opposed to gay marriages.

I do believe in the religious/spiritual components of marriage.

I do believe in absolutes...
...you shall not kill... (except in the case of abortion)
...you shall not kill... (except in the case of Dr. Kavrokian)
...you shall not commit adultery... (except in the case of pre-marital sex)
...you shall not commit adultery... (except if your married and unhappy)
...you shall not commit adultery... (any sex with same gender---NOT being married)

I've felt that the 'slippery slope' argument can be taken to extremes...
...but our western culture is running head long (beyond the extremes) past the edge of the slope....
...with the argument many have made...
...oh... well... if it doesn't bother me... it's OK.

Well sooner or later...
...it will bother you... and then, by that time... it's too late. (e.g. abortion)

Today, it's... 'sodomy' is OK... (in private)
tomorrow, it will be 'sodomy' is OK (in semi-private)
later... NAMBLA... will argue... it's OK to marry
later... beastiality... will have to be OK...
... after all (it doesn't bother others) since it is consensual.

Some will say it will never happen...

...look at history...
...everyone said euthaniasia will never follow from abortion!... it has... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

There are reasons for absolutes...
...the alternative of the 'slippery slope' is NOT a choice.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Jim/NSR

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">NSR:

"Big time minority opinion here!!!"</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Don't worry, as more people post their opinions you'll be in the majority, and you won't have to wait 2Long.

<small>[ July 16, 2003, 07:44 PM: Message edited by: T00MuchCoffeeMan ]</small>

I wasn't going 2 come in here, but I thought I saw my name...

Then I realized that it's not my real name anyway, so maybe I shouldn't come in here after all...

...but now that I'm here, I'll answer the 2uestion.

My W is not my sex. So, I guess, in my case, I would have 2 say that I'm against same sex Ms. More specifically, I'm against Ms. I'd prefer 2 keep the one.

Oh, but you were talking about "in general" or "other people." Well, that's them, this is me. Whatever boats your float, I guess. I can't tell others what 2 do.

-ol' 2long.
P.S. Can we all agree on "same species" marriages as okay?

<small>[ July 16, 2003, 08:02 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

2ble post!

<small>[ July 17, 2003, 10:36 AM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

There is a movement that is getting some momentum that says that an adult can love a child sexually if that is the way that person wants to show "love" to this child. Will pedophiles have rights too? Will their "choices" be legalized?

Who will draw the line and who judges what is right or wrong? SOMEONE HAS TO.

I believe God made man and woman and they are to be one flesh in marriage. I STILL believe that marriage between a man and women is God's perfect plan and that this marriage is the foundation of our society. Good families make a nation strong. Our foundation is fractured and anything but strong....I believe that making homosexuality legal will further destroy the family.

Homosexuality is sin just as adultery is sin and drunkenness is a sin----A sin is missing the mark and not obtaining God's best. Sin is called sin cause it HURTS the sinner.

I work with and know homosexuals and I would not hesitate to be kind and respectful to them just as I have chosen to be caring, kind and respectful to my adulterous H but I will NEVER accept what my H has done as right. Any sex outside of M is the wrong kind of sex.

TW

Last night, I was watching the PBS presentation of "The Six Wives of Henry the Eight"...

Talk about a 'slippery slope'...

When Anne Boleyn encouraged Henry to start a 'state headed' religion...
...not only was it the demise of Catherine of Aragon...
...the slope lead to her own beheading...
...and steepend for...
Jane Seymour...
Anne of Cleves...
Kathryn Howard... and
Katherine Parr!

----------

For all of us BSs...
...was there not a 'slippery slope' the WS took...
...(even for a short period of time)...

...when the degradation of 'moral' values continued unabated?

...and the perenial argument was...
...'it wasn't hurting anyone'...

...and for some of us... that same argument continued through the divorce proceedings...
...with the outrageous claims...
...the children 'will get over it'!

----------

Don't overlook history...
Don't overlook the failings of a 'post modern' society...
Don't let the secular humanists... vanquish morality into a never-never land.

When will we really start to guide our children and grandchildren to listen to the law of nature... that is in our hearts?

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Jim/NSR