I would really appreciate any comments, theories, etc. on the words coming out of my WH's mouth...

Last week, he told me he had decided to give us time to work on our marriage and that he needed to be patient. The next day (last Thurs) when the OW called him at work (she's in another state), he told her this and asked her not to call him. They have not spoken since then. This A was the "soulmate" type.

On Sunday, I found him looking up D in our state on the internet. He said he wasn't going to tell me because he didn't want me to worry, but he wanted to be informed since he knew nothing about it. He knew I had looked into it in July when I found out she had met him on a business trip. He went on to say that he pretty much thinks everyday we are headed for D. He said he feels himself already starting to distance himself from me by not showing affection and not telling me he loves me anymore.

Tuesday night he starts up a conversation right before we go to sleep. In a nutshell, he says he knows the M can be saved if we both work on it, but he doesn't know if he wants the M. He says he thinks it will even be a good M, but he knows he'll be discontent. When I question him on discontent with what, he says the A opened him up to things that were missing between us and now he doesn't want to live without those things. When I ask him what things he's talking about, he says romance, passion, desire, etc. I told him our M doesn't have to lack those things, he says he doesn't think you can force those things. I said it wouldn't be forcing, that he felt those things for me at one time, so it would be more of a reawakening or rediscovery.

Then he brings up the idea of a separation. He said he's tired of living in limbo and maybe that would show him that he would miss me too much and be willing to have a M without those things, or it would show him he could be happy being single. I questioned him further and he admitted he'd probably see OW. Of course five minutes before that he said he was starting to let go of the idea that they would ever work out (she's M with 3 kids), and he knows she's not the answer. But apparently he still wants to see her. He said the separation was just an idea and probably not a good one.

Now, we are scheduled for a week's vacation in 2 weeks (renting a beach cottage). We're planning on taking our car in for it's check-up while we're there. My H wanted to test drive some cars while we're there (we had talked about trading in our car for a convertible if we get through this). So last night (Wed), he looks at me and says that he thinks we should take all the paperwork on the car with us when we go to the dealership in case they have a car we want. I asked him if he was serious and he said yes.

I have been attempting to do a Plan A, however, SF is my H's #1 EN and he says he's not really interested in that right now. He says he feels guilty because he wants to be with the OW and he feels a little like he's cheating on her. A few days ago I told him I knew his MO when he got scared was to pull away from me, and asked him to try not to do that. I also suggested we follow our C's advise and try to be a little physical with each other, we didn't have to dive right into sex. At which point he asked if I had started taking the pill again (I went off it a year ago when we started thinking about getting pregnant). I said I had a call into my doctor for a prescription. He said ok because we're not having sex until you're on it (we had agreed back in June that I should go on it again since a pregnancy now would not be good).

We are each in IC, we've had some joint sessions, but not lately. He admits to being totally confused and not knowing what he wants. So, here are my questions....

1. He's only a week into NC, so should I not put too much stock into what he's saying at this point?

2. He seems so convinced our M will never have romance, passion, etc, is that common for a WS to think that?

3. I can tell he is pulling away from me, which worries me quite a bit. Have others experienced this? What should I do about it?

4. I don't know what to do about the SF. When he thought he was never going to see OW again, we had started being physical again (still no intercourse). But when the possibility of seeing her again emerged (OW's H agreed to open M), my H's sexual interest in me dwindled. I'm really at a loss as to what to do here, so ANY suggestions or ideas as to what I can do or what he might be thinking would be helpful.

5. Are the mixed signals normal? I mean he's talking about separation one day and the next he's talking about buying a car.

Any comments, suggestions, opinions, or anything at all would be appreciated. I feel like I'm going crazy with the back and forth and his pessimism about the outlook for our M gets harder and harder to take.

Thanks in advance,

Trying.

It sounds like your husband is still lost about what he wants. I think it's all natural.

He's only one week into N/C so expect a lot of ups and downs. It's going to take time as he has to grieve that lose. Maybe you should both get and read a book about the grieving process. It may help both of you understand what's going on.

My only suggestion about the Sex issue. You obviously are willing and he's a little reluctant. Don't push him, back off a little, he will let you know when he's ready. Get on the pill and tell him then just take it slow.

Do you really need a new car right now along with the added financial burden?

I think you need to slow the recovery process down a little. You husband is still spinning and need to feel safe first. He's comments about moving out have partly to do with having his own space were he can go and be safe. Away from the marriage stuff. Don't be all about solving everything today have some fun.

You have a great oppertunity for the both of you on this upcomming vacation. Release some stress and build the LOVE BANK. Make it a true vacation for the both of you. NO relationship talk.

Be a teenage couple and just have some stupid fun. skinny dip at night, beach fire, get drunk, walk around half naked, breakfast in bed. Watch the sun rise or set. Just have some fun.

Trying,

This is all very normal for a WS in withdrawal. It is textbook script and not something to be alarmed about. Hopefully, he will continue no contact with the OW because that is your only hope in this relationship.

In the meantime, you can only bite your tongue, be careful not to lovebust and don't try and educate him. No pleading, no begging, just stick with your Plan A, a plan of attraction.

He is deep in the fog right now, but you want to be in good standing when it blows over.

Does the OW's H know about this? Hopefully, someone has told him because the chances of NC sticking are much greater as long as he knows. And NC is your only hope of recovery.

Where is TooMuchCoffeeMan with his 180 degree list? I think trying could really benefit from that list. TMCM, can you post it for her?

You may want to look at the "What is the FOG Theory thread. It may shed some light for you.

ABF

Your husband sounds so much like what mine went through and still is that it is scary.

The same mixed signals, same thing about wanting sex/lovemaking one day and then when he knew he was getting together with her soon, he was not reciprocating my initiations or advances.

The whole business trip thing sounds so familiar its weird. Mine made up a business trip to be with her. I discovered it though and was CRUSHED beyond belief. Now they have made it no secret of getting together.

I hope you can stay in Plan A because Plan B literally SUCKS and is unbearable for me. I have had thoughts of withdrawing Plan B and resuming contact/communication but haven't yet despite a minor slip.

I wish you luck and hope you can bear through it. Just keep building up the love bank and try not to ask anything about the OW, because I have learned that that is like feeding a plant. It you water the plant by talking about her, asking about her, then he will keep thinking about her. If you stop watering the plant, it will hopefully eventually die off in ways that he won't think of her as much. Good luck.

ABF

After the A had ended, my H even had a secret visit with lawyer I found out later!
I found out he did so after OW called and *****ed about me telling her H and mine got so mad about that.
Now isn't that nice of him to be so protective of her?
Don't go in debt for anything until your H is decided!
If your state is a community property state, he will take the new convertible to enjoy with OW and you will get half the bill!
Put the kabotz on spending right now on anything not absolutely necessary to live!
Vacation? Yes, the perfect time to be a kid again and put some of the romance and fun back in marriage. But only if he's meeting you halfway.
It sounds like he's forgetting that he has a responsibility to do those things, not just expect you to make it appear out of thin air!
If more WS put the effort into charming and romancing the spouse the way they do the OP, there would be lots of spice in the marriage.
They seem to forget when they are with OP, they do nothing but forget responsibilities and make it fun.
Now, as a wife, put me up in some fancy 5 star accommodation, take me out and I don't have to lift a finger of work, just have fun and see me smile all the time!
This is what they see with OW! They forget if they marry her, they're going to be home most of time, cooking, bills, lawns to mow, stresses of everyday life and it's not going to be one big adventure or vacation!
And yes, when he stops treating her like she's too good to lift a finger, then she's going to show her real side!
Not only should your vacation be a rebuilding time for romance, but at home you should definitely make plans to get out couple times at least a month with nothing to do but concentrate on each other!
My H told me how OW made him happy because she didn't complain or nag. I had been begging for a trip somewhere to get the two of us out of doldrums. But he flew twice to Fl and had her meet him there for two nice vacations, not even telling me how to reach him in emergency.
If he'd taken me instead, I'd have been purring like a kitten!
I needed the break deseperately, but I'd saved money on promises, which he spent on her.
Show just how much fun you can be in the same settings! And be sure to look your top dollar best!
Good luck and God bless, LouLou

Good guy, Melody, ABF, and LouLou - Thanks for your replies. I thought there was some very sound advice.

I had IC yesterday. The C said it was too early for a separation and he thought a separation at this point would lead to a divorce. I met my H after the appt for happy hour. We had a couple of margaritas, I told him what the C said about a separation, we ended up at home and in a fight about it.

It ended with him saying every day is an ordeal for him, he's losing his hair, he can't sleep, and so something has to give and he thinks us separating is the answer. This hurts even more because he knows if we separate I will be going to FL to be with family (we live in NYC). I am at my wit's end and don't know what to do. I know if we separate it will allow him to speak to the OW everyday and they will plan for her to come visit.

Is this M doomed??? Should I just give up???

trying, no, you shouldn't give up at all! First off, you should NOT be the one to move! That is the worst thing you can do. The WS, the one who wants the separation, should be the one to move. If you move, all you are doing is ENABLING the affair and making it easy for him.

Tell him that you understand he feels he needs to seperate and certainly will not stop him, but he is the one who has to move. You hope he changes his mind and dont' want the seperation, but will support him in whatever he does. THAT statement puts the ball back in his court and removes all obstacles.

Secondly, you have to quit fighting with him NOW. No lovebusters. Fighting only allows him to continue his destructive behavior and prevents him from ever seeing how crazy this all is.

Just let things calm down and start practicing a STRICT Plan A with absolutely no lovebusters. Don't give him any excuses to seperate!

Right now it is critical that you play your cards right. He knows that this affair will NEVER work but is still torn by the fantasy of it. You need to just stand out of his way and let some reality sink in. It will. Just get out of its way.

double post

<small>[ September 05, 2003, 01:00 PM: Message edited by: MelodyLane ]</small>

Thanks for your post Melody.

Unfortunately, we are in a very unusual situation. We are living in an apt (in NYC) subsidized by my H's employer. As a result, he is the only one allowed on the lease (that's the policy). I had recently finished working on my degree and am in the process of finding a job. We have no family nearby. Because of these circumstances, we've both known that if we separated I would be going to FL (literally all of my family is there).

I don't know, I'm beginning to think he just doesn't want to be married anymore.

trying, most WS really question whether they want to be married when they are in the throes of withdrawal. That is a TEXTBOOK REACTION but it blows over.

That reaction is TEMPORARY, but seperation or divorce can often be permanent. See what I mean? That is why you need to ride this out with NO lovebusters. Jump into a flawless Plan A now and don't fight with him.

Do your best to stay there and just endure his remarks with a smile. Come here and vent to US, not him, ok? This will get better if you handle it right. NO MORE FIGHTING! Just don't leave if you can help it!