//

<small>[ February 08, 2004, 02:33 AM: Message edited by: Lovely ]</small>

DG I am very sorry for the fallout of your H finding out about your A, but it doesn't take a genius to realize that his departure from your life and the kids lives was a possible consequence of your A. But I would caution you that it is still too early to find out exactly what your H is truly going to do. People in highly emotional state of mind often say things that they don't really mean. So try to keep this in mind because what you fear may not turn out to be reality.

Now as far as the OM is concerned, I beleive that he was pissed at you because your H probably confronted him with the truth. You have now witnessed firsthand the OM without his mask of pleasantness to you. You may even find out that he is far worse than your H ever was. Do yourself and your children a favor and end all contact with the OM forever.

Good luck and keep us posted.

I have to disagree with TMCM.

I think his departure is a result of HIS A, not hers.

I think everyone here needs to stop talking to DG as if she's the wayward spouse and her H is a betrayed spouse. She is both a WS and a BS, and she deserves some of the compassion that all of you BS's show each other.

Heck, her H just told her that he's leaving her for another woman and you want to tell her its a consequence she has coming?

Anyways........DG, been there done that. I think you're starting to see OM's true colors. I think you're going to get out of this A. You probably don't need all of us harping at you to do it.

I think right now you need our support to deal with your H's leaving and how to handle the kids.
I don't think Plan A or B really apply at this point, because you are ambivilant about continuing this marriage anyway. He's going to go -- if he's made that decision there's really nothing for you to do about that except wonder about the quality of a man who would leave his children.

So this is all about you. Finding strength to move your life forward for you and the kids. Time for you to put your house in order. I think you know what I mean.

Sorry Lexxxy DG KNEW that by engaging in an A of her own that she was endangering her M just like her H endangered it with his A. Her marriage is not in the best of shape and by her chosing to engage in a so-called 'revenge' A she diverted important emotional resources away from her marriage. All of this applies to her H as well, but to say that it was her H's A the sole reason for his 'possible' departure is to ignore the contribution she made to it with her own A.

DG: Wow, I'm sorry. It totally stinks when a family breaks up. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I would recommend that you put OM waaaaay back on the back burner for a while. Your life is going to be complicated enough for a while, and you're gonna need to think clearly. He is baggage you don't need to expend energy on at this point. Focus on your children.

Surely your H isn't going to just pack his backs and bail to TX without seeing that his family is settled (well, as settled as possible in the circumstances)? His/your children deserve better than that.

DG, do you have a close family member or friend (someone who didn't support either A) you can lean on thru this? Having emotional support will be important, not to mention someone you trust to help you on a pracical basis with extra child care when you need it, etc.

I've never had to deal with the issues you're facing now, so I don't have any practical advice. I would think you need to visit a lawyer pretty quickly, tho. Maybe some MB'ers with this kind of experience will jump in to help.

My best advice is to pray. "Draw nigh unto God and He will draw nigh unto you."

Lori

<small>[ October 09, 2003, 10:19 AM: Message edited by: at peace ]</small>

I'll try to answer your three questions for starters:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> 1. What the hell am I going to tell my kids??? Should they be there when he leaves to say goodbye? How should they be told? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If he makes the decision to leave, I think it's his responsibility to tell them. That's only if you feel that he can do it kindly without making them feel at fault or throwing blame around to confuse them. I don't know if you've posted this before, but how old are your kids? That will have some bearing on just how much or little they should be told. I'd start with the bare essentials then be willing to listen supportively and answer their questions.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> 2. If he calls should I let him talk to them right away? However I don't know if he will because he says she doesn't have a phone.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Unless you feel that he'll harm them, allow him free access to them within reason. To do otherwise would be unfair to them.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> 3. If he does move back in the area, should I immediately let him see them? What if he's been gone several months without contact? How much time should I allow to pass before I decide maybe he should stay out of their lives? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is too far into the future to worry about now. Make that decision IF he moves away, AND he's gone for a while, AND he moves back, AND he wants to see them. You have bigger concerns right now.

I'll be the first to admit that your original post rubbed my fur the wrong way, but I'm starting to feel a lot of empathy right now. I've never been the WS, but I have been the BS and the combination of both must be staggering. Get yourself into good IC and try to get a handle on your own emotional life before allowing H or OM to confuse things even more. You can't change either one of them. You can change yourself and they way you react to events. And your children will be much better off if you're strong and focused.

TMCM-- agreed that having an A isn't prudent and isn't going to help anything whatsoever.

However, you seem to be pointing the finger at DG. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> his departure from your life and the kids lives was a possible consequence of your A. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Doncha think that just maybe the fact that HE'S HAVING AN AFFAIR might have something to do with it?

I'm saying that its not just HER A that caused this. You seem to be the one saying that. Its my impression (and I could be wrong <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ) but you seem to be taking the stance of "gosh gee sorry but ya shoulda seen it coming"

I think at this point DG should focus on her kids and her future. And I think she should be supported just as any other BS who comes here would be, with a little compassion.

dg ... you're in a tough spot. you've gotten lots of great advice from the people here (not that you always appreciated the delivery <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ).

as i told you on your other thread, begin participating in your life and choose to save your marriage (if that's what you want).

i, too, have empathy for you.

you do know what to do. start now.

DG

I followed your other thread, but didn't think I could add anything useful to what other wise people were saying.

Firstly, I am so sorry to hear this latest news. I also want to question, did your H find out about your A too? I'm not clear on that. I think what you're saying is that he suspects, but still doesn't know but has been in contact with OW all along.

DG please stop contact with OM. This is going to be so hard for you to deal with, and do you know what, you may actually have a chance now of putting things right with your H if that is what you want, which I think you do...

It's okay DG, this is what you wanted right? Yes my head wanted it badly but my heart kept me wanting him for 14 years (when we first met) and with him for the last 6 years despite EVERYONE telling me he was no good for me.

DG, do you want him? Answer the question, and if it is yes, tell him about your A and start practising radical honesty.

2ofaKind has a great sig line about NC

"No contact isn't rocket science. Start by not contacting and stop making excuses"

OM is using you, plain and simple. Don't let him do that anymore. Have respect for who you are as a person and an individual.

DG - I think Dobie answered about the children well. Please try not to worry about that yet.

I am so sorry for your pain. Please come here to vent and people will help you if you let them.

Thinking of you in London
Lisa

BTW, just so you know, I was the FWS, and then my X had a revenge A, so understand your situation pretty well....

Lexxxy you are correct about his continuing A with the OW (of which we didn't have any evidence that it had not ended, until today) as being the overwhelming contributing reason (not the sole one) for his expressed desire for departure (I should have been more clear about that in my first post). What I wanted was for DG to take ownership of her side in this terrible situation and not to continue to demonize her H but spare her OM (who is no angel and with whom she cheated on her H prior to their marriage).

Beleive me Lexxxy that I would like nothing better than to give her H a good whacking over his head with a virtual 2x4, like I've given DG. Unfortunately he is not here and the only one I can try to help is DG. BOTH need serious IC counseling to resolve their personal issues.

And finally I also agree with you that her emphasis as well as her H's should be on trying to help the children to cope with a long term parental separation. It is THEY who are the truly innocent parties in this tragic situation and they that should be given first priority with regards to any future plans that will impact them directly.

See I'm not a totally disagreeable fellow (most of the time anyway <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ).

Lexxy maybe TMCM is pointing the finger at DG because her WS isn't a part of the MB board to thwack him on the head too! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
I do see your point though Lexxy. It seems DG's husband is using HER AFFAIR to justify his past affair and as justification to continue it as well as abandoning his family. I think BOTH DG and her WS NEED COUNSELING AND QUICK! They are both on a selfish and destructive path to themeselves and each other.

One last point to consider is that when there is a terrible secret, like an affair, there is a wall that emotionally separates both spouses. DG had an affair with the OM, when she was in a committed relationship with her H just prior to their marriage. She stated that it was a ONS and that she felt terribly guilty afterwards. DG has been carrying this terrible secret since her marriage began, and I can't help but wonder if it didn't contribute greatly to their present situation. What do you think?

I totally agree that harboring a secret and feeling quilt towards your partner harms your relationship greatly.

My H had an affair in the first year of our marriage and didn't come clean for 16 years.

I would say that is the greatest contributor to the fact that we didn't have "intimacy". That secret was a wall between us our entire marriage.

In fact it also had an enormous impact on his relationship with our son (I was pregnant when he cheated). He never had the closeness and bonding with this child because of his guilt over the events surrounding his arrival.

Secrets are no good.

DG,
I'm sorry, looks like things are pretty chaotic right now. Just want you to know I am thinking about you. The days ahead will be challening, but nows the time to start working towards reconcilliation, and if thats what you really want, OM definately needs to be out of the picture and all your energy needs to be focused on your kids(they will need you) and the M. The hope, lies in the honesty and effort you both put forward to work towards either a reconcillation or plan to go your separate ways including care and support for the kids..........

Take care and know I am thinking of you today....
mj

DG:

I'm usually not all that good at predicting the fu2re, particularly before I found out about my W's A and then chose 2 GROW, but I think I did pretty good when I said I thought he would find out about your A and that things would get ugly. I'm sorry they did, but I'm glad, 2. With infidelity, we really do grow from adversity. You already had found this site, so you're "primed" for the kind of help you can expect here. We care.

at_peace: "I would recommend that you put OM waaaaay back on the back burner for a while. "

I'll up you one. She should put OM on the back burner and then LIGHT IT. Even if her H never comes back, this guy is a liar and a cheat, and capable of shocking anger, it now seems. True colors, indeed. Not someone 2 continue a R with at all.

Please take care, DG,
-2long

DG,

Right now, what do you feel are your priorities?

I am trying to help you focus. This is not a sarcastic question.

L.

//

<small>[ February 08, 2004, 02:02 AM: Message edited by: Lovely ]</small>

DG did you read Lexxxy's post about how her H's secret of his A during her first pregnancy put up a wall between them that made intimacy impossible? Sure your H is guilty of his own secret about having further contact with the OW but, unlike yours, it has finally come to light. If his secret about HIS A was having an effect on your marriage, do you honestly beleive that the secret of YOUR A with the OM is having no effect on your marriage as well?

How can you tell your H that he has a wife that loves him while at the same time that wife is secretly having 'great sex' with the OM who is supposed to be his friend? What would you think if he said the same thing back to you? I'm sorry but you (and your H) need some serious IC(individual counseling) which is a lot cheaper than divorce.

DG there is a saying that 'insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results every time'. I suggest that you reconsider your vow of secrecy.

<small>[ October 13, 2003, 10:05 AM: Message edited by: T00MuchCoffeeMan ]</small>

DG, I hate to say it, but I advise you to get a divorce. You aren't willing to be honest in your marriage so what's the point? So that 10 years down the line you can continue to point the finger of blame at a man who is openly making dumb choices...but has no idea of the covert betrayals by his wife? You want to blame this all on him?

The way things are now, you will never have a true marriage. So make the decision to do things right....or get a divorce and allow him the freedom to possibly start over with a little more honesty. Maybe you could do things a little better the second time around too (if you ever take the time to take some responsibility for the mess you're in now).

<small>[ October 13, 2003, 09:37 AM: Message edited by: hope4future ]</small>

Of everything I just posted and talked about and everything that is happening right now, THAT is the only thing that is highlighted??

<small>[ February 08, 2004, 02:03 AM: Message edited by: Lovely ]</small>