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#2989394 12/02/03 09:48 AM
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<small>[ December 05, 2003, 01:33 PM: Message edited by: diane1223 ]</small>

#2989395 12/02/03 10:03 AM
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Hi Diane, long time no see. I was scared for a minute when I saw your thread that you and your H were having problems, I'm glad that I was wrong.

As far as links that can help your friend out, you might want to consider printing the following:

The Four Rules For A Succesful Marriage.
Marriage Builders Counseling Service.
Save Your Marriage Central .
The ENQ(Emotional Needs Questionaire) .
The LBQ(Love Busters Questionaire) .
What Are Plan A And Plan B .
Surviving An Affair's Plan B Letter .
Michelle Weiner Davis's Divorce Busting 180 Degree List .
Carolkh: A Succesful Divorce Busting Story
Notable Threads .

I hope these links can help your friend see that there IS hope to save and rebuild her marriage.

Good luck and God bless.

#2989396 12/02/03 10:30 AM
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<small>[ December 05, 2003, 04:03 PM: Message edited by: diane1223 ]</small>

#2989397 12/02/03 11:34 AM
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I see what you mean about the triggers but remember when you just arrived here about a year ago? Remember how you were like Sally, Sarie, Felina,(to name a few) going through terrible withdrawl pains? Even though you are not 100% over the OM, you are still light years ahead from the Diane of yesteryear and a couple of words from you could help inspire them to follow the best path to marital recovery. I hope that you reconsider and share your insights with these women who are in need of help.

As far as your friend's H is concerned, it sounds to me like this gentleman may be suffering from KISA (Knigh In Shinning Armor) syndrome. Is that a fair assessment?

#2989398 12/02/03 11:45 AM
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<small>[ December 05, 2003, 04:05 PM: Message edited by: diane1223 ]</small>

#2989399 12/02/03 11:45 AM
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You can also print out as much of the following as you think is helpful: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You can recover. Many people have. It isn't easy, and not everyone succeeds, but as long as you are both working on it, your chances are close to 100%. If your spouse is NOT willing to work on your marriage, is denying involvement in an affair despite the evidence, and/or is continuing an affair, read What Are Plan A and Plan B? after reading the "Basic Concepts" links below. In that case, you need to start Plan A with the help of a marriage counselor (see item #2, below). There are a couple terrific posts about Plan A that are worth reading at: Plan A, Doormats and Love Busters by Zorweb and Cerri on Plan A, which will help you avoid some of the common pitfalls. Your situation is harder, but your chances of saving your marriage and actually making it better than before are still good. But, whether your spouse is "on board" or not, you should do three things:

1.) Learn. The most important and helpful single source of information for my wife and I was “Surviving an Affair” by Willard Harley (hereinafter referred to as “SAA”) available at the Bookstore, Amazon.com, and bookstores all over. SAA is THE best book on the market for helping one get to the root of “the message of the affair” (BUT YOU HAVE TO DO THE QUESTIONAIRES!). It (along with the Basic Concepts section of this site) is also helpful for giving you a vision of what a great marriage should look like. The approach of SAA to this problem is that the best defense against affairs is to have a great marriage. My wife said we had a good marriage, but she still had an affair. She was kidding herself, but it was not until we read SAA and saw what a great marriage should look like that we could clearly identify the problem areas and had the tools necessary to fix them. So that you can get started right away, while waiting for SAA to arrive in the mail, read everything in the Basic Concepts section of this site. Next, read all the Q&A's on infidelity on this site. They are found at How to Survive Infidelity

The phrase “the message of the affair” is from the book “Torn Asunder”, by Carder (hereinafter referred to as “TA”). I personally think this is the best book on affair recovery we have read. In particular it deals with the two different paths the recovery of the betrayed spouse (BS) and the wayward spouse (WS) need to take, and deals w/ remorse in a way that I prefer to SAA. Read it together, if your spouse is willing. If not, go through it yourself. If you or your spouse has issues with control, you might also want to read “The State of Affairs”, (SOA) by Todd Mulliken, which also treats the remorse issue similarly to TA. SOA also deals with "the vision thing" for marriage, which is neglected in SAA.

2.) See a marriage counselor. This is hard. You need help. These boards are populated by amateurs. MC’s are professionals. There is a difference. They can help deal with issues the books don’t cover, and customize things to your individual situation. That said, there are lots of bad MC’s in the world. Read, and take to heart, How To Find A Good Marriage Counselor. You do not want an MC that is going to teach you how to live with an awful spouse, or how to adjust to divorce. Too many of them do, as is documented here: Hazardous Counseling. Reading that link may scare you off counseling, but it should give you some good ideas to ask a potential MC before you start w/ them, so you can avoid those that give you the wrong answers. You need one that is committed to helping couples have great marriages, and knows how to do that.

You are on an emotional rollercoaster right now, and there will be times that you will think it would be best to just divorce your spouse and go on with your life. Though there are no guarantees, recovery IS possible, but it takes time and effort. You will hate yourself if you don't do everything you can to make that happen. Give yourself the time you need.

3.) I understand that you may not be a person of faith, but for me, getting my spiritual life in order was crucial. As I said, this is hard. I knew I would need all the help I could get. Repenting of the habitual sins in my life let me stop pushing God away so I could hold on for dear life. I had to humble myself and ask Him what I had done wrong, and what I could do to be the husband He wanted me to be for his child, my wife. This was not about blaming myself. It was about doing what I could to do my part in having a great marriage. My wife could participate or not, but I had to know I had done everything I could do. It also helped me to let go of thinking about what SHE needed to do, since I couldn't control her, anyway.

You might also want to read through: WAT's Quick Start Guidelines for Betrayed Spouses, but keep in mind that these are the writings of amateurs. Get the books, read the articles, and see a GOOD counselor - you need the best help you can get.

Of course, that is just my opinions and what worked for me, who experienced it once, first hand. Harley, who has helped HUNDREDS of couples through this process, lays out his program in the following link: How to Survive Infidelity You will find that I mostly followed his plan. It works. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

#2989400 12/02/03 12:56 PM
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The KISA (Knight In Shinning Armor) syndrome affects BOTH men and women. It refers to people that feel a need to be other people's savior by dedicating too much time to help them out with their problems. While on the surface it may sound noble, it usually comes at the expense of the marriage. Not only can it lead to having an affair by the KISA but it can also end up having the KISA's neglected spouse to have an affair as well. The sad thing is that the KISA is totally oblivious to his/her maritally destructive behavior because he/she is admired by others for his/her helping ways. By the time he/she realizes what is happening it is usually too late and the damage to his/her spouse has already been done even if there is no affair. You could say that ALL of us are KISA's to some degree or other, the trick is to become aware of it and to stop it from becoming a greater menace to our marriages.

#2989401 12/03/03 01:25 AM
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<small>[ December 05, 2003, 04:06 PM: Message edited by: diane1223 ]</small>

#2989402 12/05/03 02:35 PM
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#2989403 12/05/03 05:02 PM
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