I'll be brief: my wife and I have come to the point of no return: either I stay or I go. I don't want to hurt my children and I am under no illusions as to the difficulty and long-term ramifications of a divorce. But - there is this: I am just not attracted to my wife. A lot of history there I won't go into, but that is the truth: I am NOT! It isn't weight, so she can't lose it. I haven't told her this because I fear it would be needlessly hurtful. She wants me to stay - I want to know this: based on the experiences of all of you - can a marriage be saved when one of the partners isn't attracted to the other? I so fear a sexless, loveless life. I love my wife, she has many, many attributes, but sexual attractiveness (to me) isn't one of them. THose of you who have read my previous posts know I have had an affair. I am willing to stop that if my marriage can be renewed, but I doubt it can....

Any thoughts????

Okay here comes the 2 X 4! Not really perhaps just a cold splash of water.

At one time were you or were not physically attracted to her? Surely you were before you married.

But dating is not reality. When you dated her she hadn't seen 24 hours a day 7 days a week. She was glad to see. She was full of energy. She was probably full of passion. She was dressed to kill and looking good. She was fresh and you talked to her like she was a sponge soaking up every word.

You both see each other 24 hours a day. Morning breath, sweaty after yard work, and so on. Hardly the dressed to kill woman you dated. But that is reality.

Instead of having all the time for each other there is a never end tug of war for your time. Long talks about what you want to do with your life turn to how to pay the bills and who is going to take little Johnny to the orthodontist.

The problem is you long for the fantasy. Its really was never there. Take any women you long for and marry her and sooner or later she will go from hot babe to soccer mom.

Dating was fun and exciting. Marriage is hard work and mundane. It matters little whom your partner is your spouse will have to help manage a household not hold the popcorn. She will have to spend more time dressing the kids than seductively undressing in front of you.

You need to realize that the mind is the largest sex organ. And it more than your hormones impact what is or isn't attractive.

There is nothing different about the woman you first lusted after. She always was that person. She had bad breath when you were dating. She could be moody when on her period. She had all the faults she has now back then. AND SO DOES EVERY OTHER WOMEN OUT THERE...applies to men as well.

So perhaps your mind is in need of a little viagra.

How about making a date with her. And I mean a REAL date.

Go stay at friend or relatives house the night before. Shower, shave put on cologne then drive to "her" house to pick her up..... DATE her like you use to do. Take the long walk and have the long talks. Maybe this time talk about all you two have shared. All the dreams that maybe came true. Or the wonder of seeing your first child, watching her/him take their first steps, the pride you felt as a father or even the fear like I felt when looking at such a tiny soul counting on me.

Share a few glasses of wine if that is your thing, go dancing, go to an art gallery or perhaps take in a concert together.

You can do it you let yourself. You can see the wonder of fall when the leaves are falling at your feet and in the dark with the Christmas tree all aglow you can feel like a kid again even if for just a brief second. And you can feel what made you love her all over again if try.

You see the problem isn't between your legs its between your ears. Your mind has forgotten all those things that made her special all those things that made you want her. And want her for her not just the physical part.

She is better than a fantasy because she has lasted longer and loved you longer than any fantasy.

PS

Be sure and have her home before midnight...I hear her dad can be bear if you bring her back late. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

sdfr,
Your post brought tears to my eyes. If only my H could see it like you do...

MOP

CF,

I read a bit of your story but I am not sure if you are still in your A or not. Is there NC with OW?

In my experience, (which is unfortunately considerable) until there is NC, there is little chance that you will feel a spark of attraction for her. The OW has to be out of the picture. COntact with OW, any contact, will spoil your chances of re-connecting with W.

Also, I imagine, in light of all the circumstances, that your W is not feeling very desirable and in love lately. When she feels good about herself, you and your marriage...she will be a desirable partner to you.

Decide to re-invest in her, meet her needs, ask for your needs to be met and maybe things will improve.

On a separate note, I have to think that your wife might be feeling quite awful herself these days. My H has had 2 A`s...it's all hitting me all over again. I put my heart and soul into our M...but he still cheated. Sex with H was never a problem. But I tell you...H claimed to be not attracted to me (despite healthy sex life, go figure) until the DAY NC finally occured. After that...I saw the fog and re-spinning of things evaporate fast.

Good luck, and sorry if I have messed up on some of the facts.

Keep posting here, even if I or others may be a bit harsh. I personally think it takes courage to expose your problem here.

E

My wife and I have been married 18 years. From the very beginning, I worried that even though she was smart, funny, a good conversationalist, etc., etc., that she was NOT my ideal of physical attractiveness. I convinced myself I was being shallow and that I should focus on her many good qualities. Over the years, that lack of burning desire for her has bothered me more and more. So, in contrast to the assumption some of you have made, there never has been a time when I thought she was the hottest thing in ten counties.

And, no, Eleanor, I haven't yet reached the point of "no contact." I'll never reach that point because of my particular circumstances. I can get to no affair, but not to no contact.

My wife and I have gone months and months and months at a time with no sex....not good.

c-f:

I remember your posts. You're asking the wrong 2uestions, doing this all bass ackwards.

"my wife and I have come to the point of no return: either I stay or I go. I don't want to hurt my children"

Like I've said before, many times, you have ALREADY hurt them. Time 2 end that.

"I haven't told her this because I fear it would be needlessly hurtful. "

You will come 2 the point, someday many, many months or years from now, where you will realize that the dishonesty is the more hurtful factor here, not the way you feel. You're hurting yourself by living a lie, and you're hurting your W by not being authentic with her, by not showing her all of who you are. If there is anything 2 rebuild, THAT is the way you'll find it, not by hiding your feelings.

"She wants me to stay"

She sounds like a wonderful woman.

" - I want to know this: based on the experiences of all of you - can a marriage be saved when one of the partners isn't attracted to the other? I so fear a sexless, loveless life."

And, so long as you let it consume you, your fear will own you and keep you from enjoying a truly fulfilling life.

"THose of you who have read my previous posts know I have had an affair. I am willing to stop that if my marriage can be renewed, but I doubt it can...."

It can't and I'll tell you why (though I have before): You are putting the cart before the horse. You are holding on2 your OW, keeping her in the wings. This behavior will forever prevent you from renewing your M. You are being dishonest with both your W and the OW. You are robbing them both of their birthright 2 choose their fu2res for themselves.

LET GO.

-ol' 2long

Conflicted,

Forgive my bluntness, but what you need is not a splash of cold water or even a 2 X 4. What you need is one big mother of a FOG HORN! You spent 18 years married to this woman and never found her attractive? Bull#$%t!!! You, my friend, are in a deep, deep fog and as long as you continue contact with the OW, you will be.

You say that "she was NOT my ideal of physical attractiveness." Of course she's not because the OW is soooo much more attractive. So you strung the woman who gave you her heart along until someone more attractive came along. Way ta go.

I realy don't mean those words to sound as mean as they do but I wrote them and now I'll post them. You CAN rebuild your M and your love for your W but the first step HAS to be NC. As long as there is contact, you will not find that spark for your W again. Please consider taking this important first step. And you will be in my prayers.


Best of Luck,
B

2long: I am not holding on to the OW. I have told her I am not leaving because I cannot leave my children. She is busy "getting on with my life." Am I happy? Hell, no. I am miserable. Once, before I was married, I met and fell in love with a girl who came to mean everything to me. Because of our young age (college) and circumstances beyond our control (separated by half a continent) that did not work out. I hurt like hell for a while, cried, but time performed its wonders and I survived to fall in love several more times....I expect that will happen here too - someday I will wake up and realize the OW is no longer the torment to me she once was. I know that, but there remains this nagging fear that I am wrong, that I will someday discover I was wrong and that I will be too late. But, as I said, she has moved on.

Moving: the OW has nothing to do with how I view my wife. My thoughts about her physical attractiveness predate the other woman by eight years....when I first met my wife in grad school, I thought she was singular unattractive. Her personality won me over and I tried very hard to overlook the rest. It just keeps rearing up....
save your 2x4 and bucket of water for someone else....

Ouch! Your poor wife! To be married to someone for 18 years who finds you "singularly unatractive"! Ouch ouch ouch!

Why would you do that? You did her no favours by marrying her back then, but it DOES NOT MEAN that the present situation in unsalvageable. You must cut all contact with OW...examine the reasons (the good ones) for why you love your wife...and work on a new way to connect.

Stop with this theme of not finding her attractive! The more you say it...the more you believe it! SO what about how/why you married her! get the OW OUT of the picture, and re-invent your marriage!

Your OW does have alot to do with your issues with your W.

Eleanor: Why did I do it? My answer is complicated, but I'll try to share it as best I can. From high school on, I dated very pretty girls...cheerleaders, homecoming queens, sorority girls, the whole bit. At some level, I think I am good looking, but I generally am very insecure about that, which perhaps explains some of my behaviour. When I met my spouse, I had just stopped dating (mutual decision) a very pretty, but not so bright girl. I wanted a smart girlfriend, a smart wife. My wife was a classmate in grad school and was obviously very, very smart. That attracted me and I also was trying to convince myself that I was not someone who would refuse to date someone just because they weren't beautiful. As I spent more time with her, I truly did fall in love with her, so much so that I became scared about how her looks still bothered me. I made what I now consider to be one of the great mistakes of my life: I told her I was worried about it. I have often regretted that, because I know it was a hurtful thing to her. I don't like hurting her.

I know the philosophy here is "radical honesty" but if we make it, I don't want her carrying around any more junk in her head that she already does.

You have no way of knowing this, but most people who know me think I am a really nice guy. I sure don't sound like it here, though. I sound like a selfish, inconsiderate jerk.

Why did I do it? Have I helped explain at all?

Hmmmm, interesting.

I am tempted to refuse to even begin a discussion about the reasons behind the choices you made 18 years ago...because I think nothing is going to get you to think straight until you accept that OW is still, even if you are not actively having an A, a big part of the problem. We can explore the reasons behind your choices until we are blue in the face, but I suspect you will keep coming back with the same mantra...all because you are still in a fog.

Nevertheless, I think every one realizes, at some point in their marriage, that they made lifelong choices based on issues that were important when we were very young! You were on the rebound from one person, and you defined things a bit simplistically for yourself...you thought: smart girl=unnatractive package.

Just because you have now grown up to find that totally untrue, does not mean you cannot re-discover you W, and stop this incessant refrain of yours. I am sorry but unless she has 4 heads and 8 legs (NO OFFENSE to those who do! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ) I simply cannot accept what you are saying. I am convinced that when you put aside the ow, stop with this false debate, and steep your mind and heart in the strength and goodness of this woman...you will feel something.

I am more concerned about your W right now...how is she?

c_f:

"And, no, Eleanor, I haven't yet reached the point of "no contact." I'll never reach that point because of my particular circumstances. I can get to no affair, but not to no contact."

Yes you can get 2 no contact. What particular circumstances? Likely no more "particular" than anybody else's that's done it.

and

"I am not holding on to the OW... ...there remains this nagging fear that I am wrong, that I will someday discover I was wrong and that I will be too late. But, as I said, she has moved on."

So, you're holding on2 her and she's moved on. Why not let go of her yourself? COMPLETELY. Until you do, "holding on2 the OW" is precisely what you are doing.

-ol' 2long

Eleanor, before I reply, let me say this: you write really well.

My wife is a remarkable woman. I lay in bed with her last night and sobbed. I know most women would have spurned me long ago (OW would in a flash were the situation reversed) but she hangs in there, trying to help me deal with all of this. I do sometimes think she is more concerned with financial security (she hasn't worked outside the home since the birth of our first), but, whatever her reason, she has been steadfast. She told me last night that she sometimes hates the things I do, that she sometimes thinks of all the ways in which she could get back at me and the OW, that she sometimes hates herself for putting up with all this, but that, in the end, she does not want me to leave. I hardly understand that - I am not THAT wonderful!

And yes, OW is a part of the problem now - she is very, very attractive. I recognize that, but truly, she wasn't a part of the problem 18 years ago. That has been my point: my difficulties are long standing, exacerbated now by the OW, yes, but still, longstanding. Like your husband, I have "freakin' issues...."

This just doesn't sound right at all.Something else is going on with you conflicted and I have to think(psychologically) what it is that is raising a flag for me.

You fell in love with your wife,"so much so" that you were scared about how her looks bothered you? This just doesn't add up.People are not so much in love and then stop to think,well she really is unattractive though.Just doesn't add up in my mind.

And from your other posts on the other board,here you have stated that you HAVE told her about affair.

O

October:

Un42nately, for ol' 2long it adds up just perfectly.

His W's beauty, or lack thereof, is not the issue.

c_f is rationalizing his inability 2 CHOOSE one woman and GRIEVE the lost alternative. He can't have 2th, and he wants 2th. That's the issue.

-ol' 2long

October: well, people may not, but that is exactly what I did...

2long: you are right, I want the OW, I want my children happy, and I want to avoid all that goes with a divorce. No way to do all that and trying to reconcile that creates a GREAT deal of internal conflict.

conflicted_father, I am sorry to say this but you are indeed very shallow. You have been blinded by the excitement of another woman over someone who has steadfastly stood by your side for 18 years. Why are unfaithful spouses so unfair to find all sorts of excuses to justify their horrible actions. I suggest you consider how you have been blessed and do not be so ungrateful. Have you considered how would you feel if the situation were reversed? Put yourself in the other person's shoes before you take actions like those you have taken.

2Long,

I have been posting to conflicted on another board(divorcing I think?) and agree that outwardly the OW would seem to be the main issue but I also am thinking about his view of women in general and all that pyscho babble stuff has my wheels spinning. This goes back further than when he actually got married,as he admitted to(in other posts).

Insecurities and his preference for these really attractive type of women but wanting a "smart wife" are what I am "looking" at.Affairs are never just affairs either.It is a deep seeded problem that only through professional help do most of us really get to what it is that made the A happen.That's why I think there may be more to this.

This man has admitted to "falling in love" ,"several more times" and I wonder if he is a serial realtionship type that is always looking for that emotional "high" we get from new experiences.His double life has allowed him the comforts of a wife and also the excitement of the OW so he has not dealt with those issues until now.IMHO.

As Dr.Phil states,"it is humanly impossible to remain in that stage..." the first stage of love,falling in "love" or infatuation.

Conflicted,your lack of "burning desire" and being bothered by the no sex for months was correlated with you being in the midst of the affair,you can see that right? It also goes to show you that most likely,correct me if I am wrong,any attempts to enhance your marriage and make it still exciting to be in were not done but were made in direction of the OW.SO then your wife may have become disinterested in the M too and then you both went down that sipral to where you are now.

This attention to the attractiveness of your wife and comparing her the this OW and perhaps past relatonships should be another area to explore more.

Ok,enough already. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

O

I get the impression that you are still in the midst of the A at some level. If so, then I will guess that you are doing what my WW is doing. That is, putting your Romantic time, effort and money into the OP and neglecting your spouse.

Given that situation is it any wonder that the OP looks romatic and sexy while the spouse looks drab?

I deeply love my wife and I will rejoice the day she recommits to our marriage.