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#2994595 08/27/01 06:52 AM
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Rick37 Offline OP
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This past weekend, wife went with kids and OM to her sisters wedding. According to the kids, mommy, [slimeball], and the kids stayed in one cabin. Mommy and OM slept upstairs together, and the kids downstairs. I asked if they cuddled in the morning, because that is an everyday occurrence at our house. Son (5.5) said "yes, two times". I asked if mommy was alone in the bed, and he said no, [slimeball] was in it too.<P>What do I do?<P>Call a lawyer, call wife and give her a blast, nothing, call slimeball, write his parents, disclose all evidence just so she doesn't think this is hidden anymore.<P>Those that know me might remember the details.<P>I'm sort of in Plan B, there has been some communication.<P>I really have no interest in this pathological lying, deceiving, immoral, selfish woman that I married. She makes me sick.<P>So anyway, what do I do with this latest development. Kind of immoral don't you think?

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Absolutely immoral - even more so with kids of that age.<P>I can't be sure of what's the best action. I know that you know that the concern is the kids. How can you prevent this from occuring? Keep in mind that if you divorce and they marry, nothing can stop it. It will be legally "moral".<P>I guess Rick, you should consult your attorney to see if there's anything legal that can be done. Blasting her or OM won't do anything, I suspect. Writing his parents can't hurt, can it? In my opinion, protecting the kids takes priority over all potential LBs and manipulative actions.<P>I know you're a terrific Dad. So you know not to put your kids in a position of feeling caught between you and your alien. Remember, you're on the moral high ground.<P>Dave

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Rick, another thought.<P>Perhaps consider appealing to her in a constructive, non-accusing manner. Explain your concerns about the kids. I don't really expect it will do any good, but it certainly can't hurt. Perhaps the best way to do this is in writing.<P>Dave

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I am sorry to read your message but it did not surprise me.<BR>Protect your children and do the best you can. I agree that you should contact a lawyer and know your rights. You have a right to find happiness and be happy in your life. I hope you seek it out and achieve it. Good Luck.

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Yes Rick, VERY immoral. No other word.<P>You said there's been communication altho you're in Plan B. To what degree of communication (talk of recovery?) and how frequent?<P>This kinda stuff is really hard to swallow and just sit back and not doing anything. Your children are being affected and I worry what lessons they're learning from your wife's actions, as I'm sure you do.<P>I know when my H left and promised me he was NOT going to move in with OW and then did, I came here and asked advice on what to do. Almost all the members recommended I tell him I knew and that "I felt hummiliated by his actions", which I did do.<P>I said it in a calm voice and used the "I feel" statements throughtout that convo. Within a week he moved out and got his own place.<P>Now Rick, you're suppose to be in Plan "B", right? I'm torn what to tell you to do because if you are in Plan B, you shouldn't have any communication with your wife with the exception of "kid content". And this definitely qualifies as "kid content". <P>I say make an appt with Harley and ask him. But I'm leaning toward you telling your W how you feel, in a non-LB way of course.<P>I feel for you Rick, I know how this must be tearing you apart. Please let us know what you decide.<P>Lv,<BR>Jo<p>[This message has been edited by Resilient (edited August 27, 2001).]

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Rick, it is always so difficult when there are children involved, especially young ones.<P>For me it has been one of the biggest issues. I'm not exactly sure where you are in communicating with your wife, or where she is (in her head) re: the OM. <P>You do have options, it seems. I believe that others on this forum have taken the legal steps that prevent the kids being permitted to spend the night if the OP is sleeping with the WS while you are still married and they are unmarried. I'm pretty sure that is about all you can do legally regarding "their" relationship. <P>But it seems to me that while "they" are in this searching state of mind, any rational discussion, no matter how innocuous it seems to you may not reach them.<P>I've had a similar situation due to the fact that my H and the OW have a son. My kids didn't even know why their dad left... and when I could see that OW wasn't going anywhere (I had some lamebrained thought that she would be the one to be introspective re: effects on kids... because she is a mom already to two, and supposedly a very conservative Christian) I tried to discuss some of these issues with my H.<P>He basically didn't like it. Went back into the mindset that I was screaming at him and had been for the past 15 months, when all I did was ask if he could try to see it from, say, his 12 year old daughters perspective. That she might feel embarrassed or confused about this inconsistency in her father's behaviors... He basically told me he didn't see it that way.<P>For me, that has been the last vestige of my expectation of him to go. I've just decided that I can't expect him to see it any other way. Though it seems strange to me, as you are trying to raise kids (especially teens...to wait..to think things through...to have some realization of consequences of their actions) I've had to just accept that his relationship with his kids is his responsibility.<P>It makes it difficult for me, because I still do want to try to get them to think about the things I mentioned above, but I just try to maximize my time with them. We have many in depth conversations re: life and relationships, and feelings, and difficulties, and choices.<P>I have chosen NOT to use H as an example negatively. I just talk about the issues and ways to handle them. I'm hopeful that since they are living the consequences of their dad's actions, they will see it for what it is. Not now perhaps, but hopefully in the future.<P>I can only use myself as an example because my dad did a similar thing when I was a teen. He had an affair, (no baby), but I remember how I felt. About me, about my mom and about my dad. I always loved my dad. He stayed with my mom, but stayed emotionally immature. He died young and I felt he wasted his life looking for some external thing and missing what was really important. And I didn't really respect him.<P>I'm trying very hard to make sure I do not judge my H, just behavior for behaviors sake. And even at that I do not judge per se, but try to get my kids to understand all the issues that go into choices. <P>My h and I have been separated for 18 mnths. I have no idea what is going on with he and OW and really do not want to know. I still do not believe she is the problem. But my H is much more involved with the kids and even though I question (in my head) some of his hypocritical behavior (making the kids tow the line, and follow tons of rules when he has none for himself)...I continue to treat him with respect and expect the kids to be responsible TO him. I just don't want them to be responsible FOR him. I guess that's the narrow path we have to walk.<P>Has your wife been honest with them re: her relationship with OM? OR about your marraige?? If so, I guess that is the point you have to begin talking to them about it being her choice, and that there is nothing any one else can do or say to change her mind. And always remind them that she loves them, as do you. It's sort of a process of just letting them go.

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That is a MAJOR no no!. She knows that.<BR>Do you have a seperation agreement? Isn't it usually in the agreement that there are no opposite sex sleepovers? If there is no agreement, maybe there should be one to protect your children.<BR>There is a child who attends the same school as my children. His mother has the boyfriend sleep over and he does not understand what they do together since they are not married. This is from a 10 year old. How do I know this? He told his friends at school and they are all talking about it! <BR>If your lawyer thinks that you shoudl try to reason with her then you could share the possibility that your children will tell their friends. That might give her second thoughts about pulling a stunt like that again.

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rick , it was suggested long ago that you inform his parents, by being a passive member of this horrible charade you have become a facilator, an enabler. its almost as if you enjoy the emotional pain. becoming active in self protection does not necessarily mean you engage in love busters, but if so in order to regain your mental health it might be the best think all around. you have to file, consult some law books in your public liabrary and get a grasp on the state laws where you are. if you can present her as an unfit mother it might help your situation.<BR>why worry about what she thinks, its time to talk to a lawyer, preferable one who has the inside track in the court room. it makes a difference who you chose. its finally time for you to do something . Im assuming you haven divorced her yet. if so then I have missed your posts on this situation. be strong

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Rick,<P>Talk to your lawyer.<P>Tell his parents. You could just mail a letter, & not sign it, could you have it mailed from somewhere else.<P>

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Rick,<P>I am so sorry for what you and your children are being put through. My H is saying that he will never put our son near OW. I don't trust him. <P>You are fully within your right to inform your lawyer, his family, whoever you feel necessary to protect your children. Neighbors, teachers, baby sitters can be put on notice to watch out for the W showing up with the OM to see or pick up the children. Now what is allowed inside the home out of earshot of the world. This is hard, you will need to teach your children to speak out for themselves. I know they are little, but if they know mommy and daddy, then they can be taught to know that there are not 2 daddies. No sleeping, no hugging, no cuddling, etc. around your children. If the WS and OM get married, enforcing this will be more diffdicutl, but right now you are within your rights to forbid this type of conduct. <P>Take Care, <BR>L. <BR>

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Rick,<P>Mail any letters you may want to send to any of the above parties to me and I'll send them for you. <P>Jo

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Rick,<P>I am really curious, mindful of your quote in your post:<P>"I really have no interest in this pathological lying, deceiving, immoral, selfish woman that I married. She makes me sick."<P>You have been suffering for about as long as I have. Fortunately for you, your wife has not filed. But I'm curious, did you have any inkling that your wife was ever capable of something like this? I mean the big picture. Looking back at my 12 year marriage and knowing my wife for 15 years, I knew way down that she was capable of everything she did, pure selfishness. I don't know how I put up with it for so long, but it was not an unhappy marriage. The shame of it all, as it is for you, are the children. How they can do this with babies they created out of love. My STBXW moved 3 hours away with 5 y.o. daughter to live with her slime, her BF from 7th thru 12th grades...and she's 43 yrs. old.....ouch!!<P>Anyway, you seem like a moral spiritual fellow as am I. Did you ever think your wife capable of all this cack?<P>Oh, almost forgot, good to see you're still here. You have been an inspiration to many.<P>My D should be final next week.<P>Jay<p>[This message has been edited by catamount82 (edited August 28, 2001).]

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Hi Rick. It makes me mad just reading your post.<P>Do the letter and talk to your lawyer. Your kids don't need that cra*. Pardon my french.<P>Good luck, you are such a wonderful person, I hate to see you going through this...<P>HbH

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Just an update (or lack thereof). I am deciding what to do on this and other issues that concern me, and therefore have not officially reacted to my wife yet. In addition, her behavior in any contact we have is belligerent, nasty, and foul. Not receptive to any kind of feedback.<P>So I am planning just what to do in the grand scheme of things. Nothing will change right away here.<P>Jay, to answer your question, I have to say that I did not think she was capable of this. She used to have such high morals, that it was almost too much. She was also very judgemental, but had a constantly changing set of beliefs. So, add it all up, and the fact that she can change her morals so quickly isn't such a big surprise, now that I look back. She has a pattern. Whatever she is doing it right, and there is no other way.<P>Thanks for the feedback and support.<BR>

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Rick,<P>I was wondering about you. Sorry for this turn of events.<P>What do YOU want? Reconcilliation or divorce? <P>Personally, I'd send her a message that if she is going to subject the children to the full exposure of her affair then her duty to the kids is to abstain from the behavior and file for divorce. This is over the top. No respect or judgement.<P>I thought it was understood that the affair was out in the open? At least by the two of you. If not, why not bring the parents into the equation. Sends a strong message to the OM, but does nothing for your relationship with your wife of course.<P>Trust your instincts, if it is time to file, then force her into the issue. I'm hanging in there with you.<P>Managing.

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I do not think you can do anything legally about her having the children around Slimeball. However there are some concerns that you can check with your attorney.<P>For instance how was this man dressed? Was he in PJ's, boxer shorts/briefs, or birthday suit under the covers? If he was in briefs, it might be considered indecent. If he was in his birthday suit under cover it is probably considered indecent exposer in the very least. I don't mean to be gross here but... How old are the children? I do not recall.<P>------------------<BR>He loves not who does not show love.<BR>----William Shakespeare

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Rick, I don't know your story, but I am so SORRY for the pain that this is causing you. Your children are what matter, and their mental health, also. I will say a prayer for you, and your family. I think that you should also seek advice from a lawyer about W "sleeping over" w/OM. I think is shows very poor judgement, and a lack of respect for your kids! Hugs to you!<P>Krystal

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Rick37 Offline OP
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Thanks again for the additional thoughts.<P>Zorweb, my children are 3.5 and 5.5.<P>Managing, the one year separation date is Nov. 1 this fall, and she has never "admitted" to the affair. I've stated my knowledge of it several times, but never got an admission. So whether she thinks I really know, I'm not sure.<P>What do I want? I have trouble answering that now. I cannot honestly ever see myself being with her again, because as I've said, she makes me sick right now. Lies upon lies. And I see things now I just didn't see or want to acknowledge before, and honestly, I can do much better, and have a happier life with someone else.<P>The only problem is that I don't want to be the one that officially ends the marriage, because of my kids. I have a hard time accepting that their upbringing is going to be without their parents together. If there is any part of me that would even consider reconciliation, it is purely for the kids. I no longer feel as much like I'm fighting for my marriage.<P>I'm more concerned about how she raises them in her house, because it is a zoo, they go to bed late, and there aren't any rules. I have to attempt to undo what she does.<P>

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Rick37---I agree with the others...there has to be some boundaries set for the kids sake. I would hope there is some legalities that protect children from immoral situations that add so much confusion to their little minds.<P>Be praying for their protection and well-being. You will find an answer to this---think it through and pray and press forward.<P>TW

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Rick,<P>I have an idea how you feel. My H was having sex with OW infront of the OC. When H was still living at home and seeing OW after school in the afternoons, he'd pick up OC and take him over there with him. <P>When I was caring for OC one week-end he asked me "why was dad hurting OW with no clothes on". I never said anything to my H, but it took every ounce of will power not to. But, if OC was mine, believe me I would have been on my H like white on rice.<P>I felt very disgusted with my H after that, my respect level for him went to an all time low.<P>Jo

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