After discussing what his feelings are about relocating/new job/etc. he informed me that he doesn't care what my feelings are, if I'm disagreeing with him, I'm not understanding him. If I disagree with the way he wants to live/work/etc. he doesn't want to have anything to do with me. He should be able to just come here sleep, eat, and do what he wants, then leave... If I'm disagreeing with that I must not love him very much...<P>I don't think Plan A is something I want to do anymore. I think I need to find some other solution for this. I'm tired of being on the end of his taker. How can anyone expect another person to just be there and always agree with everything they do? <P>I didn't scream Karenna, I stayed calm and tried to understand what he wanted/needed in this situation. He just wants to do what he wants and not tell me anything about it. I've had to ask about everything I've been told about this situation. <P>I really don't want to live this way the rest of my life. I'd rather be single forever than live like this - I really would prefer if he weren't here anymore. I've tried so hard and I'm hurting so bad. I can't do this anymore. I just can't. I really can't do it anymore... I don't want him here. I want him to leave and never come back. <p>[This message has been edited by seekingjoy (edited February 03, 2001).]

Hey there Seeking!!!! Remember me? Look, I have read your post three times now, and I am so sorry for his attitudue---the SOB(which can stand for Spoiled Ole Brat) or the other meaning----or hell, for BOTH. Take a deep breath, and think, what am I going to do for ME tonight---and go do it! Take a break from the battle and do something for just you. Love ya DC Tomorrow, will be looking for a report on what you did.

DC - - <P> For ME??? HUMMMMM I'm rearranging the room my four kids share - so we can find the BED again. Actually, the boys had friends over, and they destroyed the 'organizational order' in there... so The girls and I are reorganizing - and hopefully rearranging for more space - TONIGHT.<P>I suppose that is for me. It's actually something that I've needed to do for a while - and it will solve one of my stressers. <P>Thanks for the response! I needed to see something out there - you know? <P>

From what I have read here, it sounds like you are a very strong person.<BR>My question to you is, how have you managed to stay this long?<BR>It sounds as if he has a complete and total disregard for anything that you feel about anything. <BR>I am going to have to agree with DC here. Go out and have some fun. Enjoy yourself, buy something for yourself. Get a sitter and have a YOU day...<BR>Why do you think he treats you this way?<BR>Was someone in his life emotionally abusive to him? I would recommend counseling for him to learn how to control his inner issues. Also, counseling for you on how to manage your life with/without this man. <BR>Take care,<BR>Berta<BR>

Berta - <P>Not sure how I've managed to stay this long... I'm no picnic to live with, I'm sure, but I really don't think it's so terrible to live with me. I have many friends who seem to think I'm a nice person. <P>Kinda makes you wonder, when the one person you want to notice - doesn't. <P>The kids and I are having a great time - rearranged their room, ordered in pizza and we are watching a real tearjerker movie... We've been sitting her crying our little eyes out and laughing at the same time...<P>I really enjoy my kids. Guess that's why I've stayed... The Kids... Even though if you ask any one of them - they would say LEAVE HIM - TAKE US WITH YOU!<P>

SJ,<BR>How old are your kids? At some point in time, probably soon, your girls and your boys will need a separate room. Have you and your H discussed this?<BR>Why would they want to get away from him? Is he violent? If he is, you REALLY owe it to yourself and them to get out (carefully).

THey already NEED seperate rooms - they manage fairly well - because they have seperate areas.<P>We've discussed this - he feels it's not necessary - he shared an attic room with his sisters and brother until he left home at 16... The house he's talking about buying is only a two bedroom - he told me at first it was a really big house - but I called the realtor - two bedroom, one bath... and less square footage than here - but it's got a humdinger of a shop for his business! <P>He isn't violent. He's temperamental, verbally abusive, moody, and demanding. The kids don't like the way he treats me - as if I don't have any worthwhile thoughts or opinions - and he's more important. (That last sentence was a pretty direct quote from my 11 year old daughter.)<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>he informed me that he doesn't care what my feelings are, if I'm disagreeing with him, I'm not understanding him. If I disagree with the way he wants to live/work/etc. he doesn't want to have anything to do with me. He should be able to just come here sleep, eat, and do what he wants, then leave... If I'm disagreeing with that I must not love him very much...<BR><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Perhaps your H is from a planet even more distant than the one my H came from. <P>Well, you can honestly agree with part of what he said, don't you think? You're not understanding him. Yes or no? (I don't) Perhaps there's something you can work with here. Agree with him. Tell him you support his decision to move to another town. It's his decision, and you have decided to respect and support that decision. It's not your desire to hold him back. You want to believe in him and see him succeed at his dream. <P>Then let him go. When the time comes for you to inform him that you're staying, ask him to have the same respect for your decision that you have for his.

LH -<P>I like that idea - first one I've really seen all day that makes sense... Think I'll try it - and see if he goes for it. I hope he does. I really do.

I partly agree with LH. It is my humble opinion that you should not make any decision until you have all the informaion. Neither agree or disagree. Tell him you will decide when you understand his feelings about moving. <P>This can be a crossroad. Your struggles with him are due to his lack of communication. His own internal struggles seem to reflect a lack of his own acknowledgement of his feelings. To communicate with you in a way that will allow you to understand him he has to get un touch withhis own feelings first. When he dos this, I think he will have a different perspective on the move. Maybe you will too.<P>I am not suggesting you be manipulaive and make promises that you will give in if he communicates. Just be assertive. If you move again, it will be because it is necessary for him to cope. You cannot make a decision whether to do this FOR HIM until you understand the emotional motiviation for him moving and have explored ALL other coping alternatives. <P>Simple.

HH - I agree - I think this has been the whole problem. I can't get to the bottom of his feelings until he does - and communicating feelings with him is really difficult. He only responds to logic, and that only if it isn't contrary to HIS logic.<P>I hope that makes sense to you. It doesn't really make sense to me - but I've seen him in action - so...<P>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Happy_Hus:<BR><B>You cannot make a decision whether to do this FOR HIM until you understand the emotional motiviation for him moving and have explored ALL other coping alternatives. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Even when you decide that you actually do "understand" his feelings, emotions, thoughts, logic, reasons or whatever about the proposed move, that doesn't mean that you will, should, or ought, to choose to move with him. When you are secure enough within yourself you will become a steady rock against which he can either stabilize himself, secure himself to in a relating sort of way, or shove off from.<P>You DESPERATELY need to get a handle on some basic relationship concepts, such as learning to discern WHO OWNS THE PROBLEM. As long as you keep handling his problems (including the one of you being a different person than him) he isn't going to be any nicer. Don't do ANY of his jobs. Let that door flap. Don't cover for him or excuse him.<P>May I recommend some serious counseling for yourself? You need to understand more about why you are his needy enabler. Why you are so desperate to have this loser love you that you fall all over yourself giving in to his selfish demands? You can't get to the point of POJA until you know your own mind.<P>Meanwhile, read Boundaries in Marriage. If you can't make sense of it now then get some counseling until you have enough understanding of yourself that it does make sense. <P>I don't think you are that far in the fog though SJ. You understand quite a bit and maybe just need a little courage. Plan A is a way to start. Not a way to finish. You have been both playing doormat, from the sounds of things, and conducting an imperfect plan A with some screaming at times.<P>Go reread What are Plan A and Plan B and read it narrowly, with strict construction. There is NO SUCH THING as an emotional need to have your spouse agree with you on everything. That is a different beast, not an "emotional need" as defined by Dr. Harley. <P>Sometimes, the end result of a successful Plan A is the significant growth of the practicing spouse, and departure of the withdrawn one because they refuse to grow too. You can't force anyone.<P>Hope this helps a bit.<BR><P>------------------<BR>A true friend is one who not only is willing to love us the way we are, but is able to leave us better than he found us.

Karenna - <P>No - I'm not that far into the fog - thanks for the slap upside the head though... I've read boundaries... The last five years I've grasped everything I could find - because I don't want the kind of relationship that I've slipped into here. I don't want my kids influenced in this way. <P>I know why this happened... I had one abusive marriage, which I thought I'd gotten past, counseling - etc... seemed to do the trick. I married again - and it's like I exchanged physical for mental abuse... but I didn't even recognize it, at first. By the time I did recognize it I was expecting a baby - my goal in life was to be a wife and mommy... Great goal - I just found all the wrong Daddies! <P>I really hate divorce, and after one, I promised myself I wouldn't get another one - well - somehow that promise is about as far from being a promise I can keep as the idea that I would go out and buy the winning lotto ticket tonight. I'm more apt to get the winning ticket.<P>This marriage is such a joke - I'm not even sure I can call it a marriage. Desperate - is a good word for it --- I've been desperately avoiding Divorce Court for eleven years. <P>He's standing in my kitchen doing dishes - because he knows I'm furious with him, and he's abliging me by cleaning the kitchen... Well, it's too late. I used to want to share household chores with him. Now he's doing it because he betrayed me and ignored me, so he thinks if he does things for me, he can get around the conversation and relational things. I tried a conversation yesterday - what a joke. I was talking he was walking - out the door - again - because I had the audacity to dissagree with him. I tried again this morning, but he had to go fishing with his 'friend' - well, he showed up at the wrong place, without realizing the kids and I were there and his 'friend' is a couple of jerks, who have done everything in their power to undermine our relationship - what little of it there is, and he feels 'justified' to hang around them - because they are the only 'relation' he has that 'like him'. I can't imagine why? <P>Why am I on the computer - because when I tried to talk to him - he gave me 'silence' as a response. So, I'm not punishing him, I'm waiting out his 'silence' which will last until he leaves in the morning. He will be gone for a week, after which he will return and I'm supposed to go to a business convention with him over Next weekend - play the nice little wife and be attentive and loving while he gets his rewards and bonuses. <P>Last year - the same thing happened. If I refuse to go - we stay home and he blames me for staying home - if I go - he plays mr. wonderful husband and life happens. <P><p>[This message has been edited by seekingjoy (edited February 04, 2001).]

It is really hard not to LB when he is doing the silent thing. The normal reaction would be to feel resentful and to do something that would express this resentment. Is this how you ae feeling now? <P><BR>you have been down this road many times before. I am sure you are familiar with his silent behavior and have had feelngs similar to the ones you are experiencing now. How have you coped in the past? How do you usually react to his "silent" behavior? <P>Whatever your normal reaction would be, he is expecting it. What could you do different to break the cycle? How could you react that would be both positive and diffferent than before? <P>The strategy here is to demonstrate that the issue of moving is different this time. Use every means to reinforce this - BUT, always keep the reinforcements positive. Never give him the chance to play the victum. <P>Also use every opportunity you get (including next weekend) to play the "concerned" wife who really cares about how he feels. Make it blatently obvious you are waiting for him to share feelings with you AND also make it obvious that under no circumstances will you do anything to take advantage of him if he does allow himself to be vulnerable. <P>Being vulnerable scres him.

HH - sorry - but after tonights discussion - I think being HUMAN scares him... I'm not sure how to survive this - I'm just crying and praying tonight. <P>I don't think there's anything to base a marriage on - I posted a lot more on another link. I don't think there's enough of me left to find who he is and make him SAFE enough. I cna't live with what he wants. I dn't even want to.

I thought it was JMV-but I see her last child is named Dunn (whomever this is) so I am wondering who is saying al lthese ncie things about me?
I cannot figure it out!
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Carina ---

How in the world did you find THIS post to bring it back to the top? And WHY?

Funny thing is --- of all the posts I've ever written - this is probably the epitomy of how I'm feeling right now... about my former marriage ---

he sent me a check for my birthday - dated on my birthday which was more than a week ago - but posted October 7th... HUMMMMM a bit too little a lot too late???? I find it strange that now he sends me a check for my birthday - when we were married saying happy birthday was too difficult for him to say.

The note he enclosed is just SOOOOO emotional too... "Jan for you on your Birthday L" + his new phone number - as if I'm going to use it? HUH? He never wanted to hear from me when I was married - his war call for 12 years was "LEAVE ME ALONE" so I finally get the idea - and do so - and NOW he can remember my birthday... Dysfunctional is the only word I can think of to discribe him?

Jan

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