Very simply..

If they thought everything was just peachy between you and Stanley during your affair..which they must if what you claim is correct [and I don't buy it for a minute..people really are not as stupid as we appear to the average WS]..so there is no reason for OM to think that NOW you are genuinely doing well..or that Mommy would know the difference.

This is why OM might think you were still pulling the wool, so to speak.

I think WAT is dead on.

So let's stop worrying about what OM thinks..who cares..he is of the past tense. Let's worry about what Stanley and Myrta think.

Exposure for you..is not about punishment..it's about power and dignity. Maybe you aren't far enough out of the hole to realize this yet. In any case..your blase acceptance of OMs presence in your family life would be bleeding me dry of any residual affection were I your spouse..something to think about with regard to protection of your marriage. It probably needs less protection from OM that it does from the two of you. It was ever thus. Have the two of you made any effort to seek aid in breaking your destructive cycles?

Noodle

WOW Stanley,

He sounds like a real whack job. Maybe you should be more concerned with the stalker aspect of this than I had presumed <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> YIKES! and..eww.

I'm telling you there are more similarities than you care to admit with our situations.

OM also "pretended" FWW was his W even telling his out of state mother such and refering to her in all communications using his last name. He also told people at his work that he was adopting my children.

You asked if 7 months was a long time for him to carry on like this. FWW has had NC for 7 months and about a month ago OM had a mutual friend of his and my W's e-mail FWW and tell her that he had committed suicide and had left a note saying it was her fault. Not sure what exactly he wanted other then some response however, a check with the police confirmed it was a hoax.

Please both of you be careful.

NOODLE- i THINK the biggest destruction to some marriages in this forum, is to follow the advice or commands that People like you give them!!!
You never know what really is in the person's mind to give people with marital troubles this kind of advice.
Exposure equals Dignity? Dignity to whom??
My husband and I are going to be seen by people in a completely different light.
Lots of people here love to vent everything that goes on to the world!!! We have never been that way. Every small or big problem in our marriage or with our kids, we try to work thru it ourselves, we did not go running to Mommy and Daddy and friends and Pastor to guide us and solve it for us. They usually got better on time.
I always said, only DEATH is unfixable. Everything else has a solution,a mending, a fix.
Exposure in my oppinion is not solving anything here. Its just bigger pain, and embarrasment for my husband,first of all, then myself, then our children.!!!

Myrta

Myrta,

This situation may indeed be fixable. But...to fix it, you're going to need the right tools. Time alone probably isn;t going to be enough.

The experience of a lot of people here has been that exposure works. It's a powerful tool. Sure, it's not to be used lightly. But..there are times when it is necessary.

Your parents and your kids are going to have to understand that you don't want anything to do with this guy. Only THEY can put him off at this point.

If you don't want to tell them you had an affair, that's your business. But....you need to tell them SOMETHING. The money thing that someone suggested is a good place to start.

Myrta and I do not want exposure. We are in full agreement in this issue.

I still think we can solve this, but I like the idea of getting different opinions. I feel that if Myrta keeps up her good work and maintains NC the OM may eventually give up.

If he makes contact again I will place a phone call to OM and will try to make him reason in a pacific way. If that does not work then I will know he is a true wacko and who knows?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">and refering to her in all communications using his last name </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ouch, OM did that with regularity.

<small>[ December 29, 2004, 01:29 PM: Message edited by: Stan-ley ]</small>

Myrta and Stanley,

Please calm down. Myrta this is far too important for you to go off have cocked saying something like "alright I will tell and then I will leave the marriage." That kind of emotional reaction just will NOT help anyone or anything. So STOP IT NOW.

I don't really understand how this conversation has gotten to where it is. It is not clear that Myrta and Stanley (now known as M&S) have to disclose anything because the basic homework has NOT been done. You have not seen a lawyer. You have not talked to the police. You do not know your options. Once you have done all of the above, only THEN can you really consider your options.

So lets STOP with this nonsense of running off of the cliff. John Madden (football announcer) has a great saying: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Don't roll out the hose until you know where the fire is. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You all are rolling out the hose before you know where the fire is.

What is known is the following:

1. He has taken up an relationship with Myrta's family AFTER the affair.

2. He has contacted their daughters several times AFTER the affair.

He may be playing games. He may be desperate as Buttercup says. But he also may be dangerous.

Dangerous?? How?

1. He could have malicious intend toward her family. He has hired one of her relatives and thus now controls that persons economic fate. He has contacted the daughters.

2. He could be trying to simply breakup the marriage and from Myrta's rather ill-considered response he may be succeeding. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

3. He may be seeking revenge by FORCING M&S to reveal the affair to the family thus doing something HE KNOWS will hurt everyone and thus make them feel like he may feel.

How do you address these things? Well first you gather together all of your options and then you start applying them in a progressive manner, with M&S revealing the affair being toward the end of the options.

Myrta I must say I am disappointed in some of your responses. I know you are a strong woman, a smart woman, and THE woman your H wants in his life. You are also a good mother. NOTHING you have done has changed any of that. So quit acting like a fool and start acting like the woman you are. You and Stanley and your whole family will survive this no matter what everyone finds out. BUT, the goal here is to do it with a little damage as necessary. It is time you two found out your options.

Further, someone made what seems to me to be a very reasonable suggestion, tell your mother and family that you would prefer that they NOT socialize with this man. You don't have to divulge your reasons. You can certainly tell your D's not to accept an communications from this man and to tell you if he does contact them.

Please you two calm down and collect the information you need, then lay out a course of action that protects your family. Start with the simple stuff and progress as needed.

However, Myrta please please realize that your children, your family, your H loves you not because you are perfect, but because you are simply yourself. Hasn't your Husband proven that to you???

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

Myrta:

My goodness.

Sorry you have So much anger.

Hey, this is YOUR life.
If you Don't want to expose.....then don't.

Just keep this in mind:
This thread is calling out about an xOM that is keeping himself "IN" your family and IN your lives.

Hence the advice:
Exposing Him is simply the easiest, fastest and MOST effective way of getting this person OUT of your lives. For Good!

YOUR fears are the SAME fears that have been thought by Almost everyone that has had doubts about exposing (to OPS, to employers, ect). Myself Included!!

However, almost too a person.....after doing so.....they wished they had done it SOONER.

Once this bum is gone for good......you will too.

Again, if you don't want to expose then don't (no one here can Make you).

ON the other hand......if you won't do something as simple as exposing the truth to get rid of the OM, then you kind of loose your credibility in coming on here and crying that you DO want him gone.
(This is not an attack....simply stating how it appears from the outside).

Its unfortunate that this man won't just go away on his own. It would be nice if he would....but this is the reality....he's NOT.

This is where there are consequences to YOUR actions.

To get rid of him, this must be done.

If he was going to go away quietly......do you think he would have made SUCH an effort to get "in good" with your family???

Unless pushed.....this guy isn't going anywhere (or if he does, could SHOW back up at ANY time).

HIS "reasons" are irrelevant and your wasting your time trying to figure him out.
Don't try to find reason with an unreasonable person.

Do your entire family a huge favor...Expose him, get rid of him and let him go live his life and you can get back to living yours.

If you choose not to reconsider, then don't be surprised when you are living your life on this OM's terms and NOT your OWN! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

This is a general question, I think. But it seems to be related to Stanley and Myrta's situation.

If S&M don't expose and the guy continues to do what he is doing...who should the next contact come from?

The initial NC letter, as I understand it, should come from both the H & W. But...in a case like this, who makes the next move? If Stanley contacts the guy, I think he does so from a point of weakeness. If Myrta contacts him, as I said earlier, I think a door re-opens, at least in the OM's mind.

(And knowing as little as I do about this situation....I still believe that is the OM's ultimate aim here, to goad Myrta into confronting him, so he will have another chance to plead his case with her.)

Absent exposure, should the next move likely be a legal one..i.e. a letter from a lawyer?

By the way...IF this OM was NOT forcing himself onto your parents then I would agree that there would be NO need to tell them anything.

Unfortunately, that is NOT the situation.
Sadly, He is "worming" his way into your family.

As stated by others, you have no idea of his reasons or even state of mind.
All we DO know is that he's doing this POST A, so the reasons are NOT above board.

Only problem here is IF this guy has "ulterior" motives (probable).....your parents have NO IDEA that this person is the way he is.....or why they are being involved in all this drama.
Heck they don't even KNOW there is any drama.

They should be forwarned....so they can choose to see through the deception and put an end to it themselves.

How bad will you feel, when you have to tell them the truth later on down the line.....and admit that you PUT them IN this siutation.....all because you didn't want to look badly in their eyes for some of your past actions??
Will that be a hollow admission or what? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

TOP ROPE--I agree with you in exposure when the affair is still going on. When the WW or Wh keeps on having the affair. Of course EXPOSURE will be the best tool!!
But for crying out loud, Our DD was almost 7 months ago. EVerything was going pretty normal in our relationship, and now just because he is talking to my parents thousands of miles away, I have to all of a sudden tell my children, my parents, the newspaper,etc. Thats just plain CRAZY!!!!
THERE are have to be other ways to stop OM, exposure should not be an option at this point.

And yes, I am very angry, that this action from OM, has put everybody here against me like I was the one telling him what to do and when to do it.
That was his decision, I have no CONTACT with OM. I am trying to make my husband as happy or more than before the Affair. But if actions that take place thousands of miles away, that are really nothing dangerous, are going to put him in such a state, then I guess our marriage has nothing going. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Thank YOU

Myrta

Like I said before, my mom has very fragile health, heart problems,pulmonary edema, high blood pressure, plus other things. I am not going to bring this great horrible problem to her life right now. She does not deserve this from me or anyone.
The OM has been to her house twice in the last 6 months. Brought her coffee as a christmas gift and left. OM knows how much he will hurt me by doing that, we talked about that. He is not going to tell them anything.
Like Andrew said, he just wants me to call him, so I can open the door again. And I am not planning to do that. But my husband open the door somewhat by writing the e=mail, and also gave him ideas that the marriage is not going as well as he wrote. Because if it was, he would have not written the e-mail!!!! He should trust Me and our Marriage more than what the OM is doing so far away.

Myrta

myrta,
IF the OM had simply went away, I agree no more exposer......See above.

Also, NO ONE is saying go to the newspapers or to anyone else NOT currently involved in this situation.

However, your parents ARE Now involved (not your choice or your fault)....but it is a reality.

Indeed, If you want the OM to remain in your lives....then continue with your current plan (Or non-plan as it seems).

If you don't.....then it looks as though you will have to take some actions you didn't (and still don't) want to.

The choices may be uncomfortable......but they are yours.
Hope you choose wisely.

***************************
I also don't understand the concept of -- "the OM may be dangerous enough to have to call the law on"..........but they shouldn't WARN the parents of this fact while they are pursuing it?
Whats that about?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

<small>[ December 29, 2004, 02:06 PM: Message edited by: top rope ]</small>

If I put myself in the shoes of Stanley and Myrta`s family I would be LIVID to find out that they "allowed' this weirdo to infiltrate the family as he has. I would be furious and disappointed that they did not look out for my safety and warn me.

I would be much more upset about this aspect of the scenario than I would be about a family member having an A. An A is a personal matter but this has gone beyond that...this wacko could be a threat to the wellbeing of family members. They have a right to know about the situation so they can protect themselves.

This man`s behaviour is not normal and I am astounded that the safety of all the family members is not top priority here.

People can and do forgive A`s all the time...however I am not sure that harm that was caused to a family member because someone was worried about their reputation could ever be forgiven.

Myrta,

I am curious..why are you so confident that the OM won't expose you? You said that you told him how much that would hurt you. But...why should he care at this point?

As I've said, I think this is a trap. But...I also agree with those who say that right now, the OM is holding ALL of the cards.

He has the POWER to expose you. That's a great position for him to be in.

For all we know, that is his end-game. You may be right and he may eventually realize that it's over and you won't be coming back to him. But at that point, who's to say he won't go out in a blaze of glory and take you with him?

Obviously, self-exposure would solve that problem. If that's off the table...I'm not sure what the solution is.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">From myrta:
But if actions that take place thousands of miles away, that are really nothing dangerous, are going to put him in such a state, then I guess our marriage has nothing going.

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Please don't put this on Stanley.

Its YOU that needs to swallow your pride and "remove" this OM from your Entire family.

(Remember YOU brought him in....NOT your H or your parents).

It seems that your MORE concerned about Exposing Yourself......then about anyone else in this situation (including your H and his feelings).

In addition, Don't expect Stanley to EVER "get over" this .....as long as this OM is "allowed" to remain in any way connected to your family.

This is soooo highly disrespectful to Him.....that if you don't understand it......then NO amount of "explaining" will make you "get it".

In any case,
Hope your solution works out for you.

Myrta,

Not trying to flame you, but I just have to say this.

You say your kids (mostly adults you said) don't have a clue about your A, but that now the OM is IM'ing them. Do you not think your kids are intelligent enough to figure it out on their own? My kids are all teenagers and knew something was wrong!

I think that you not wanting to tell your kids not to speak to this creep is saying volumes about how little you think of your own children.

As far as not telling to spare your H any embarrassment...thats a load! Your H did NOTHING wrong!!!!! People (including your kids AND family) WILL see that. So as far as not telling to avoid Stanleys humiliation, thats just a crock. You're not telling to avoid YOUR OWN embarrassment.

As to not telling your Mother because she is sick...think how upset she'll be when OM lets it slip what you did. Yep, that will be much easier for her to take than her DAUGHTER coming to her and saying, "Mom, I've made a horrible mistake, but we've worked things out and our M is better than ever. please don't speak to OM, as he is trying to insinuate himself into my life again and I don't want him there."

I am a Mother...I will love my kids regardless of what they do. I would be disappointed, but I would still love them and try to help them through their tough time.

My children all still love their Dad, even inspite of knowing about his A. They know Dad is human and is doing everything he can to make up to us for hurting us.

NO ONE IS PERFECT! And if you think your kids and family think you are then you are sadly mistaken. They know your faults and love you despite them. Thats what loving families do.

You need to get off your "Oh poor poor me" trip and help your HUSBAND feel safe. It doesn't matter if the OM is thousands of miles away or right next door. YOUR HUSBAND DOESN'T FEEL SAFE THE WAY THINGS ARE NOW! Stanley has tried to write the e-mail to try and take some of his power back in his own life, but all you have done in this whole thread is cry about how it will just prove to OM that he can still get to you. Well, as long as YOU won't stand up for your kids and family, then you have as good as dumped the problem into Stanleys lap. I would go MEDIEVAL on ANYONE who approached my kids and threatened them. And by sending IM's OM IS VERY MUCH A THREAT TO YOUR KIDS!

Good luck, D-day only 7 months ago, you have been doing great...good for you, now HANDLE THIS FOR STANLEY!!!

Safety First......

After reading Stanley's post at the bottom of Page 4 that gives more info about the xOM, it looks as if delusional might be a more accurate description than foggy.

Has anyone considered that maybe (deep down) Myrta fears that "exposure" will panic the xOM into thinking that she will also expose HIS secrets? Maybe Myrta IS trying to protect her family, especially Stanley, from the xOM?

I hope M&S find a way to convince everyone in the family to avoid contact with xOM. The borrowed money idea might be a safer way to do this than exposing everything.

M&S, please take JL's advice on doing your homework. I hope you will never need it, but if it comes to that you won't have much time to do the homework when you would need it. Stanley, you would be the most likely first target for xOM to take out if he is delusional and believes that you are in his way and preventing him from having "his" wife and kids. Be careful, and please do not contact him any more.

Take care

I know quite well that a delusional OM can do awful things. Shortly after D-day when Myrta was still talking to OM I made sure Myrta told OM that there is a letter in my office that is to be open if I die in mysterious circumstances. IN that letter I name the OM as prime suspect. I always look carefully over my shoulder when leaving my house to make sure OM is not watching our home. He flew into town once after D-day and i am pretty sure he knows where I live. In fact he has mailed stuff to my house.

I am concerned because my wife is a good hearted person with little or no exposure to deceiving people. OM was a very smooth talker (I guess all OMs are) with a very convincing tone. He is one of those guys who gets ahead because he bull$hits so well. She has only known one side of this man even though at times she heard glimpses of his true personality when he had to deal with other coworkers while she was on the phone.

Myrta is also a very stubborn woman and JL knows this quite well. Since she only knows the good side of OM it is hard for her to imagine OM could do something illicit. OTOH, I can see right thru OM. He is a snake----- he has all the qualities. However, I don't expect Myrta to see this right away even though she is slowly being exposed to the true nature of this man.

<small>[ December 29, 2004, 03:21 PM: Message edited by: Stan-ley ]</small>

Stanley doesn't seem to want this exposed any more than Myrta does. Whether his reasons for that desire are acceptable to you or not, it is what it is. Please don't come down so hard on Myrta over something that she and Stanely seemed to have POJA'd.

Obviuosly M&S, self-exposure would do the trick but that's not an option for you RIGHT NOW (consider it at some time, though...don't just shelve it).

I think the money idea is good.

And finally...can't you just tell your family that this man has been stalking you? You don't have to explain why....who can explain the reasons for a stalker? Most times they don't make sense anyway. and if in retaliation the OM says that's not true, and tells them what "really" happened, you can either discount his words as the words of a stalker or you can come clean. Coming clean would be my advice at that point. But it might not even come to that.

By telling your family that he's a stalker, you are telling the TRUTH! And they may then start to minimize or cut off contact with him on their own. At that point you'll find out what the OM's intentions were all along. He'll either disappear or he'll spill the beans. At some point you both are going to find out what this man's intentions are. Wouldn't you rather be prepared for that eventuality or do you just want to REACT?

PS And Stanley..I can understand wanting to think the best of people and their intentions no matter what horrible things they've done to you. Your wife has shown what a strong and wonderful woman she is so it might be natural to think others have no malicious intent either. But don't be naive. This man didn't respect you before..why on earth would he respect your polite request now? Listen to those who have said that NC is for you too.