Hi all and thanks in advance for all help.


My wife and I separated on 1st Aug this year. We have been married 20 years and have 4 children S24 S20 S18 D11. We have had many problems in this time and have separated before (15 years ago). This first time she told me she had never been properly attracted to me but we still got back together at her instigation.

My wife was diagnosed 18 months ago withy Bipolar II. At the end of last year I noticed that she was getting very friendly with a mutual married friend. She had been advised by her Dr to try to talk to friends so it wasn't all on me to help her. I tried to push it to be with female friends but she has always found it easier to talk to men and so choose this man to confide in. I didn't feel I could complain much as this was Dr recommended. I have been studying for a professional qualification recently and this had been causing me a lot of stress and looking back had made me depressed. I lost all self confidence and started to neglect intimate conversation with my wife.

My wife and this mutual friend gradually grew closer and a few weeks before the separation I basically broke down and told her how I was feeling about her and this man and how it worried me that they were going to get together. She told me not to worry and then got angry that I was bringing up the way she behaved in the past. (The other time we split up other people were involved) I apologized and felt less able to complain but grew more concerned. Then we found out that he and his wife had separated 6 months prior but not said anything until now.

3 days before separation my wife grew depressed and told me how she had never been attracted to me in the past until the last few years which were awesome and she has been totally in love with me. (Reading his needs her needs she has the financial security need and I have only recently met this by getting a better job than before, but a few weeks before separation let her know that we were not well off and needed to watch the money. She didn't work at that point.) She also said that sometimes she still feels like shes not attracted to me.

We spoke about this a lot and got in to very intimate conversation on the first day. The next day she behaved angrily towards me and then on the final day I felt she was attacking me and so stupidly lashed out. She told me that her attraction to me had turned off like a switch and we should separate.

We agreed to not tell anyone at first but 4 days later she told this male friend. 2 weeks later I found they were being very flirtatious on FB (basically pornographic). 18 days after separation it turned physical. I confronted WW about this after 1 1/2 weeks. She got very upset and wanted to make me happier. Said she loved me but still wanted him.
Another couple of weeks later she was "falling in love with him".
She then had an episode and made an attempt on her life over me failing an exam as it was "all her fault". She called OM and had him come to our house. He made her wake me and I took care of her, with him still there. She then verbally abused me and cuddled up to him.
The next day I regret I got very angry with her and let her know how bad she had made me feel. I understand she was very drugged and not herself but it didn't change the effect it had on me. This made her feel that I wasn't there for her when she needed me and now OM was her only support.

OM STBXW is angry about the situation, we were all friends and it turned physical before she had moved out. She has exposed to all friends and relatives. I have exposed to my kids. WW feels very isolated and even more that OM is all she has. I have tried to be supportive (plan A) and address the issues she has raised, mainly love busters. WW and OM feel they have not technically done anything wrong as we were all separated before anything actually happened.

I gave my wife an ultimatum a couple of weeks ago. She can
1. stay with OM
2. Try aagin with me
3. Be with neither of us.
I said I could support her with 2 or 3 but if she choose 1 she would need to move out. She asked if she would have to end all contact with OM and I said yes. After a few days she chose 4. "I move out and do what ever I like."
She is now angry with me for giving her an ultimatum.

I am now trying plan A with more success (my head has cleared a bit) but no sign of breaking off with OM.

What should I do now. I'm finding it hard to have intimate conversations as the main things going on in her life involve the OM, how do I address this?
I dearly love my wife and want to get back to what we had or even better.

Welcome to MB. Are you familiar with Dr. Harley�s Plan A?

Who moved out of the marital home? Who on OM�s side have you exposed to? Have you exposed to her parents and your parents? What did your kids say to her? Are you involved with your WW�s psychiatric program for her BPD2?

Hi BrainHurts,

I've read surviving an affair and trying to implement that as I understand it.
We both still live in the same house, separate bedrooms.
OM STBXW has exposed to OM side. I have exposed to mine and her parents. She is not close to her family, we moved to the other side of the world to get away from them. The kids aren't all that close to her, her inconsistent behavior has pushed them away and they have not said much to her at all.
Yes I was involved in her psychiatric program but she has now been signed off at her request.

Have you told her she needs to end her affair and that you won�t have a marriage with 3 people in it? What avenues does she use to carry on her affair? Have you told the OM to get out of your M?
Read this and listen to the radio clips.
�I encourage BHs to confront OM� Dr. Harley

And this one �Don�t put up with OM� per Dr. Harley

I have stated that I will not share my wife with another man. This lead to the ultimatum. She doesn't do well with feeling like someone is trying to control her.

She just goes out when she want's and see's him. Not that often but I'm at work during the day and so she could be meeting him for lunch. I know they have done this a few times at least.

When we first seperated I went round to OM and OMSTBXW's house and spoke to them. I basically said I want to try to save my marriage so keep out. This obviously didn't have any effect.

I will read and listen to the link now.

I've listened to those clips. Like I said above, I've made it clear to OM that I intend to try to save my marriage and he should back off. I have kept that message going but he doesn't care.

Hi bphubbie, you have received good advice from Brainhurts but I wanted to address this comment. She is controlling you, not vice versa. She is forcing you to tolerate her abusive and destructive behavior. Asking your spouse to stop abusing you is not "controlling." Just keep that in mind. SHE is controlling you.


This means you are not separated. "Separated" means you don't live together.

Am I reading this right? The OM came to your home - where your children reside - and watched you and your wife have sex? Surely I have misread this.


Your wife is very destructive and this is her second affair. This is not a typical affair. Dr Harley doesn't recommend that betrayed husbands kick out their wayward wives, however in your situation more Plan A is unlikely to help. You should contact an attorney and make plans to move out taking your children with you. Since your wife is so reckless and mentally unstable it wouldn't be a good idea to leave your kids there.

That being said, I am very concerned about your judgement after reading the comment about bringing the OM into your home and having sex in front of him. I am hopeful I have misunderstood your comment.

I think he meant that he "took care of her" physically after her suicide attempt, of which he didn't give details.

That might be right, but the OM was allowed in his home and allowed to "cuddle' up to her. These kids must feel like they live in an insane asylum where nothing makes sense.

Yes and I agree that it's disgusting and out of line. Example of how WW is the one being controlling.

Yes I do mean took care of her as in took away drugs, razor blades etc. Basically protected her from herself.


It was in the middle of the night and the kids slept through it all. The eldest 2 (S24, S20) no longer live with us, just S18 and D11 left. The OM is not allowed at the house but I didn't kick him out until it was all over.

So you have an 11 year old at home? This set up must be very confusing for her to see her parents act like they are not married when they clearly are.

Did you see my post about moving out?

I have made it clear to her I am not moving out, she will need to.
The 11 year old has been protected from a lot of what is going on, not really seeing much, but I will be talking to her today to check she is OK and see if she wants to talk about anything or ask any questions.

I know you say anymore plan A is unlikely to work but I have been working on Plan A for the last few days and am seeing positive changes.

I seriously doubt that. Kids are very shrewd and know when something is wrong. Does the 11 year old know about her mother's adultery and why the marriage is in such a bad place? Has this been explained to her? It must be extremely confusing for her to see her married mother behaving like a single person.

Secondly, Dr Harley doesn't recommend that you require your wife to move out. Rather, he recommends that the husband move out if Plan B is required.

From reading your post, you have been in Plan A for some time.


But you are not separated. Even if you were separated, "separated" means MARRIED.

I will be explaining this to her properly tomorrow. She spends time with my parents most weekends and this is when my wife goes out.

Legal issues prohibit me from moving out.
I've been all over the place for some time. No concerted effort to address her needs until the last few days.

I disagree with their view I'm only saying how the express their feelings on the matter. It's funny how they don't think they've done anything wrong but hate people knowing what they have done truthfully (the timelines involved)

The exposure seems to be biting. We just had a talk (her raving at me). Started off with why I am a bad husband (actually got some useful info from this) then moved on to how dare I tell the kids, what made me think I had the right, its her job to tell them. I said that I felt it was my right to tell them but I also agreed that she should have told them before, just like OMSTBXW should have been told sooner and I should have been told rather than me telling her. I also pointed out that I didn't make any judgments or get nasty, I just told facts and if they aren't doing anything wrong whats the problem? This just resulted in more "you had no right".

Her biggest problem with me is that I "always have to be right". I don't agree with this but understand that that is how she feels so I need to address that. I am trying to accept blame for being moody with her or snapping even when I didn't feel I had. I think this is what I need to do in plan a. Is this right?

Last night she also asked why I am so angry with OM? I told her that he was supposed to be my friend but still did this and hasn't even had the guts to speak to me about it. I also said that he doesn't show any guilt. Thinking today the biggest problem I have with him is that he is destroying my family and driving us apart. While in plan A should I tell her this? I know her answer will be no your doing that.

While in plan A should I just ignore the affair as all exposure has been done and concentrate on us?

I'm so confused at the moment. One minute she says we will never be able to have a relationship and the next shes saying what I need to change to have any chance.

I've told her I don't want her to move out. I know I need to be more consistent but we live ina very small town and so I see him around. When I do it sometimes affects me hard and I react badly. Any advice?

This is what you need to correct and address for the marriage.


Tell her that her adultery is breaking your heart. Ask her to stop hurting you. Let her know at every opportunity that her affair hurts you deeply.


No, you should not ignore it unless you want her to think you don't care. Complacence gives the impression you don't care.


You should work on moving to another town if you ever want to have any hope of recovery. Dr Harley has recommended to others in your situation [small town] that they move away and if the marriage recovers, you will be out of that environment and able to save your marriage. But living there wll never be conducive to recovery. As long as she can run into him, the affair will be on again, off again for years.