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Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
She's also said something about me tracking her every move.

I know you're already been advised about this, but it's worth repeating: NEVER disclose your snooping methods, ever!


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Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
Her oldest sister tried to give her some advice tonight:

"Why a tow truck? Sarah, have you thought about keeping your marriage together and your family intact? Divorce sucks. Dual parenting outside a marriage sucks. Not having your kids on holidays sucks. Dating sucks. New relationships with outside baggage sucks. It all sucks and it's hard. I've experienced it, I know. You seem to be looking through rose colored glasses that there is going to be this incredible amicable relationship with Jon. Don't you remember how much mom & dad fought when we were little? They didn't always get along. Even now I hear the resentment in dad's voice. Additionally, you've compromised it with infidelity. Can't you guys see a pro-marriage counselor and work on keeping it together? Rather than one trying to help you pull it apart "amicably"? Which is a joke.... divorce is not amicable. It's destructive to your spirit, it's destructive to other relationships, it's destructive to kids , it's destructive financially. It's [censored]. The grass isn't greener on the other side. If I could tell you one thing this is it.... marriage is better than divorce. I love you. I think you're making a mistake and I wish you would reconsider."

My wife's reply: " thank you for offering your opinion" and "vomit, that is what i have had to choke down to be a good wife to Jon. I'm tired of choking down vomit. i am divorcing him"

Yikes

Wow, just wow! What a great sister! Many BS would have LOVED to have a sister-in-law who was such a strong supporter of the marriage. Your WW is getting a strong dose of reality from her sister, I hope it continues! It's especially helpful because your SIL has been through a divorce and can speak to WW with authority on the subject.


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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
Email from my wife while I was at church with the boys:

If you care about me the way you say you do then please do mediation with me. This marriage is over for me and I see you are having a hard time accepting that. Your resistence to mediate is only making matters worse for the boys and me.

She then attached pics from a book she is reading called Good Parenting through Divorce. One section was titled, Accept the Divorce and Don't Fight.

She keeps pushing for mediation and she's now saying that unwillingness to mediate is hurting her and the boys.

I feel like she is trying to bait you into a fight and get you to say something she can use against you. I would suggest you ignore any more requests for "mediation." You have told her how you feel. If she brings it up in person you can say "I prefer to leave that for the attorneys to work out. I don't want any more conflict." Then leave the room.

BE SURE and save all texts and start documenting everything. You can use the "notes" feature on an iphone and start dating and documenting every communication.

Thanks, Melody. I'll start recording our conversations and I'm already saving texts and emails. She's pretty hot about me spying on her and knowing what I know, she was pressing hard today about how I am reading her texts and how I know she met the OM.

I think you might have killed this affair. That is why she is so hot. She was still seeing him all this time.

I think so, too. The strongest reactions from WW are always when there's been tremendous damage to the affair. The snooping discovers the truth (the target) and the exposure delivers the payload, a direct hit on the affair! You've spoiled her plans (or their plans if the OM is in cahoots). They'll be unable to spin lies about getting together after they ended their "terrible marriages."

Something to always keep in mind: the A is the reason she wants a D, not the state of the M.


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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
She wrote this to the OMW:


On Sept 28 OM asked me not to contact him. i respected his wished until today when i left a letter on his windshield. i had some things that need to be said for my own personal clousure. unfortunately my car broke and OM saw out the window, he offered to call AAA, i declined, he went back to work. i went and found a place to sit in the sun while i waitrd for a tow truck. sorry

sorry for all the typos, im a bit shanken up from the way Jon is turning the boys against me in the ugliest way. i am divorcing him but it has nothing to do with OM

Notice how that's different than the story she told her friend...smh

I SERIOUSLY DOUBT this is the first time they have communicated since Sept 28. I bet they have been in touch the whole time which explains why she is not in withdrawal. She wasn't this bad before, but she is FURIOUS NOW because you have really interrupted her affair. Just keep a close eye on her and I bet you see this again. Look for her to get more sneaky, like parking her car, leaving her phone in the parking lot and going somewhere with the OM.

It would sure be nice if OM's wife would help you. Maybe you could inspire her to help her if you told her something like this:

"I want you to know I am very concerned that this affair is really over. She is very much in love and addicted to your husband according to some things she has written and said to her friends. This affair is not over for her. Her friends are very supportive and encouraging of her affair. I have seen some suspicious things but one of the biggest red flags is the complete absence of withdrawal. That led me to believe they were still in touch so I started watching. Sure enough, I catch her going to the OM's office. I am telling you this so you can watch from your end. I promise to let you know if I see anything but I predict this is far from over based on the things she is telling her friends. I can't save my marriage as long as OM is still in the picture."

How do you think she would react if you sent that?

I sent her a slightly revised version of the above via text, so we'll see. She suggested a few weeks ago that we shouldn't communicate any further and until I caught my wife visiting the OM, I stuck to that. She hasn't responded to any of my texts from Friday that followed my phone call to OMW.

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
Email from my wife while I was at church with the boys:

If you care about me the way you say you do then please do mediation with me. This marriage is over for me and I see you are having a hard time accepting that. Your resistence to mediate is only making matters worse for the boys and me.

She then attached pics from a book she is reading called Good Parenting through Divorce. One section was titled, Accept the Divorce and Don't Fight.

She keeps pushing for mediation and she's now saying that unwillingness to mediate is hurting her and the boys.

I feel like she is trying to bait you into a fight and get you to say something she can use against you. I would suggest you ignore any more requests for "mediation." You have told her how you feel. If she brings it up in person you can say "I prefer to leave that for the attorneys to work out. I don't want any more conflict." Then leave the room.

BE SURE and save all texts and start documenting everything. You can use the "notes" feature on an iphone and start dating and documenting every communication.

Thanks, Melody. I'll start recording our conversations and I'm already saving texts and emails. She's pretty hot about me spying on her and knowing what I know, she was pressing hard today about how I am reading her texts and how I know she met the OM.

I think you might have killed this affair. That is why she is so hot. She was still seeing him all this time.

I want to believe this...except that she's telling her friends that she hasn't been in touch with him. That would mean that she's lying to her closest friends and while I accept that she's actively lying to me, it's hard to see that with her friends. But I may be naive here.

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Originally Posted by abrrba
Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
Her oldest sister tried to give her some advice tonight:

"Why a tow truck? Sarah, have you thought about keeping your marriage together and your family intact? Divorce sucks. Dual parenting outside a marriage sucks. Not having your kids on holidays sucks. Dating sucks. New relationships with outside baggage sucks. It all sucks and it's hard. I've experienced it, I know. You seem to be looking through rose colored glasses that there is going to be this incredible amicable relationship with Jon. Don't you remember how much mom & dad fought when we were little? They didn't always get along. Even now I hear the resentment in dad's voice. Additionally, you've compromised it with infidelity. Can't you guys see a pro-marriage counselor and work on keeping it together? Rather than one trying to help you pull it apart "amicably"? Which is a joke.... divorce is not amicable. It's destructive to your spirit, it's destructive to other relationships, it's destructive to kids , it's destructive financially. It's [censored]. The grass isn't greener on the other side. If I could tell you one thing this is it.... marriage is better than divorce. I love you. I think you're making a mistake and I wish you would reconsider."

My wife's reply: " thank you for offering your opinion" and "vomit, that is what i have had to choke down to be a good wife to Jon. I'm tired of choking down vomit. i am divorcing him"

Yikes

Wow, just wow! What a great sister! Many BS would have LOVED to have a sister-in-law who was such a strong supporter of the marriage. Your WW is getting a strong dose of reality from her sister, I hope it continues! It's especially helpful because your SIL has been through a divorce and can speak to WW with authority on the subject.

I know...my wife's response to her sister was that she'd vomit if she has to try to work on this marriage and thanked her for her opinion.

I did text her sister after I caught those texts, but didn't give away that I had spied out her texts to my wife. It seems that her sister gave her that advice without being solicited. I want to contact this same sister again, say thanks, and ask her to repeat this in the near future. I also want to contact her other sister, who was supportive when I did the exposure call and has also been divorced (but is in a not-so-good marriage now with 2 kids of her own) and ask her to give the same advice.

Tomorrow is the phone call to the OMs mom and a FB message to who I think is his sister.

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Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
I think you might have killed this affair. That is why she is so hot. She was still seeing him all this time.

I want to believe this...except that she's telling her friends that she hasn't been in touch with him. That would mean that she's lying to her closest friends and while I accept that she's actively lying to me, it's hard to see that with her friends. But I may be naive here.[/quote]

What she says to her friends and family means nothing, waywards always lie. You have to remember that while she's in the FOG she's like an alien, and will act in ways that were once unthinkable, and that includes lying to everyone. When I exposed, I saw in my snooping that my WW was lying to everyone. When I confronted her about it she admitted that she had been lying about everything, even to her parents and siblings.




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Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
[


I want to believe this...except that she's telling her friends that she hasn't been in touch with him. That would mean that she's lying to her closest friends and while I accept that she's actively lying to me, it's hard to see that with her friends. But I may be naive here.

Where did she lie to her friends? When she texted her friend that day, she said:

Quote
"I know you are all about signs, so interpret this... I stopped bu Lincolns work to drop off a letter. Left it on his windshield. He saw and came out to parking lot. While we were talking there was a loud pop and my car started to smoke. Called a tow truck, found a sunny place to sit. While waiting a student from RHS recognizes me- Yousif. Found another place to sit and there is a package of Parliment cigarettes on the ground. Parliments were my closest grandmas favorite brand to smoke."

She told the OM's wife that she had not contacted him which is what they want her to believe.
Quote
On Sept 28 OM asked me not to contact him. i respected his wished until today when i left a letter on his windshield. i had some things that need to be said for my own personal clousure. unfortunately my car broke and OM saw out the window, he offered to call AAA, i declined, he went back to work. i went and found a place to sit in the sun while i waitrd for a tow truck. sorry

Is there more you haven't posted?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
[


I want to believe this...except that she's telling her friends that she hasn't been in touch with him. That would mean that she's lying to her closest friends and while I accept that she's actively lying to me, it's hard to see that with her friends. But I may be naive here.

Where did she lie to her friends? When she texted her friend that day, she said:

Quote
"I know you are all about signs, so interpret this... I stopped bu Lincolns work to drop off a letter. Left it on his windshield. He saw and came out to parking lot. While we were talking there was a loud pop and my car started to smoke. Called a tow truck, found a sunny place to sit. While waiting a student from RHS recognizes me- Yousif. Found another place to sit and there is a package of Parliment cigarettes on the ground. Parliments were my closest grandmas favorite brand to smoke."

She told the OM's wife that she had not contacted him which is what they want her to believe.
Quote
On Sept 28 OM asked me not to contact him. i respected his wished until today when i left a letter on his windshield. i had some things that need to be said for my own personal clousure. unfortunately my car broke and OM saw out the window, he offered to call AAA, i declined, he went back to work. i went and found a place to sit in the sun while i waitrd for a tow truck. sorry

Is there more you haven't posted?

Well, yes, there's lots of texts that I haven't posted, though I have referred to them as I did above by noting that in her texts to some of her friends she's telling them that that they haven't been in contact. I cited this during the exposure window where once she had heard I was calling and texting people she was telling them how they hadn't been in contact.

Watching her texts and email and calls I haven't seen contact between September 28 and Friday. It could be because there wasn't contact or I didn't have full access to all means of communication or they were doing it in person.


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Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
[


Well, yes, there's lots of texts that I haven't posted, though I have referred to them as I did above by noting that in her texts to some of her friends she's telling them that that they haven't been in contact. I cited this during the exposure window where once she had heard I was calling and texting people she was telling them how they hadn't been in contact.

Ok, gotcha! I read all that and don't believe there has been no contact. She could easily delete texts up until now and I suspect she has been doing that all along. I think she leaves things for you to read, don't you?

Quote
Watching her texts and email and calls I haven't seen contact between September 28 and Friday. It could be because there wasn't contact or I didn't have full access to all means of communication or they were doing it in person.

But you wouldn't have seen any texts that she deleted if you didn't have spyware on her phone. You just installed it and right after that, you caught her at the OM's.

Here is another scenario that could explain why she has not been in withdrawal since contact supposedly ended. She and the OM put together a plan to go through the motions for a specified time and after that, they will both leave their marriages and hook up.

I wish you could see the letter she gave the OM.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
[quote=DrDetroit24][


Well, yes, there's lots of texts that I haven't posted, though I have referred to them as I did above by noting that in her texts to some of her friends she's telling them that that they haven't been in contact. I cited this during the exposure window where once she had heard I was calling and texting people she was telling them how they hadn't been in contact.

I think she said this back then because she was on defense. That doesn't mean it is true and it sure doesn't mean she has not been in contact all this time. ALSO, since she knows you have been spying on her, I am sure she has been deleting texts. She never expected you to catch her at the OM's.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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I thought this was interesting.... Is divorce contagious?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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On Friday night I changed the password to our joint bank account. I did so that she couldn't detect the savings transfer to my sole savings account and so she couldn't initiate any financial transaction while that savings transfer was pending. My rationale here is that her continued deception and lying to the kids and I about the OM means that I cannot trust her and because I cannot trust her and will not pay for our divorce, I've emptied out nearly all the savings and changed my direct deposit.

On Saturday she realized that she couldn't login, asked me about it, and I hemmed and hawed to avoid the conflict. Tonight though I need to break the news that I've emptied out the savings, changed the direct deposit, and that I'll deposit only specific amounts to our joint account for the mortgage, utilities, etc. It'll be at this point that I'll give her the new login info to our joint account.

Saw another text string with her longest term best friend wherein her friend was encouraging her with the idea that her future partner is going to great and that my wife should look forward to that.

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Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
On Friday night I changed the password to our joint bank account. I did so that she couldn't detect the savings transfer to my sole savings account and so she couldn't initiate any financial transaction while that savings transfer was pending. My rationale here is that her continued deception and lying to the kids and I about the OM means that I cannot trust her and because I cannot trust her and will not pay for our divorce, I've emptied out nearly all the savings and changed my direct deposit.

I would be very careful here because a judge will make quick work of you over stuff like this. He won't care that she has been deceptive. I would refigure this and put some of the money back in your savings. Take out any money you have put aside for your kids and then split the rest of your savings in half. Everything else is good.




"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
On Friday night I changed the password to our joint bank account. I did so that she couldn't detect the savings transfer to my sole savings account and so she couldn't initiate any financial transaction while that savings transfer was pending. My rationale here is that her continued deception and lying to the kids and I about the OM means that I cannot trust her and because I cannot trust her and will not pay for our divorce, I've emptied out nearly all the savings and changed my direct deposit.

I would be very careful here because a judge will make quick work of you over stuff like this. He won't care that she has been deceptive. I would refigure this and put some of the money back in your savings. Take out any money you have put aside for your kids and then split the rest of your savings in half. Everything else is good.

Yep. With the convo tonight I'll figure out exactly how much is the boys and how much ours is and split ours in half.

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Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by DrDetroit24
On Friday night I changed the password to our joint bank account. I did so that she couldn't detect the savings transfer to my sole savings account and so she couldn't initiate any financial transaction while that savings transfer was pending. My rationale here is that her continued deception and lying to the kids and I about the OM means that I cannot trust her and because I cannot trust her and will not pay for our divorce, I've emptied out nearly all the savings and changed my direct deposit.

I would be very careful here because a judge will make quick work of you over stuff like this. He won't care that she has been deceptive. I would refigure this and put some of the money back in your savings. Take out any money you have put aside for your kids and then split the rest of your savings in half. Everything else is good.

Yep. With the convo tonight I'll figure out exactly how much is the boys and how much ours is and split ours in half.

Perfect!


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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She's texted me asking for our mortgage website username and password. I asked her why, but she responded by asking if I figured out the banking password issue.

This is on the heels of her filling out her attorneys paperwork. On Friday night after confronting her and coming home to find her moving furniture around, after things calmed down, she sat at the dining room table looking at her attorneys paperwork. While doing so, she asked me if I had an attorney (I said yes, although only a consult) and said hers would need that name and contact info. Further, she started about the discovery process and how we could save money by providing all the info the attorney would need. She them wanted a copy of our tax returns. So far, I have dragged my feet on printing them off or sending her an electronic copy.

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I would give her all of that. She is entitled to all that documentation so dragging your feet is no benefit and will just aggravate her for no reason.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
I would give her all of that. She is entitled to all that documentation so dragging your feet is no benefit and will just aggravate her for no reason.
It's the fighting instinct again...but you're right. No reason not except to be difficult. Though part of me wants to dragy feet just to delay.

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Just wanted to comment on your WW's apparent lying to her friends and family -- its is extremely likely that she is not being honest with ANYONE.
She is lying to her friends and family - because she wants to eventually introduce OM to them, and is trying to lay the groundwork so he doesn't look like a homewrecking scumbag.
Since she's been busted, she is trying to give everyone the appearance that they have broken it off or aren't in contact anymore....so she can then resurrect him later as a rekindled romance.

I never confided in any of my friends. (I was ashamed of my behavior!)
I was never honest with my mother, father or any family.
I lied to my BH (obviously)
And most importantly, I lied to OM. I constantly lied about the state of my marriage, and the progress of my divorce.

It is an isolating, depressing, horrible position to put yourself in.

Be kind to her -- even when she doesn't deserve it.
Right now you are leaving a trail of kindness breadcrumbs she can follow out of the darkness....


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