On October 5th, my spouse of 4 years, father to our 3 yr. old, and soulmate of 14 years and I were having a relationship talk...I asked if he was having an affair....things had not felt "right" for quite some time...he gave me a story, 'version 1', then, after intercepting an e-mail from her the next day, I discovered 'version 2'....after confronting him, many conversations later, I persuaded him to find a forum...this is what I found he posted somewhere else...the pain I have coursing through me right now is not verbally describable..as I'm sure many here know ....first-hand...this is part of our story....<P>"""" This is my first time posting to this board and I'm not really sure where to start,<BR> so bear with me please. I came here on the advice of my Wife who has decided to<BR>stay with me even though I completely betrayed her. we are taking drastic steps to save our marriage. To do this, she<BR> holds back a lot of pain; (smiling at me instead of chopping certain body parts off, for example)I am feeling so<BR> guilty about my actions and this is compounded by the shame of being treated<BR> as though I were forgiven. I cheated on my Wife and can barely handle the guilt- not only for the cheating, but also for<BR> lying to her for so long.<BR> In fact the cheating is bad, really bad,but to me the lies are even worse. I not<BR> only lied to Her while it was happening, but when I couldn't handle the guilt anymore, I<BR> ended up telling another lie- that is, misrepresenting the scope and timeframe of<BR> my affair. I figured that a half truth would inform Her of the affair, and let me ease my<BR> concience and minimize the pain she would suffer. Look I know how f**king ridiculous this sounds, but bear with me<BR> please... I thought I knew what I was doing, that is I had justifications and reasons and all that nicely figured out(not really, but enough so that I could carry the affair on for about 3 months) A few days after telling Her that I'd only been with the OW twice, my ex-I don't know what to even call her....OW, sent me a particularily nasty<BR> email. Because I had been avoiding reading her emails and had not taken any<BR> steps to hide her communiques in general, my Wife found the email and read it. Though it did not allude to any specifics, (as did the numerous emails that followed to my wife from the OW,)the raw emotion and hurt in the email (I had recently told her that I<BR> could not lie to my Wife anymore, was going to tell her and that there was no chance of continuing our "affair" (which was 'patchwork-y' at best through the 3 months)it was obvious to my wife that this woman was not suffering from the breakup of a two day affair.<BR> I was given a chance to come clean. <BR> Never have I felt shame like I did that night. Never. The guilt that one carries<BR> while having an affair is tremendous- especially when one truly loves one's spouse. But the shame in lying is far worse. I told<BR> the truth as best as I could remember it. While having the affair, I put a lot of<BR> effort into denying that it was happening. It was the only way I could come home and look my Wife in the eyes. I would try<BR> to pretend that it wasn't happening and pretend that I never did what I did. The<BR> raw fear of Her leaving me didn't help. Still, She so far has been patient<BR> with me. She asks me questions and I answer. I am frightened because if I<BR> were one of her friends, I would be counselling her to 'leave the bum - you<BR> deserve better' which she<BR> does. <BR> Meanwhile the OW is still sending email to me (sexy pictures)and to my Wife (hurt girlfriend letters and 'leave him' advice). <P> My problem is this;<BR> How can I EVER hope to regain my Love's trust?<BR> My integrity has been pissed away and cannot expect to have my words taken<BR> as truth. <BR> I have lost every shred of self respect I ever had. I've jeoprodized my Marriage<BR> and Family. Cruelly<BR> hurt the Woman of my heart. Despite the probs we have had, she has been a<BR> good wife, caring for<BR> me and my children (one from another marriage) and put up with me even<BR> though (since my Mother's<BR> death three years ago) I have been a pathetic loser. In return for this, I have<BR> been a LIAR and a<BR> CHEATER. And I'm finding it very hard to bear. (some of you are probably<BR> saying "GOOD!" and I<BR> don't blame you.) I can't exactly turn to my Love for sympathy, so I'm hoping to<BR> find others who feel<BR> as bad as I do or perhaps have already overcome their probs.Gawd, this has<BR> turned into a long introduction. If it seems rambling and disjointed, well,<BR> welcome to<BR> my head. <BR> humbled and ashamed """""<P>I don't know how to help my H through this, I can barely function myself...I don't know how you make something like this "up" to somebody....I feel as though parts of me have been ripped out....<BR>

I am soooo sorry that you have to go through this. I can't think of a worse place to be in right now in your marriage.<P>But he wants to end the relationship with the OW, but OW won't go away? He feels absolutely guilty - and the more you are nice to him he feels worse? <P>I think he is suffering from withdrawal from his addiction of the affair. The affair sounded very much like an addiction. He's coming down off of a fantasy romantic high. You need to continue to be supportive of him, and also require him to completely end all contact with this OW. <P>Your husband is really trying to detach from what he's done. You are one of the lucky ones - there is a lot of hope here. <P>Keep posting, I know how you feel. But just writing all those negative feelings out right now will help. Keeps you from lovebusting on your husband.<P>Keep doing all you can do with your husband to support him - read basic concepts - and the part about infidelity.<P>God be with you.

WOW. He is really showing remorse and regret.<P>I'm right there with you. My H is so consumed by guilt that it's been easier for me to forgive him than for him to forgive himself. He just broke down and cried his eyes out last weekend, and he feels like crap, just like your husband. Also, he denied it several times over the course of a few months, before finally admitting it. He is having a terrible time with the guilt of the lying, along with the guilt of the affair.<P>So, what have I been doing to help my husband through this? I keep telling him that I love him and that I forgive him, and we can stay together and work on it and have a great marriage, as long as he doesn't cheat on me again. And when I'm feeling insecure, I ask him for what I need. "Tell me that you love me and I'm the only one you want and you'll never want another", and he does, and he sounds sincere and I believe him. <P>And for myself, I try not to replay my imaginings of the affair in my mind, although that's extremely hard to do. And I'm also trying very hard to get all the pain and bitterness and anger out as I feel it, rather than saving it up for a major breakdown at a later date. That's what I did after my H's first affair, and I think that contributed to the second affair, among other things. Although, I DO NOT BELIEVE IT WAS MY FAULT, HE WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR HIS ACTIONS.<P>It's very easy for friends to tell us to "leave the bum", like he says. But they are not in our shoes. They don't know all the wonderful things about our spouses that we do, and how we connect with them.<P>Hang in there. Time can prove to be a wonderful healer.

Your H sounds shattered. This is good. With everything out in the open, you can heal.<BR>He sounds as tho he is genuinely sorry, and really wants to make it work with you. You also sound as tho you love him to bits and want to make it work. GO FOR IT. I can only imagine at this stage in my life what you now have to go thru, but you two sound as tho you will go thru it together. That is the most wonderful thing.<P>All my very best wishes - a lot of hard work will reap the rewards. And keep posting here.<P>Jo

soulloss--<P>You've both been through devastation. Time for healing and open communication. But first, and importantly, gotta get rid of OW.<P>My suggestion would be an e-mail from H to OW, beginning with his thoughts and no-contact request, and ending with thoughts from you both. For example:<P>"I deeply regret our affair. I cheated on my wife, and compounded the deceit by lying to her. I am going to stay with my wonderful wife and work on rebuilding our marriage. I will accept no further communication from you. We find your e-mails in poor taste under the circumstances and any attempts to contact us will be ignored."<P>...or something to that effect. Then delete any response. Push down curiosity about reading them. DO NOT READ further e-mails from her. Your H may not be too keen on handling it this way; but then again, maybe he will be agreeable since he DOES regret what happened. She will probably check the status of sent mail, and it will show a message of "deleted, unread" if all are AOL users. If phone calls are attempted, simply hang up. Return any mail to sender, unopened. There's no reason to try to be nice to her, or go into further explanation for her...the e-mail says it all--"go away."<P>Best of luck to you.

Hi Soulloss,<P>Sorry you have to be here but glad you found this place. A lot of people will give you good advice. You may ask your H to post here as well or if you want post here by yourself for a bit till you really get an idea of what you want.<P>I would suggest maybe printing out some of the material and both of you reading it together. Also get Surviving the Affaire by Janis Abrahams (not sure if I have the name right) It discusses what both people are feeling over the affair. <P>Might I also suggest that you both send her it is over letter. He should add in there no contact, I made a mistake and I am sorry I hurt my wife bit. Send it to her. Next change your email company. If she keeps sending stuff it will only make it harder to heal. She has her own agenda. I really hope that your H's company did not have a policy of no "dating" among co-workers or that he was not her boss or vice versa. This could cause a problem. <P>Also it is a good thing that he is being honest with you and answering all your questions. If you want make him a bit more accountable for his time to ease your wondering. Also are you in counceling? If not you should start. <P>Sorry you have to go through all this pain.

thank you all who replied......I find myself very isolated through this...no real friends....none who could understand any justification for staying with a cheater, anyway,and family is not an option. <P>I wanted to explain and make clear as well, that all contact with the OW stopped about a week ago...she messengered me, but H was on the computer....I was sitting right beside him, so she had a whole conversation w/him, never once revealing who she was, leading him to believe she was a friend of mine from the boards.....I emailed her the next day and told her that to heal, this was over...meaning our communications...<P>she sent some final inflamatory crap, H asked me to allow him to reply as he felt the need to set her straight on some of the "wrongness" of her facts....the fact that she lied, and continues to supposedly llie, suprisingly angers him....I laughed and said....you lied to me for 4 months, she asked you to lie, she told you to lie...you are surprised that she would still continue to lie now?.....<P>the bottom line is (sorry for rambling, somebody , reel me in, lol)it ended. it ended very badly, with the OW threatening him stupidly, high on her soapbox, that if she ever heard that he did this again with anybody she knew, she would make him sorrier than he is now, that he ever met her.......isn't that sweet? this woman has gone from crying, oh poor me, to evil, faoming-at-the-mouth, very angry lady.....good. <P>lets me see what I don't want to become, and has opened H's eyes to her true personality, outside of bikini-clad, horny, exciting, older woman...<P>I have a horrible confession to make .........maybe making it here, and in print will make me feel better than harboring it in my heart.<P>I am a conniving, scheming, *****-of-a-wife......I orchestrated this...this bizarre dance of e-mails....this way, she is not stuck in th longing phase, she could have lingered there for a year....she's angry......and over him. she no longer "wants" him......mission accomplished.<P>H now sees what a conniving OW she was, how twisted things could seem to her, and is in total regret mode....he sees the true her that he did not see during the affair.....it has spoiled all memories he may have carried around.........he no longer can "bask" in the ego-stroking that having her in love with him may have brought...he no longer sees her in ANY positive light......mission accomplished.<P>I think I may be ill......mentally ill. is this sick and twisted? I just wanted to make sure that they never ever thought of each other ever again in any way that resembled"close" or "exciting"....selfish huh?......should I feel any guilt? <P>I mean I never fabricated anything, I just initiated contact when I discovered her "how dare you dump me" email....and continued....to show him exactly what she was about...she even told me to change email providers, never to tell H about our commiunications, she always wanted to know how we were doing, blah, blah, remember, this is all over the course of the past month....she told me to lie to my H, boy, was I laughing at that...but, it sure did dispel any myths left in his mind.... <P>I've learned this past month, nothing is going to drop in my lap.....I have to take what I want, and prevent any going backwards.......<P>I heartily apologize for the length of this, but I really don't have anybody to talk to about this, and my brain is so scrambled, I don't know what day it is half the time anymore......so thank you for your patience....<P>

Dearest Soulloss:<P>don't beat yourself up too badly over "orchestrating" e-mails. How can you be expected to play fair when obviously the OW won't? The OW will always do anything she can to get the man, manipulation, games, everything. What you did was simply get her to show her true colors a little bit faster. There's no such thing as playing fair in this infidelity game, because the OW certainly won't. <P>Just my thoughts.

thanks marlo.......<P>the guilt did not last too long.....H's reaction to finding out about it (he read this post) wiped out the guilt.........he was stunned that in my own way, I 'fought' for him......he laughingly said that I'd made a HUGE deposit into his love bank...that I would go through it to secure our lives together.......what would I not do ??!!?!<P>Dylan

Hi soulloss-<P>I am sorry you had to find this place as much as I am sorry I had to find this place-but thank God for MB-it sure helps. I ed your post hee and had so many thoughts about it. Your H sounds much like my H after he told me about his affair with my so called then best friend. I too felt so isolated-and so scared and so hurt and on and on. It will get better as I am sure you have red here time and time again!<BR>I feel as though your H is truly very sorry, ashamed and embarrassed by this affair of his. My H's OW did pretty much the same to him once he told me all about it. She claimed to have had an affair with him but that was the extent of her confession. She bsically said things that led me to think my H had bsically forced himself on her time and time again-that maybe he had even raped her. Talk about being upset I thought I knew my H-and then I find out they had an almost 2 year affair (where the heck was I)-so I got so very afraid that maybe I didn't know him at all. But time goes by and little things flash back to me-reminders of her actions that proved to me that she lied about many things-to me and to my H and to her H. I was in shock for the first ten weeks-then I got downright mad. I wanted so badly to beat her to a pulp-but I am not that type a gal But oh boy did the hate come rushing forth. I suppose if asked aI would have to honestly say I still feel a whole lot of hate. This gal was supposed to be my friend-a very good friend. We watched each others kids, we went over 1000 miles to vacation together as families, we camped together, went to concerts together..........the list goes on. Talk about hurt and all that.<BR>But getting back to your H-I can tell by his tone and wording that he wants nothing more than to be able to forget he was ever so stupid. It isn't that you were a bad wife or anything remotely close-it was that men like to use the wrong head to think with I won't make excuses for any of them-it angers me that I meant so little when he was offered an outside fling. I love my H more than anything in this world-he is a great guy-does anything to make me happy (and always has-well almost). But men don't think when given that choice.<BR>Hang in there girl-I hope you two can make things work. I am so sorry this happened to either of you.<BR>I live one day at a time-I haven't stopped loving my H for a moment but my heart aches in a way that I am not sure if it can ever mend--------time will tell.<P>Hugs to you both-<P><P>------------------<BR>*heartache*<BR>"Loyalty Is A Two Way Street"<BR>

((((((((((((heartache)))))))))))))<P>I have to thank you for your words on the "OP meant nothing" thread......this post was on page 6, and I sort of lost track of it.....LOL..kind of like my mind !!<P>yes, I htink H is truly sorry....as his post says, he realizes now that the 'justifications and rationalizations' he used to continue the affair were just excuses...but I can't help but wish he reallized that in, oh, July!!! I can't change the past, but I can wish it didn't happen...<P>after reading saome of the stories on this board (including yours), I realize however, and I am NOT giving H any points here, but his affair was 3 months, he did not have an emotional attachment, and felt guilt pretty much throughout it all. GOOD. <P>having read yours, I have to say that I admire you......I cannot honestly say what I would have done had his affair been for 2 years....you have such strength, and such character......you have my hopes for a great future together...<P>As for beating the OW to a pulp, well, I can commisserate with you on that one, but I too, like you, am not that type of gal......of course, you can read my mental instability thread to see what I would like to do...but it was a bad day, and revenge is not the best policy.......it is however, one heck of a release just to think about it....<P>If our H's would like to forget, can they imagine what we would like? moving forward in such baby steps is wierd.....I knew - correction, we BOTH knew that we had work to do on this marriage even before he started this affair, then why have an affair !!! why do this to us? but I can't imagine why he/they would then commit themselves to these affairs knowing full well that the jeopardy they are placing their marriages in!!! it does not make sense...|i am looking for sense....there isn't any, I know.<P>thank you so much for your responses, and if H and I have helped in ANY way, then, you have just blown my mind......I can't even function yet, but I can help others?!?!?!<P>wow.<P>thank you.<P>Dylan<P>