Hello Isaac,<P>Nope, we don't know each other and this is my first post to you. I saw your posts as you walked into the crossfire between D99 and Doug. It's a bit of a long story, and one that's been going on for awhile.<P>Anyhoo, my point in posting is suggest that there ARE a lotta good caring people here. Yes, sometimes it's tough for newcomers to break in. It's such a huge forum now with so many people. It's very hard to keep up.<P>My wife and I have been here close to a year now and there are others who've been here even longer. We've seen the Forum grow sooo much. It's hard to keep up now even with folks who we've come to know.<P>But, most of us have benefitted so much from being here. It's truly a unique community of people. So, from my own experience I can't help but suggest that you hang in there. Jump in, post when the spirit moves you. Odds are real good you'll find others who will connect with you. <P>Take care and all the best on Thanksgiving.<P>

Hey, Duncan.<P>I looked up a little history on that one after my post. I guess we all have our, um, unique ways of expressing our pain, huh? I just posted on the other thread, and feel bad for jumping in on places where my nose doesn't belong. I had a good talk to myself about it this a.m. <P>I agree with you, there are some very helpful, caring people here and it amazes me that people are willing to help others when going through so much pain themselves. <P>Thanks for the post, and have a great Thanksgiving!

Isaac, just a helpful hint about getting no responses: Sometimes, when the forum is really busy, only the top few posts receive any responses. Occasionally, people will simply post a response to their own post ... it is a little trick: 1) many don't like to post the first response to a new thread, so seeing it listed with 1 response instead of 0 may "enable" us to open the thread and read it (I don't know why, it just seems that way); and 2) a response brings the post back to the top again, calling a little more attention to it.<P>An intriguing subject line sometimes draws attention, too.<P>Hope these suggestions help a little. We don't deliberately ignore anyone - it is just soooo hard to keep up (note that there are over 50,000 posts in this forum alone since the beginning a few years ago). I've been here about 14 months ... and I know what it's like to feel ignored. It happens...<P>------------------<BR>terri<BR>I believe in miracles...<BR>

Issac,<P>Happy Thanksgiving to you! <P>Wanted to make one comment on your post back to Duncan: Although it amazes you that we can reach out to eachother when we are enduring our own pain- here is my take.<P>In order to reach out to soemone else and be supportive, you have to be able to dig deep, REAALLLLLLY deep, sometimes, to find the strength to be able to share another's suffering and offer compassion. If you want to give love, you've got to find love within your self first. If you want to share hope, you have to have hope in your own life that you WILL survive all this and be happy again. If you want to impart compassion, you have to dig into your own soul and find the compassion there first. And, likewise, when you share your pain, anger and hurt here, it gets "released" from you, little by little.<P>No, this is no "accident" that we are here on this forum. Each and EVERY time we reach out to someone in need here, we actually help to heal OURSELVES!<P>Roll Me Away<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Well-said, RMA.<P>It does feel good to be able to help. Sort of makes all the insanity of the past seem a little bit more worthwhile. And yes...part of the healing process...giving back.

Duncan,<P>Thanks for letting me drop in on your thread to Issac. Wishing you and Suse a Happy T-Day!<P>Roll Me Away <P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Isaac:<P>It really isn't a question of "nose not belonging" somewhere… unfortunately, we pretty much all have our noses in the same muck around here. With Doug and the … situation… you stumbled across, there's an awful lot of history as well. History that you can't really see, since those who run this board have found it necessary to delete many of the posts due to their incredibly hurtful nature. The posts I'm speaking of WEREN'T made by the Doug half of what you stepped in, BTW.<P>Personally, I think the bad, putrid stuff should remain on this forum for all to see, as a warning of sorts. But I don't run things, and some of what was deleted was pretty vicious, so I do understand the deletion, even if I don't agree.<P>Welcome, and wish you weren't here. Of course, I wish NONE of us were… as much as I wish there were no need for a place like this.<BR><P>------------------<BR>Resentment is like taking poison and waiting for the other person to die

whodat, it is not just admin that delete...we have some less than honest, and at times manipulative, forum members that post nasty things, then when they get a response...they go back and edit there messages! Childish game, but it does not go unnoticed. I do not happen to appreciate the mind games, so I choose not to read or respond to anything a few write. <BR>Isaac, hope you will post more or just drop in to say hello. How is your recovery progressing? There are a few of us that are at the one yr mark....I know you are farther along. Can you share some of your feelings, emotions, and successful plans from when you were at this stage? Thanks, cl

cl, I heartily agree… there have been a few times I have responded to something, and when I posted, what I responded to was no longer there, having been edited out! Sometimes, those people have even denied ever having said those things! I myself shoot straight from the hip (I know… big shocker… LOL), and try not to edit afterwards so the original post remains without the "Edited by…" tag at the end. However, typos and dingoes (dropped UBB code) sometimes make that unavoidable. Like now... LOL. <P>In the case of which I was speaking however, entire threads were deleted by the administrator due to hurtful content. I for one think they should have remained as a lesson on what NOT to do to heal a marriage. If those doing the hurting wanted to edit, so be it. But the responses should have remained, so we don't have to go through it all over again every time a batch of newcomers is subjected to the same thoughtless words.<P>As always, JMHO.<P><BR>------------------<BR>Resentment is like taking poison and waiting for the other person to die<p>[This message has been edited by WhoDat (edited November 26, 1999).]

hi whodat...hey, too cool...we agree?! And what the heck did you edit? <BR>I can't spell, so lots of edit on my posts! <BR>As for the critical things, if both feet fit in...then I suppose I can get them out at this age? If not, good learning!<BR>I think the hateful threads should have been left for viewing, but glad the responses were stopped. Not sure what can be learned for newcomers by a few of our threads...maybe the learning could be less painful than the ones I am thinking of? <BR>Isaac? Hints? <p>[This message has been edited by cl (edited November 26, 1999).]

Hi, Terri, Roll me Away, WhoDat, Cl.<P>Thanks for the suggestions and help. What a great bunch o' people residing here (through not so great circumstances, unfortunately).<P>cl, I had an affair that ended over 3 years ago, my wife had one after mine ended. It was horrible, but we really are doing very well now. I thought she was going to divorce me at one point, but we worked through it. It's amazing how close you can come to that point and bounce back. We've gotten closer to one another than we could have thought possible, but it wasn't really on Harley principles. We're doing the Harley stuff now (plan a'ing one another to death!) and it's working out great. But most of the time we really don't try to work on the marriage, we let it come naturally. Give each other respect and get by with LOTS of humour. We like to slap one another over the head with a herring if the other gets out of line! For some reason, this whole mess brought us closer together. <P>I've been thinking and I don't think it's good for me to relive this too much longer. I can't seem to give advice because it just hurts too much to see what people are going through. When my wife found out about my affair (It's hard to talk about this) she basically said that was it. I worked to get her back, and she retaliated with an affair of her own. I don't think mind games are the way to go and some people (from what I've read) believe that trying to get back is a form of playing mind games. I just think it's a level of tolerance for what you can and cannot take. Neither one of us thinks that a person should take a cheating spouse, although we both went through it, we both put a stop to it. I can't stand what I did, and don't want to elaborate. But we both at least have healed 95%.. a rough estimate.. -)<P>As far as keeping volatile posts, and not editing them out? I vote for letting them stay, shouldn't edit out people's true feelings. I get angry at myself when I see other betrayers talking about withdrawal and what they're putting their wife or husband through. Because I did that. And because I'm just now starting to like myself again, and I don't want to go backward.<P>Thanks again for caring, and I will check back now and again.

Hi, Terri, Roll me Away, WhoDat, Cl.<P>Thanks for the suggestions and help. What a great bunch o' people residing here (through not so great circumstances, unfortunately).<P>cl, I had an affair that ended over 3 years ago, my wife had one after mine ended. It was horrible, but we really are doing very well now. I thought she was going to divorce me at one point, but we worked through it. It's amazing how close you can come to that point and bounce back. We've gotten closer to one another than we could have thought possible, but it wasn't really on Harley principles. We're doing the Harley stuff now (plan a'ing one another to death!) and it's working out great. But most of the time we really don't try to work on the marriage, we let it come naturally. Give each other respect and get by with LOTS of humour. We like to slap one another over the head with a herring if the other gets out of line! For some reason, this whole mess brought us closer together. <P>I've been thinking and I don't think it's good for me to relive this too much longer. I can't seem to give advice because it just hurts too much to see what people are going through. When my wife found out about my affair (It's hard to talk about this) she basically said that was it. I worked to get her back, and she retaliated with an affair of her own. I don't think mind games are the way to go and some people (from what I've read) believe that trying to get back is a form of playing mind games. I just think it's a level of tolerance for what you can and cannot take. Neither one of us thinks that a person should take a cheating spouse, although we both went through it, we both put a stop to it. I can't stand what I did, and don't want to elaborate. But we both at least have healed 95%.. a rough estimate.. -)<P>As far as keeping volatile posts, and not editing them out? I vote for letting them stay, shouldn't edit out people's true feelings. I get angry at myself when I see other betrayers talking about withdrawal and what they're putting their wife or husband through. Because I did that. And because I'm just now starting to like myself again, and I don't want to go backward.<P>Thanks again for caring, and I will check back now and again.